Your top 3 things Islam should do to change it's image.

[Lance]

Karin:

I dont think that had anything to do with being a “Muslim” or any other faith. That had to do with how Middle Eastern Countries view the USA…so it was a political statement not a religious one.

I think it had everything to do with being Muslim. It was not only the middle eastern countries, it was Indonesia also. In Islam there is no difference between politics and religion. There was no rejoicing in communist China, Russia, Cuba or Argentina and none of them are overly fond of America. But we digress, rather than Christians throwing stones at Muslims and Muslims throwng stones at us I really want to know what Islam can do to change it’s image in the western world.

 

[Karin]

Lance:

I really want to know what Islam can do to change it’s image in the western world.

Why do they have to change their image? I have no issues with “true practicers” of Islam( Muslims) that I know in my town, state and my own family.
Nothing they do it seems will please anyone that is not Muslim…excpet perhaps convert to a faith they do not believe in.

 

[Lance]

Karin:

Why do they have to change their image? I have no issues with “true practicers” of Islam( Muslims) that I know in my town, state and my own family.
Nothing they do it seems will please anyone that is not Muslim…excpet perhaps convert to a faith they do not believe in.

They don’t “have” to change their image if they are happy with the way the world perceives them. However, if when someone mentioned abortion the first thing most people thought of was Catholicism I would be doing everything in my power to change that image. Lets face facts in today’s world when someone mentions terrorism most people think of Islam and I would think that moderate Muslims would want to change that image.

 

[Booklover]

Edris:

Maybe it’s my mistake, what i meant by free of sin, is that you are born with no sin or bad deeds on your record, till a certain age.

Regarding the Original sin, don’t u think that it denies our free will. If God gave us the free will to do right or wrong, then why am i held responsible for something i didn’t do, nor was consulted about it, Adam and Eve (pbut) had the free will. God didn’t force them to eat from the tree. Then why does he force their sin on me.

**The bottomline, if you believe God gave us the free will, then the whole concept of Original sin is meaningless. And if you believe that God didn’t give us the free will, then simply he can’t Judge us on something he forced upon us. **

No, original sin does not deny free will. Yes, I agree that we do not sin until we arrive at the age of reason. When Adam and Eve disobeyed God, sin came into the world and we’re all born with the propensity to sin.

God did not force us to sin, we chose to do so! Got tells us what we should and shouldn’t do, but he never forces us to do anything because he gave us free will! We can either obey or reject his laws. It’s up to us. Hope this helps.

 

[Karin]

Lance:

They don’t “have” to change their image if they are happy with the way the world perceives them. However, if when someone mentioned abortion the first thing most people thought of was Catholicism I would be doing everything in my power to change that image. Lets face facts in today’s world when someone mentions terrorism most people think of Islam and I would think that moderate Muslims would want to change that image.

I think that their view is (and please correct me if wrong) the only opinion that matters is Allah’s (peace be on him).
As to abortion and catholics…could the link be a good thing…catholics are against it and they preach and act (most of them) by church and God’s law regarding this?!

 

[Edris]

Booklover:
No, original sin does not deny free will. Yes, I agree that we do not sin until we arrive at the age of reason. When Adam and Eve disobeyed God, sin came into the world and we’re all born with **the propensity ** to sin.

 ah,  ok, now i got it  :o ,    so it's the "ability" to sin that we inherited not the sin itself.
      This is more reasonable

thanx

 

[Lance]

Folks could we please get back on topic? If not I will ask the Mods to close this thread as we seem to be going in circles and I am not getting any answers to my question.

 

[Booklover]

Lance:

Folks could we please get back on topic? If not I will ask the Mods to close this thread as we seem to be going in circles and I am not getting any answers to my question.

Sorry, Lance, yes, we have derailed the topic!

Vickie

 

[GregoryPalamas]

1. Eliminate Jihad except for internal submission to God…
2. Eliminate the Dhimma.
3. Take responsibility for the leaders its nations have.

If I say more I would be banned.

Islam as a phenomenon has some qualities but its own aggression toward others and its inability to inspire their own nations to be productive suggests that it has some serious problems.

Dan L

 

[Darrel]

Hospitaller:

And that is effected by democracy how?

Did you read the next sentence? Ancient England was under a dictatorship that allowed for all sorts of evil laws that embraced things like torture and public executions in the most barbaric sense.

In modern democratic countries people are allowed to live in freedom and this is the only reason it does not happen right now.

People never change, the only thing that is different is the law. Take Iran for an example. It’s doing the same thing ancient England did now. The only difference is that we are talking about Islamic law in government verses Henry the 8th.

-D

 

[Faith101]

MrS:

Is there some misunderstanding in definitions, perhaps?
While I can agree with the statement made, most of what I have been shown is that “innocent people” are those who follow strict Islamic rule. All others are infidels, and not innocent. Have I been mis-informed?

Yes, you have been misinformed. Innocent people are just that: those not guilty of a crime, be they jews christians hindus whatever.

If you dont understand a certain verse and would like to discuss it, please bring it up. thanks

 

[jcaz]

Okay Lance, here’s my go at it.

But first, let it be clear, that Allaah says in the Quraan:
“Today I have perfected for you your religion, I have completed My favor upon you, and have chosen for you as your religion Islaam.”

Islaam, as a religion, is perfect and in no need of change. I’m sure Catholics would hopefully feel the same about their religion.

Now, what can Muslims do to help improve the general publics’ perception of Islaam, ie, what can Muslims do to help the public understand the true teachings of Islaam? That is the question I will answer.

1. Have the media constantly interview these MILLIONS of faithful Muslims and their THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of events across America, thus showing to Americans that these events, which denounce terrorism and show true Islam, DO happen. Most colleges have an MSA (Muslim Students Association) and these groups have events all throughout the year. That adds up to tens of thousands of events throughout the year. Last year, when I was assisting the MSA here at the local university, we even called the religous correspondent for the newspaper (Orlando Sentinel) here in Orlando, FL, and informed him of all the events. We suggested he write an article, as the public would have loved to see such an event and here the words of true, moderate Muslims. DID HE WRITE IT? The answer is obvous; no. And that is very sad. Everyone knows there is a bias in the media, and that is just something Muslims have to work with. And Catholics also have to work with the bias daily. It can be very hard to change public perception when the main medium is the media, and they media has their own agenda. How many of those tens of thousands of events were reported? How many speaches denouncing terrorism were reported? Yet, was just about every terrorist act reported and smeared on the news?
2. Education. Muslims need to educate themselves first, then their families, and then their communities. Because with education comes liberation from ignorance. And these terrorists are extremely ignorant of their religion. No person would conciously commit an act if they knew it would put them in the fire of Hell. So people must be educated. And this education needs to come from the lands of Islaam, from the true scholars of Islaam…and this does happen in Saudi Arabia regardless of what the media tries to attribute to those schools. There are well known Islamic universities in Saudi arabic that “produce” imaams, if you will, and the teachers of those schools are the very scholars who write books upon books denouncing these terrorists acts. And mind you, these are the HUGE well-known Muslim universities. Now the media, on the other hand, they will try to tell you that these schools preach hate and that they do this and do that, that “they teach wahabism”. The media is only trying to serve its own agenda. NONE of that is true. These known schools are producing the very kinds of people that Catholics on this board would hope to have come to america and teach Islaam (these students are Americans).
3. After education comes action. Muslims need to then act in accordance with this knowledge they have been blessed with. The need to examine themselves and purify their actions. Knowledge without actions is useless.
4. After implementing this knowledge with correct actions, Muslims need to begin calling others to this truth. And by others, I mean Muslims and non-Muslims. Yes, Muslims need to then speak out against these so-called imaams who preach this hate and they need to be removed. And mind you, this is happening now. And also, please do know, that these “imaams” are only coined imams by media and others who want to inflate the power of their statements. There is not ONE true scholar of Islaam who supports these terrorist actions. Not one. Rather, all of them constantly talk about the sin and gross oppressiveness of those actions.

But the starting point of all of this is knowledge of the individual. And this knowledge must be sought after, implemented and then called to.

 

[Faith101]

Booklover:

And yet ordinary Muslims were out in the street cheering after the attacks. How do you justify that with what you’ve said?

I will try to explain. Living in America,it may be hard to understand the effects of america’s foreign policy on other countries…as ironic as that is. We generally only really care about domestic policy…and the price of gasoline angers us more than the thousands of innocent people in Iraq being killed. THe Media attempts to dehumanize them so we can sleep better at night.

Anyway, most of the rest of the world, especially the Arab world, believe that America is responsible for much injustice in the world. Because america is a “super power” they generally feel helpless. When bad things happen to the country that they believe does a lot of bad things to other peopel, its like “HAH! a taste of your own medicine”

Is it wrong? Yes, ofcourse. THe killing of one innocent human being is like killing all of mankind…as Allah tells us in the Quran.

It is easy to say “they are barbaric, animal, terrorist” when we are here having dinner with our families in a nice warm house with lots of food on the table. But how about one day you come back and your family is gone–dead. No police, no investigation, nothing. The murderer “gets away with it”…the feeling of helplessness and injustice is enough to destroy a person.

I am not justifiying…i just feel that sometimes we dont understand things because we have been so blessed here. And Allah knows best.

 

[Faith101]

Franze:

Faith101, can you explain to me, current exemples of good muslims practising true islam?

Actual examples of people? Those dont make the news.

In my own personal life, i know many pious Muslims, who are practicing Islam to the utmost of their abilities. If you live in the area, i dont mind introducing you to them and you can see for yourself.

 

[Hospitaller]

Faith101:

Actual examples of people? Those dont make the news.

In my own personal life, i know many pious Muslims, who are practicing Islam to the utmost of their abilities. If you live in the area, i dont mind introducing you to them and you can see for yourself.

The problem though, is that what constitutes practicing Islam to the utmost of one’s abilities seems to vary rather widely.

 

[jcaz]

Originally posted by Faith101:

Anyway, most of the rest of the world, especially the Arab world, believe that America is responsible for much injustice in the world.

Mind you, when Faith says the arab world, she is not talking about Muslims only. This includes arab Christians, as all of them are frustrated with American policy. And this is not limited to the arab world. Surely the people on this forum know that most countries are not happy with American policies. This may not matter to you. You may not care what others think. But at least be aware of it.

 

[Faith101]

Karin:

I think that their view is (and please correct me if wrong) the only opinion that matters is Allah’s (peace be on him).
As to abortion and catholics…could the link be a good thing…catholics are against it and they preach and act (most of them) by church and God’s law regarding this?!

I really like your signature Karin.

In many ways you are right. We only seek to please Allah and if we are doing that…then it doesnt matter what the west or the east or the north or the south think. SImply because some people will think bad of those who do not follow their faith, even if they dont deserve it.

However, what concerns me is that the Muslims are educated on their religion. That they follow the Quran and the example set forth by the Prophet peace be upon him. Only then will we succeed…otherwise, we will remain in the disunited state that we are in right now. May Allah guide us and keep us steadfast. ameen.

 

[Hospitaller]

jcaz:

Mind you, when Faith says the arab world, she is not talking about Muslims only. This includes arab Christians, as all of them are frustrated with American policy. And this is not limited to the arab world. Surely the people on this forum know that most countries are not happy with American policies. This may not matter to you. You may not care what others think. But at least be aware of it.

None of that automatically verifies the assumption that their complaints are justified.

 

[Faith101]

Hospitaller:

The problem though, is that what constitutes practicing Islam to the utmost of one’s abilities seems to vary rather widely.

Ofcourse it varies, because people vary. Some people wake up at 3 am and pray for 1 hour. Some people do the basics. Some people are able to understand the Quran at a much deeper level while others skim the surface.

What is your point? In Islam, we are given clear direction on how to behave and how not to behave. On what is pleasing to God and what is not.

Please, elaborate on your statement.

 

[Faith101]

Hospitaller:

None of that automatically verifies the assumption that their complaints are justified.

lol.

Its ok to critizise your countries foreign policy you know. Agreeing to everythign your country does is un-ameican and un-patriotic…it makes nodding cowards of us all.