"Zechariah 5:9" - female angel?

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Hi, What would this verse be talking about since not female angels? Please send me a good catholic link if you have one about this verse, so to share with a friend who said it might be a female angel.

Maybe those two women are demons with wings? Not sure…

Zechariah 5:9
 
I suppose these could be Angels with a female appearance, if it pleased God to create them that way. :rolleyes:
 
Angels are spiritual beings, thus they do not have physical forms. Thus they do not have genders. What do they need gender for? They do not get married nor procreate. Although I think it is possible that one may manifest as male or female. In icons angels are depicted without facial hair. Older males are depicted with facial hair and younger males especially boys are depicted without. Angels though are depicted as adults without facial hair, perhaps even intending to make them a bit androgynous precisely because they are meant to be genderless.
 
Hi, What would this verse be talking about since not female angels? Please send me a good catholic link if you have one about this verse, so to share with a friend who said it might be a female angel.

Maybe those two women are demons with wings? Not sure…

Zechariah 5:9
Er, why not female-form angels? In Zechariah, angels appear in a few forms, including those of horses (Zech 1:8-11), and, yes, women in 5:9. Being non-corporeal, they are believed to be capable of assuming a variety of forms (see also Ps 104:4), which does not in any way suggest that the ones which appear in male form are actually male.
 
Hi, What would this verse be talking about since not female angels? Please send me a good catholic link if you have one about this verse, so to share with a friend who said it might be a female angel.

Maybe those two women are demons with wings? Not sure…

Zechariah 5:9
I highly doubt it.

Then the angel who talked with me came forward and said to me, “Lift your eyes and see what this is that is going out.” And I said, “What is it?” He said, “This is the basket that is going out.” And he said, “This is their iniquity in all the land.” And behold, the leaden cover was lifted, and there was a woman sitting in the basket!
And he said, “This is Wickedness.” And he thrust her back into the basket, and thrust down the leaden weight on its opening.
Then I lifted my eyes and saw, and behold, two women coming forward! The wind was in their wings. They had wings like the wings of a stork, and they lifted up the basket between earth and heaven. Then I said to the angel who talked with me, “Where are they taking the basket?” He said to me, “To the land of Shinar, to build a house for it. And when this is prepared, they will set the basket down there on its base.”

I think we need to remember that our idea of angels with wings comes from popular Christian art. While cherubs and seraphs are described as having wings, the ‘messenger of Yhwh’ doesn’t seem to have such a trait. At least the implication is that ‘regular’ angels usually choose to appear in normal human form without appendages jutting out of their backs.

P.S. There’s actually a pun here in Hebrew: the word for ‘wing’ is similar to the word for ‘skirt’. So the reader is somewhat tempted to think that “the wind was in their skirts.” 😃 Also, note that the stork is an ‘unclean’ animal as per Leviticus 11.
 
The Haydock Bible says

Women. They often represent nations; and here the Jews understand the Medes and Greeks, who punished the Chaldeans. St. Jerome rather thinks that the Assyrians and Chaldeans are meant, carrying away Israel and Juda. Yet the former supposition seems preferable, as the woman in the vessel signified the wickedness of Babylon.

Father William Most says

The seventh vision is of a flying basket, an ephah, which is called a
measuring basket: it held a bit less than a bushel.

In it is a woman, who stands for all evil. When the lid is raised, she
tries to get out, but the angel pushes down the lid.

Then two other women take the basket to the land of Shinar - an old name for Babylon, the symbol of all evil - it belongs there. The house reminds us of a ziggurat, the kind of temple tower found in Babylonia.

St. Didymus the Blind says,

There is need to understand who the two women are. Note whether they can be anything else than the two vices, either actual transgression of the divine commandments or false views on ideas, as well as the evil forces themselves at work.
 
Thank you for all of the replies. I don’t have a problem with Angels being female. God and Angels have always appeared in the form of Male, even though genderless since pure Spirits.

Is there an official Catholic position on whether Spirits can appear as female human beings or not? For the replies so far, I am thinking no. I just didn’t want to pass on false information to my non-Catholic friend. I told him there were no angels, genderless spirits, that appear as females and he found me that verse.

It seems that verse can mean a lot of different things!

God Bless You!
 
Thank you for all of the replies. I don’t have a problem with Angels being female. God and Angels have always appeared in the form of Male, even though genderless since pure Spirits.

Is there an official Catholic position on whether Spirits can appear as female human beings or not? For the replies so far, I am thinking no. I just didn’t want to pass on false information to my non-Catholic friend. I told him there were no angels, genderless spirits, that appear as females and he found me that verse.

It seems that verse can mean a lot of different things!

God Bless You!
Angels appearing in female form does not make them female.
Angels have no gender.
 
Hi, What would this verse be talking about since not female angels? Please send me a good catholic link if you have one about this verse, so to share with a friend who said it might be a female angel.

Maybe those two women are demons with wings? Not sure…

Zechariah 5:9
…your friend must be caught in hollowood theology where Gabriel is played by an actress and where God uses a sinner who commits suicide to rescue the weak and fight demons… angels are spiritual beigns who take on the appearance of men… which could well be the case that some (as guardian angels) could appear to their charge as females… in either case the Bible makes no such effort to portray angels as gender biased beings.

Maran atha!

Angel
 
…your friend must be caught in hollowood theology where Gabriel is played by an actress …] in either case the Bible makes no such effort to portray angels as gender biased beings.
:confused:
Since angels have no gender, what difference does it make that Gabriel was played by a woman?
 
:confused:
Since angels have no gender, what difference does it make that Gabriel was played by a woman?
…I think you’ve missed the point I was making… it’s similar to the portrayal of Satan in the Passion of the Christ… people who see a movie tend to make connections and jump to conclusions based not on Sacred Writings but on Scriptures filtered through the movie’s perspective (as the shows depicting a mere twelve or so students in a classroom give the viewers–internationals–the impression that the US has a grand elementary - high school system!); my point is that there’s no need to search Scriptures to prove male vs. female angels!

Maran atha!

Angel
 
To resolve the issue of whether or not angels are genderless, I think we need only refer to Mark 12:25.

“For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels who are in heaven.”Mark 12:25 - King James Version (KJV)
 
It appears that some here are confusing gender with sexuality.
Angels “neither marry nor are given in marriage”, and since they are spirits, they have no sexual organs as we understand them, but that doesn’t mean that they are without gender. Gender is a characteristic of form, not matter, and God, Who is also a spirit, has made it clear in the Bible that His gender is male.
 
Cynthia,

Great point. There is an important distinction in language that has been lost: sex vs. gender. Gender traditionally referred to nouns; i.e. masculine and feminine nouns. Sex refers to creatures; i.e. male and female. Gender exists in language because sex is part of reality. In English, we do not have masculine or feminine nouns, so this understanding of reality has been lost. The ocean is feminine without being female, the Earth is female also, etc. Persons are able to have maleness or femaleness. That distinction, that complimentarity, does not depend on physical organs or procreation; it is part of the very fabric of reality, physical AND spiritual.

Just because angels are not given in marriage, it does not mean that they are not male and female. It just means that they do not marry. Interpreting Christ’s words to mean that angels are sexless would imply that we, too, would be sexless in Heaven, but our sex is part of our very nature.

C.S. Lewis’s book “Perelandra” depicts the sex of angels very well in a vision towards the end of the book.

Also, Peter Kreeft gives a talk on a related subject entitled “Sex in Heaven”. It can be found on his website or iTunes podcasts.
 
…your friend must be caught in hollowood theology where Gabriel is played by an actress and where God uses a sinner who commits suicide to rescue the weak and fight demons… angels are spiritual beigns who take on the appearance of men… which could well be the case that some (as guardian angels) could appear to their charge as females… in either case the Bible makes no such effort to portray angels as gender biased beings.

Maran atha!

Angel
Interesting… I’d like to see this movie. As for Gabriel, the Hebrew translates as “the strength of God”, with the word strength decidedly masculine.
 
Interesting… I’d like to see this movie. As for Gabriel, the Hebrew translates as “the strength of God”, with the word strength decidedly masculine.
…it’s an old movie based on Dante’s writings (I think); the title is Constantine with Rachel Weisz and Keanu Reeves–Tilda Swinton, as Gabriel.

…I agree that the Bible employs the male gender in most revelations… my question is, is this accidental or incidental?

Maran atha!

Angel
 
Angels do have male names, Michael, Gabriel, therefore lending more of an asscociation with masculinity. As some have said an angel can probably manifest as a female on earth. Scripture also says to be careful when interacting with strangers, you may be entertaining angels and not be aware of it… So I am entirely convinced that angels are very powerful, enough to change shape.

Wings on angels in art are designed to show that they have speed and the ability to “tread air”. That art concept took off and became the normal apendage of an angel and how we see them today.
 
Angels do have male names, Michael, Gabriel, therefore lending more of an asscociation with masculinity. As some have said an angel can probably manifest as a female on earth. Scripture also says to be careful when interacting with strangers, you may be entertaining angels and not be aware of it… So I am entirely convinced that angels are very powerful, enough to change shape.

Wings on angels in art are designed to show that they have speed and the ability to “tread air”. That art concept took off and became the normal apendage of an angel and how we see them today.
Fun fact: John the Baptist is sometimes shown with wings in Eastern iconography. “Behold, I send my messenger (angelos = ‘angel’) before your face…”

http://www.stjohnanaheim.org/images/st_john_the_baptist_icon.jpg
 
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