Your immediate reaction... If any please

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I would say that it would strike me as odd, definitely. I ran into a similar situation with a co-worker of mine and his wife. I believe the wife was raised Catholic, but neither one of them is actively practicing Catholicism or any religion as far as I know. From comments they have made to me, they’re kind of hostile to Catholicism, actually. They had their first baby a few months ago and I came across pictures of the baby’s baptism on Facebook. 🤷 Honestly, my first reaction was puzzlement. I don’t think religion is really part of their lives at all, so why would they bother having the baby baptized? I’m guessing it’s a combination of force of habit/family pressures. As a previous poster said, I guess that they see it as something people are “supposed to do” without really considering that there is a deeper meaning to the religious ritual. I’m guessing there are similar factors at play in the wedding the OP described.
 
I’m not shocked. After all, Monica and Chandler almost got married by a Greek Orthodox priest when Joey was late!! 😃

Neither of my parents were religious and neither desired to establish religion in their home (Dad was baptized Catholic and Mom was raised Protestant). At the same time, they did get married in my mom’s church because it was important to her family. Also, my family holds to the tradition of marrying in the bride’s church, in the bride’s hometown. Though, I was exposed to Catholicism via relatives and educated in a Catholic school so I had believed I was Catholic (later formally became Catholic). I like to say my first culture shock experience was going to my mother’s Protestant church!

Also, what background is SIL from? I did go to Cherokee Nation a couple years ago and a lot said that they’re either their older religion, Christian, or some hybrid of the two. In parts of Africa, animism and Christianity are often mixed as well. Or it could be that the hotel suggested him and the dominant image of weddings in America is that of the Christian wedding.

And yes, Protestant ministers can wear Roman collars. I’ve seen Episcopalians and Methodists don them.
 
I attended a wedding like this a few years ago. The minister (not Catholic) went ON and ON and ON about how this couple was so “God-focused” etc. etc. They had been living together for several years and I know that their relationship had been sexual within the first few dates, so obviously their relationship was a little more “us” focused than it was “God focused.”

What did I do? I kept my mouth shut and prayed for them. :o
 
Neither of my parents were religious and neither desired to establish religion in their home (Dad was baptized Catholic and Mom was raised Protestant). At the same time, they did get married in my mom’s church because it was important to her family.
Your parents sound like my in-laws. They are not religious…not atheists or hostile to religion, just not religious. They didn’t raise my DH or his sister with any religion at all, which was really unusual in the Bible Belt. But they did get married in a Methodist church. Probably will be buried with a religious service, too. I think that’s kind of where religion starts and stops with some people. That’s how it is in a lot of European countries.
 
I was going to make a poll… but I see too many options for your answer… It will be obvious, generally, by your status, if you’re Catholic, or something else… I wonder if that has an impact on your reaction.

Scenario:

You attend a wedding. You know the bride very well. She is of no faith. She identifies with nothing in the Christian reaml. She believes that there is some higher power. She is of tribal like heritage. She can get into that sort of thing. But it’s nothing that she practices. She has not investigated any religion at all, nor cares to from all that you can gather. She is not an atheist. She has planned the entire wedding. And from what you gather. The groom had (nor wanted) little (name removed by moderator)ut.

The groom you sort of know. You KNOW that he is technically Catholic. However, in HIS words, the only thing he agrees with the Catholic church on is that homosexuals should not be allowed to marry. Everything else is of no concern to him. So, no, he is not practicing in anyway. Nor has he taken on any other religion. To the best of your knowledge. He was previously married, civically, and to your knowledge there has been no annullment.

After you are seated for the wedding, in a hotel, you look up to see a man dressed as if he’s a priest. Black slacks, shirt, and a white collar. You KNOW he’s not Catholic, as you’re NOT in a Catholic church…

The wedding begins, and every other word is GOD… JESUS… Lots of bible readings and verses. The Lord’s Prayer. (The bride and her family seemingly the only people that don’t know it) It’s quite religious.

So, I ask you, am I weird for thinking it’s odd for a couple that I know fairly well, who eliminates God from their life on lets say 99% of everything they do… to have a preacher of some unknown (to me anyway) denomination, give a very religious ceremony over one of the most important days of their lives.

And I wonder, do I think it’s odd because I woudn’t select a person who doesn’t represent me or my life choices to officiate my one and only wedding? And am I projecting my personal ideals???

I’m curious if you think it’s odd. …
Its odd indeed.

Just like its odd when people have their kids baptised and promise they will raise them in the faith, but never speak to them about Jesus, never make sure they read the Bible, never pray with them etc…

Or like when people let their kids have first communion when the kids show no interest, while the parents do not exemplify a life with Jesus, talk about HIM as a member of the family (yes I said “HIM”, not “the Church” or “the faith”.)

There are many odd things going on or maybe nothing goes on in the mind of such people or the people in the church who make no demands of them, and thats why confusion and indifference is so wide spread. .
 
For many people, I think the church, the priestly-looking officiant, and religious references are all part of what they’ve always thought of when they hear the word “wedding.” Even if they aren’t religious, they still have the traditional wedding imagery in their head and it’s part of what their dream wedding has always been. Also, up until the past 10 years or so, “non-traditional” weddings were uncommon. Everybody got married in a church regardless of how religious they were because it’s just what you were supposed to do. It’s only recently that non-religious couples have felt free to choose other options.

They also probably don’t realize how odd or even sacriligious it can appear to certain other people. Some folks get mad when non-religious people do anything religious. :eek: I guess they feel it’s disrespectful.
I agree… I think it becomes a fairytale, of sorts, to have a “perfect” scenario… but it becomes a mockery, like a puppet show…
 
I find that extremely odd. I never could label myself as something I was not. It looks like it’s done for the sake of tradition rather than anything else. It’s their business, but it is rather strange.

As a side note, the groom can subscribe to so many different religions if all he wants is built-in affirmation of his disapproval of homosexuals. Why choose the one that does not consider his divorce to be valid? Odd indeed, albeit none of our business. But I can definitely see it being offensive. Maybe it was a different denomination altogether?
 
This appears to be a matter of Other People’s Weddings.

Other people, whether of faith, or secular, should be granted the right to plan and conduct their wedding in whatever legal manner that they choose.

If their wedding is not exactly according to what you or I think it ought to be, then what business is it of ours?

The critical evaluation of someone else’s wedding is arrogant, hubristic, and judgmental.

Each of us may choose if, to whom, where, and in what manner to marry.

I think we become mean-spirited, if we claim the right to make these decisions for other people.

None of us is forced to attend a wedding we don’t approve of. We can stay home, should we not wish to attend.

If someone we know gets married, why not offer congratulations and best wishes, rather than make negative judgments.
 
This appears to be a matter of Other People’s Weddings.

Other people, whether of faith, or secular, should be granted the right to plan and conduct their wedding in whatever legal manner that they choose.

If their wedding is not exactly according to what you or I think it ought to be, then what business is it of ours?

The critical evaluation of someone else’s wedding is arrogant, hubristic, and judgmental.

Each of us may choose if, to whom, where, and in what manner to marry.

I think we become mean-spirited, if we claim the right to make these decisions for other people.

None of us is forced to attend a wedding we don’t approve of. We can stay home, should we not wish to attend.

If someone we know gets married, why not offer congratulations and best wishes, rather than make negative judgments.
And see, this is exactly how my FIL responded. Which is fine.

And I think you and he both misunderstood that it was NOT a CRITICAL evaluation. It was just something that didn’t register in my brain… The logic did not follow. But regardless, my words indicated otherwise to him.

I’ve known the bride since she was 12 y/o. She is really MORE than a SIL. Which is why I was suprised that she selected someone to officiate her wedding that does not represent her person in any way what-so-ever. Not that she doesn’t have the right to.

But see, that is lost.

So, I see for example you are Catholic. Now, If I KNEW that, and I knew you practiced your faith with the ut most care… Would it be jugdemental of me to wonder why you and your, let’s say, American Wife, select a Hindu Priestess to officiate your wedding. Pretty words and all. I’m just curious person. What would have lead you to do such a thing? Now, if we were merely aquaintances I wouldn’t even bother asking. I’d figure there was a reason somewhere… I thought I was safe asking MY FAMILY why she selected a preacher… But as you show… it was NOT safe to inquire.

I was actually pleased that God was recognized in their Union… but I suppose that’s judgemental too.
 
LOL… I like that one!

Sadly, I’m sure it won’t come up with ME again. It will likely, however, be told to SIL that I think she and her husband are pagans and that she was wrong for having a preacher. Even though I NEVER said that. Nor ever intended that.

I also know there is NOTHING I can do about this. Sadly, I’m learning there is no talking to them. I mean NONE. It turns out (as my husband recently explained) that virtually everything I say is considered an attack…

Mmm… this steak is good…

WHAT? How could you say that.

Isn’t that the prettiest blue you’ve ever seen?

WHAT? We take offense to that…

Yes, it’s that bad… I will learn this lesson one day! Soon I hope! As I’m sure to repeat it until I get it!

Thou shalt not speak in the presence of the in laws… silence will also be taken as an assult!
What is too bad is when the “communication channels” can be relied upon to channel ill-considered remarks to the person most likely to be upset by them, but can’t be considered as a means by which the upset person could ever dream of talking to the person who offended them.

There is only one solution, I have found: Speak, but always speak as if the persons being discussed were standing behind your chair. If you never say anything that doesn’t bear repeating to anyone and everyone, you can’t go wrong. If someone vents about another family member, always talk to them as if they are asking you how to go about getting along with the other person. Don’t let them build alliances against their target behind the scenes.

The great upshot of handling “family news conferences” in this way is that your family will come to trust you, because they know you’ll never bad-mouth them behind their backs and sweet-talk them to their faces.
 
If I were attending a wedding like that, I would feel very uncomfortable because as a person who’s faith is central to her life, I hate seeing anyone treat religion like it’s a decoration or something that can be taken out of and put right back into a box somewhere in the closet or basement. But, I probably would not attend such a wedding.

I’ve had to attend a wedding my mother had, once, with a UU officiator when she was not UU (and I had just left the UU faith to begin RCIA at the time, so it was awkward to say the least). I was advised that I should attend, as her daughter, in order to keep the peace in the family. Since then, I have realized that I will not do so again - I am loyal to Christ first, my family second.

I just find ways to avoid attending weddings and services that seem to be in conflict with Catholic teaching - ie, the wedding of a fallen away Catholic outside of the Church. I may just decline the invitation, without giving reason, or lay claim to a prior commitment (even if that commitment consists of washing my hair and going to Mass), or if I feel up to the debate, I may explain my reasons in detail. For the most part, however, I figure most people know me well enough by now to know that they should not invite me to a wedding - or anything - that is in conflict with Church teaching.

I would not want to give the appearance of supporting something that I do not support, and whatever the Church does not support, I also do not support.

in Christ
wayward
 
Riddle: Why are in-laws best buried 18 feet down when they die, instead of just six?
Answer: Because deep down, they’re *very *nice people.
(OK, guilty pleasure there. Mea culpa, mea culpa…and the sentiment can go both ways, I’m sure! :rolleyes:)
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

I’d heard that years ago but forgot it! A classic!!!
 
LOL… I like that one!

Sadly, I’m sure it won’t come up with ME again. It will likely, however, be told to SIL that I think she and her husband are pagans and that she was wrong for having a preacher. Even though I NEVER said that. Nor ever intended that.

I also know there is NOTHING I can do about this. Sadly, I’m learning there is no talking to them. I mean NONE. It turns out (as my husband recently explained) that virtually everything I say is considered an attack…

Mmm… this steak is good…

WHAT? How could you say that.

Isn’t that the prettiest blue you’ve ever seen?

WHAT? We take offense to that…

Yes, it’s that bad… I will learn this lesson one day! Soon I hope! As I’m sure to repeat it until I get it!

Thou shalt not speak in the presence of the in laws… silence will also be taken as an assult!
Here is a handy phrase that I have learned. It sometimes works better than silence in situations like this:

“(Judgmental statement by in-laws.)”

You: “You might be right.” OR, “Oh???” “Ohhhhhh…” “Hmmmmmm…you might be right.”
 
Replying without reading the thread, so as not to influence my initial reaction…

It does seem weird. I would not be surprised if the bride and groom were surprised, especially if they did not research or meet with the officiant ahead of time. There are so many non religious officiants out there, why choose a pseudo religious one?
 
Replying without reading the thread, so as not to influence my initial reaction…

It does seem weird. I would not be surprised if the bride and groom were surprised, especially if they did not research or meet with the officiant ahead of time. There are so many non religious officiants out there, why choose a pseudo religious one?
There are a lot of reasons that people who don’t appear to practice a particular religion choose non-denominational Christian officiants.

He could be a friend. He could do work outside of officiating at weddings that they admire. The person they wanted may have gotten ill or had a family emergency, and they got a friend of the orginal guy who graciously filled in. They could have gotten a list of officiants from their wedding planner, and he was the first guy on the list to answer the phone. Maybe they liked his name.

It could be that being religious or not is not something they care about much, but Grandma does, so make Grandma happy. It could be that they think Christian weddings are “traditional” or “romantic” or that all of the weddings they’ve been to are religious and so it wouldn’t seem like a wedding if nobody mentioned God. They may like religion and consider themselves deeply spiritual, but they don’t like “organized” religion…

et cetera, et cetera…

Let’s say that all of the “weird” things people do for weddings, like having one’s Siamese cat as a maid of honor or exchanging vows while skydiving, this hardly registers.
 
My immediate reaction?

I’d be happy that they might actually be opening up to Christ. He does work in mysterious ways - you never know what way He’ll use to call someone to Him.

I’d remember the odd reasons I had over the years to pray, visit churches, talk to priests, although I didn’t consider myself a Christian, and how all those things contributed to me changing the misconceptions I used to have about the Church ad slowly being drawn to Crhist.

I’d pray for them and be generally happy with the development.
 
Thank you all…

Your (name removed by moderator)ut has been quite valuable.

I think that some still think this question is about whether or not the bride is right or wrong about having a religious wedding when she’s not religious… no that’s not the question… I think the bride has the right to do whatever she wants within the law and certain reason.

Just to be clear…as mud perhaps… that’s NOT THE QUESTION…

The question is… would it strike you odd, if you new a person well, and in all your guestimation you would have NEVER expected a religious wedding, not in a million years, there were not parents or grandparents to cater to… to reason… EXCEPT perhaps, it was just some random decision with little thought given… so, would it strike you odd… odd enough to wonder? or suprised… or just unexpected…

Not whether or not you should wish them well, or congratuate them, determine if you should go to the wedding or not… or for that matter even suspect they are bringing Christ back into their life. It may be… But after all the nasty things said to me after asking FIL, I don’t actually think that’s happening… Could STILL be wrong about that.

This is a very dear family memeber. She is important to me. I would want all her wishes granted for her wedding… I wouldn’t skip her wedding because her beliefs are different than mine… but her selecting a religious wedding is going to be as off the wall as her parents selecting a rap singer who uses foul language to DJ their next party. One, in my position would be left scratching their head… THAT IS ALL!

LOL! In the end, I have certainly learned that questioning such things is NOT OK out loud! One should keep such questions to themselves… Even if one feels close enough to ask!

ETA: I’m remembering that FIL, father to the bride in this scenario… was VERY FAST to point out to all his friends that I’M CATHOLIC, and that’s why we were in a Catholic Church for his son’s wedding… 🤷
 
What struck me most in your follow-up story, Faithfully, is your in-laws’ indignation that “We are not pagans! What, did you think that we were pagans?” I wonder if, in spite of their confessed non-religiousness, they have come under the influence of Christianity. Now, technically, are your in-laws pagan or not 😛 (pagan as in never baptized)? Or, have they been baptized and maybe even received some kind of religious Christian education in their youth? Maybe, deep down, they are some kind of anti-Catholic, but nevertheless, Christ-influenced people? Just don’t ask them what do they believe deep down, or whether they have been baptized… 😃 Because, I know, deep down 😉 they are very nice people, but you wouldn’t want to see their reaction to a question like that! :eek: 😃
 
What struck me most in your follow-up story, Faithfully, is your in-laws’ indignation that “We are not pagans! What, did you think that we were pagans?” I wonder if, in spite of their confessed non-religiousness, they have come under the influence of Christianity. Now, technically, are your in-laws pagan or not 😛 (pagan as in never baptized)? Or, have they been baptized and maybe even received some kind of religious Christian education in their youth? Maybe, deep down, they are some kind of anti-Catholic, but nevertheless, Christ-influenced people? Just don’t ask them what do they believe deep down… 😃 Because, I know, deep down 😉 they are very nice people, but you wouldn’t want to see their reaction to a question like that! :eek: 😃
LOL! You know, I looked up the term Pagan, as it seems to have many different definitions. To ME, I nearly think a pagan is a satanist… but that’s not right… Which is why at first, I was WOW… I DID NOT CALL ANYONE TTHHAATT!!! In fact I asked a friend of my who is Catholic and Hispanic…she ranked pagan right up there with any racial slur she’s ever heard…

Regardless… FIL was baptized as something… he’s a bible belt child… and he in his own words “hates” church, and everything to do with it. His parents made him go to church and the second he had the choice not to go… he was done… The rest of the family, including my husband are not baptized in anything as far as I know. So by your def. Pagan… LOL! My MIL is Native American. And there are negative associations with “Christianity”. But she believes in God. She had always wanted some form of organized religion but just never felt right…

Anyhow… It’s possible any of them have an interest in Christianity on some level. They have so far attended at Church… our wedding, our children’s baptism, and just recently the children’s Christmas Mass that I invited them to. This also spured some questions they had… all seemed a good conversation. But it’s entirely possible that to them it was NOT a good conversation… I’m sure I’ll know for sure in about 5 years…

First communion is coming up. And of course, they will be invited to attend. I’m glad it’s still a few years off. So I can cool off… part of me wants them not to have AnYTHING to do with it…but I know that’s my anger speaking…

You are right about anti Catholic. I’ve not only endured passive aggressive comments about my person all these years, but pretty direct comments about the Church. Which I know for them is another way to attack me and my beliefs without attacking ME… but rather the Church…:rolleyes: They are usually KNOWING statements that are so far off… I’m stunned into near silence (which is an oddity in and of itself:D). Sometimes laughter. It probably makes them mad, but sometimes they say things so far fetched that all I can do is laugh… surely they aren’t SERIOUS!!! That was a joke, right???

FIL… made it very clear that the groom was NOT CATHOLIC… Ummm… at that point I was beyond annoyed. He was taking this personally and getting out of control. I said… Ummm “Sorry, he IS Catholic… but you’re right that he doesn’t practice.”

You know, I spent 9 years in a Catholic School, and I’m still blown away with things I should have known and didn’t. It would probably drive my in-laws insane to know that it’s their blatant attacks that have caused me to study up so I’m not so quiet when they say things that are clearly of the anti-Catholic rhetoric/agenda.

And so, I obviously have something to be greatful about with regard to them. I’m a stronger Catholic today… 🙂 Well, in some ways… This girl has lots of learnin’ to do! Biting my tongue among other things!
 
Faithfully, I feel for your FIL! 😃 I mean, just put yourself in his shoes for a minute! He, for whatever reason, really dislikes the Catholic Church, but his son finds a …a Catholic wife. :o Then, to make matters worse, his daughter also marries a Catholic man (even if not practicing). Poor man, he constantly needs to explain himself, “No, my son is not Catholic, he is only getting married in a Catholic church because of his wife”, “No, my son-in-law is not Catholic either, despite his fondness for rosaries”, LOL! Poor man, what a hard life! 😛

Well, if only he would face his bigotry once, but let’s not expect miracles. Anyway, it could be that he is not against God, he is merely against organized religion, chiefly against the most visible organization which is the Catholic Church, but he might be against other organized religions (Baptist, Methodist, whatever) as well. His wife might have had an influence on him? I’m guessing. Native Americans were apparently dealt many unjustices here in the USA, and I heard a Christian missionary who is Native American, say, that 99% of his people here in the USA reject Christianity because they have been mistreated by Christians. I remember when I traveled to the Smoky Mountains, the story of the Cherokee Nation being uprooted and forced to move to Oklahoma, a move they remember as the “Path of Tears”. Then, in the area of Monument Valley (Arizona), and Canyon de Chelly, I’ve seen documentaries remembering the genocides committed against Native Americans (Navajos) there. It almost seems like, wherever I travel, I hear more disturbing stories. On a certain level, I’m not surprised that Native Americans reject Christianity. Even down in Mexico, in 1531 when Our Lady of Guadalupe appeared to the Aztec Indian Juan Diego, they were on the verge of “civil war”. The Spanish conquerors treated the Aztecs very badly, and very few Aztecs embraced Christianity. In fact, they planned to raise up and wage all-out war against the Spaniards. But the prayers of the local Catholic Bishop Zumarraga, who has been praying for Our Lady’s intercession, for peace and the conversion of Aztec Indians, have been heard. In essence, it took a miracle, the miraculous apparition of Our Lady, dressed as their own, appearing to one of their own people, and speaking their Nahuatl language, to convert the Aztec Indians! But I digress. There may be historic wounds, historic sensibilities, which are influencing the attitudes of both your MIL and FIL.

Probably best to do what EasterJoy says, preach the Gospel without words, through actions.

I wonder, though, has your MIL (or your sister-in-law, for that matter) ever heard of the story of Our Lady of Guadalupe? She appeared in 1531 to a poor Aztec Indian, and sent him to Bishop Zumarraga, with the request to build a chapel in her honor, at the site of her apparition (which was Tepeyac Hill, where previously the Aztecs worshipped their pagan gods and practiced gruesome human sacrifice to the idols). When the Bishop asked for a sign, Our Lady told Juan Diego to gather the Castilian roses miraculously blooming on the hill (in the middle of winter, in an arid region that never had such roses whatsoever) and bring them to the Bishop. He brought the roses to the Bishop, and as he unfolded his tilma (cloak) in which he gathered the roses, there was the famous and beautiful picture of Our Lady, impressed on that tilma (cloak) woven of rough cactus fibers. Sorry if you already knew the story, maybe there’s someone else who never heard it! It was after this miracle, that some 9 million Aztecs converted to the Catholic Church, within less than 10 years.

Maybe you could share this story with your SIL?

It had a major influence on me, when I first learned of this apparition. I was searching for some supernatural meaning of the life, something that’s not destroyed by death, and I was dabbling in yoga, Buddhism, a bit of the occult. When I learned about the story of Our Lady of Guadalupe, I understood that God exists, the supernatural exists, and God didn’t abandon us here to our own devices. He sent Our Lady, to help the Aztecs find him, and to help them find the visible organization God instituted for our salvation, which organization is of course the Catholic Church.

With Protestants who are anti-Catholic, sometimes I think they frenzied themselves into animosity, without any real reason. I tend to think this might be the case with your FIL? With your MIL, the special circumstance of her Native American heritage could explain why she believes in God, but rejects Christianity.
 
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