Your thoughts on this miracle caught on tape...

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JaKael02 said:
I did a quick search on Caralina Rivas.

Nothing too positive showed up regarding her.

Three sources that claim it’s fraud:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visions_of_Jesus_and_Mary#cite_note-9
skepdic.com/rivas.html
skepdic.com/rivasdocuments2.html

I don’t know enough regarding her. But if someone is able to debuke the main claims of fraud. I’d be more interested in her situation.

Kindly, - James
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Looks like you just looked into the few detractors found online. I myself don’t consider Wikipedia a trustworty source. I am familiar with that skeptic site (not the Spanish version) and his stuff seems terribly biased and he leaves much to assumption and foregone conclusions, e.g., his reason for the wounds healing within 24 hours. :rolleyes: Clearly he did not watch the video found in the original post. He would, without doubt, react with the same level of incredulity with approved catholic visionaries e… Fatima; probably call it mass delusion…😃

Thanks for the feedback though. 👍
 
april32010 said:
then this is not an approved apparition?
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No, which was why I mentioned, in the original post: “Regarding the following, the Catholic Church (Vatican) has not made an official pronouncement regarding the event.”

I was curious as to what others thought. 👍 🙂
 
triumphguy said:
What about the plagiarism?

Here’s Cardinal Arinze on apparitions and seers.

youtube.com/watch?v=29f69elBzvs
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Could you expand on that? Are you referring to what Rainaldo said below, or the video? I’ll check out the video. 👍

“In her Renovacion Evangelica of 1996 she plagiarized from Formacion de Predicadores by Jose Prado Flores & Salvador Gomez.”

Quoted from here, I believe:

skepdic.com/rivas.html

By the way, she has the approval of her Bishop, René Fernández Apaza, who has given his imprimatur to her Messages:

IMPRIMATUR:
We have read Catalina’s books and we are certain that their only objective is to
lead us all on a journey of authentic spirituality that is based on the Gospel of
Christ. The books highlight as well the special place the Blessed Virgin Mary, our
Mother to whom we should offer our complete trust and love, as her children that
we are, and our role model in how to love and follow Jesus Christ.
At the same time as they renew our love and devotion to the Holy Catholic
Church, the books enlighten us on the actions that should characterize a truly
committed Christian. For these reasons, I authorize their printing and distribution, and recommend
them as texts of meditation and spiritual orientation, so as to yield much fruit
for Our Lord who is calling us to save many souls, showing them that He is a living
God, full of love and mercy.
  • Mons. Rene Fernandez Apaza
    Archbishop of Cochabamba
    April 2, l998
A scientist, a professor, and a former outspoken atheist discuss the
supernatural character of Katya’s messages from God.

youshallbelieve.com/?page_id=17
 
Rainaldo said:
I thought “imprimatur” means that the content of what is intended to be published does not conflict with Catholic doctrine.

I have never understood “imprimatur” as a statement on the validity of someone’s claims that one’s alleged stigmata or private revelations are worthy of belief.
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right and i have to ask,does the following apply,there are very good reasons for this ban to be in place.
Promoting unapproved apparitions and revelations (those not approved by the Church for private or public devotion) or alleged private locutions
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joe370 said:
Could you expand on that? Are you referring to what Rainaldo said below, or the video? I’ll check out the video. 👍

“In her Renovacion Evangelica of 1996 she plagiarized from Formacion de Predicadores by Jose Prado Flores & Salvador Gomez.”

Quoted from here, I believe:

skepdic.com/rivas.html

By the way, she has the approval of her Bishop, René Fernández Apaza, who has given his imprimatur to her Messages.
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I read his imprimatur: He says that what she writes has merit, and presents no obstacle to the faith.

I’m concerned by the plagiarism reports, which are not refuted anywhere.

My take on apparitions and seers is that I only have so much energy to expend and trying to figure out if something is real or not is a distraction from what I should be doing (living as a good Catholic).

Furthermore the Church has pronounced on some apparitions already - Fatima and Lourdes, and there’s enough meat there for the most inquisitive Catholic to chew on for decades without looking for the latest greatest seer.

Finally, no apparition - being private revelation - takes the place of public revelation (which closed with the death of st. John the Evangelist) and the magisterium and teaching of the Church.

We already have the fullness of faith and nothing Our Lady would say, or a seer can say can add one jot or iota to our faith. However, misplaced faith in a seer may detract or distract from the faith.
 
triumphguy;9630232]I read his imprimatur: He says that what she writes has merit, and presents no obstacle to the faith.
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I’m concerned by the plagiarism reports, which are not refuted anywhere.
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Keeping in mind that I leave final judgement up to the catholic church. Could you provide a credible source regarding the plagiarism allegations? I’ll give it a read, and get back to you. 👍
Finally, no apparition - being private revelation - takes the place of public revelation (which closed with the death of st. John the Evangelist) and the magisterium and teaching of the Church.
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We already have the fullness of faith and nothing Our Lady would say, or a seer can say can add one jot or iota to our faith. However, misplaced faith in a seer may detract or distract from the faith.
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Of course. 👍
 
april32010 said:
right and i have to ask,does the following apply,there are very good reasons for this ban to be in place.
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April, keeping in mind that I am not for or against the miracle reputedly caught on tape. I was just curious what folks here at CAF thought after watching the youtube videos. 👍
 
joe370 said:
Keeping in mind that I leave final judgement up to the catholic church. Could you provide a credible source regarding the plagiarism allegations? I’ll give it a read, and get back to you. 👍

Of course. 👍
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No need to get back to me. I’m not trying to convince you. I remain unconvinced however.

And having realized that apparitions *et al *are a banned topic I’d better stop posting on it.

See you on another thread.
 
triumphguy said:
No need to get back to me. I’m not trying to convince you. I remain unconvinced however.

And having realized that apparitions *et al *are a banned topic I’d better stop posting on it.

See you on another thread.
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I did not know that. I will ask the moderator. 👍
 
april32010 said:
right and i have to ask,does the following apply,there are very good reasons for this ban to be in place.
Promoting unapproved apparitions and revelations (those not approved by the Church for private or public devotion) or alleged private locutions
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I don’t know how CAF defines “promoting”.
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Rainaldo said:
I don’t know how CAF defines “promoting”.
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Yeah I’m a little fuzzy on how they define it too. I don’t consider discussing whether or not an apparition/miracle is real or fake as promoting it.
 
Tyuiop411 said:
Yeah I’m a little fuzzy on how they define it too. I don’t consider discussing whether or not an apparition/miracle is real or fake as promoting it.
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Some posters define it as “mentioning”.
 
joe370 said:
Looks like you just looked into the few detractors found online. I myself don’t consider Wikipedia a trustworty source. I am familiar with that skeptic site (not the Spanish version) and his stuff seems terribly biased and he leaves much to assumption and foregone conclusions, e.g., his reason for the wounds healing within 24 hours. :rolleyes: Clearly he did not watch the video found in the original post. He would, without doubt, react with the same level of incredulity with approved catholic visionaries e… Fatima; probably call it mass delusion…😃

Thanks for the feedback though. 👍
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Good point. The internet is full of b.s. Hard to find reliable data anymore.

👍
 
I have been trying to get my boyfriend interested in the Catholic relgion for years, showing him this, he is now searching further, I have told him about fatima etc to try to pursuade him, but to no avail, told him the scripture etc, all else has failed, I really think this might be working now he has seen a miracle in action, I hope and pray he comes home, even though its needed to be proven to him, at least he will be home when he comes around…this is why Jesus allows for miracles to happen i guess 🙂
 
dolphinlove said:
I have been trying to get my boyfriend interested in the Catholic relgion for years, showing him this, he is now searching further, I have told him about fatima etc to try to pursuade him, but to no avail, told him the scripture etc, all else has failed, I really think this might be working now he has seen a miracle in action, I hope and pray he comes home, even though its needed to be proven to him, at least he will be home when he comes around…this is why Jesus allows for miracles to happen i guess 🙂
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That is so awesome. 👍👍👍
 
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