Zippy's Allegation/ Mary Magdalen

[Osage_Orange]

VociMike:

I said it was a common approach. I never suggested it applied to you in particular (especially since, unlike God, I have no idea who you are or what you think).

I just love it when somebody doesn’t read before they type.

I was simply referring to anti-Catholics telling “me” (in which I mean any Catholic) what I [or any Catholic] believes in without actually doing any sort of research or listening to the said person trying to explain his/her belief. I was referring to how people simply do not listen, which is ever so frustrating when trying to have a dialogue with somebody who holds vastly different beliefs (i.e. fundamentalists). Sorry for the confusion.

 

[jimmy]

VociMike:

I said it was a common approach. I never suggested it applied to you in particular (especially since, unlike God, I have no idea who you are or what you think).

I just love it when somebody doesn’t read before they type.

I think he was agreeing with you. He is a Catholic.

 

[MaggieOH]

chevalier:

I wouldn’t bet my lunch money on it. The list of seven capital sins was compiled by Pope Gregory the Great in the sixth century, so far as I remember.

From what I’ve heard, it would be either the name of the camp or of the town where the camp was located. But I’m not sure how much truth is in this.

Agreed.

Well I will bet one decade of the rosary for the lost souls in purgatory that when the Jews talk about the seven demons being cast out they are referring to what we know as the 7 capital sins.

Pope Gregory might have defined them but the Jews always taught of their existence: Greed, Lust, Avarice, Gluttony, Pride (at least I remember the names of 5 of them)

Maggie

 

[jimmy]

MaggieOH:

Well I will bet one decade of the rosary for the lost souls in purgatory that when the Jews talk about the seven demons being cast out they are referring to what we know as the 7 capital sins.

Pope Gregory might have defined them but the Jews always taught of their existence: Greed, Lust, Avarice, Gluttony, Pride (at least I remember the names of 5 of them)

Maggie

envy, pride, greed, gluttony, wrath, sloth, and lust.

 

[CreosMary]

MaggieOH:

No Mel Gibson is not a theologian as far as I know, what I do know is he had the Passion of the Christ thoroughly researched using theologians and Rabbi’s. The legionares of Christ were permanantly on the movie site as spiritual support and direction.
It is sad when our heads become bigger than our hearts. By the way I enjoyed Anne C Emmirich’s book on ‘Life of the Blessed Virgin’

 

[MaggieOH]

CreosMary:

MaggieOH:

No Mel Gibson is not a theologian as far as I know, what I do know is he had the Passion of the Christ thoroughly researched using theologians and Rabbi’s. The legionares of Christ were permanantly on the movie site as spiritual support and direction.
It is sad when our heads become bigger than our hearts. By the way I enjoyed Anne C Emmirich’s book on ‘Life of the Blessed Virgin’

As I said, I find Anne C Emmerich’s books extremely difficult to read. I have the book on the Virgin Mary and I just keep putting it down and have not got past the first few pages. That is how unappealing it is to me. It was a book that made me feel uncomfortable. I am not discrediting what she wrote. Some people like it and others do not. I am not under any obligation to accept what she wrote.

Now if it was something about St. Monica, the mother of St. Augustine, that is a different story. The last book that I read about her life, where the author used St. Augustine’s “Confessions” to write about Monica, I could not put the book down.

Also, I am not putting down the efforts of Mel Gibson in producing “The Passion of Christ”. All I am saying is that he is not a theologian and just because he has one take does not mean that his take is a strictly correct interpretation. The movie itself has not appealed to me because of my own distaste for violence. I have yet to sit down and view it at home. I think that I would prefer to watch it on my own at a suitably early time of the day.

As I pointed out though, I think that the Scripture says enough to point to Mary of Magdala being a woman with loose morals until Jesus penetrated her heart and she began to realize that she needed to return to her faith. There is also enough Scriptural evidence to point to her as being the woman who wept upon his feet and dried them with her hair. Also there is sufficient information in the Scripture to point to her as being the sister of Martha and Lazarus, and that she was restored to the family after her conversion and repentance.

Mary of Magdala is a model for women who have strayed into prostitution or other forms of loose morals. She is a sign that there is hope even for those who appear to be without hope. I have never seen her story as one that is a put down of women. I see her story as a message of hope for the lost within our community.

Maggie

 

[Church_Militant]

I’ll not be participating in this thread any further…the FACTS speak for themselves

http://pages.prodigy.net/indianahawkeye/newpage12/1.gif

If this was true then we’d all be Prots… not happenin’

 

[VociMike]

Osage Orange:

I was simply referring to anti-Catholics telling “me” (in which I mean any Catholic) what I [or any Catholic] believes in without actually doing any sort of research or listening to the said person trying to explain his/her belief. I was referring to how people simply do not listen, which is ever so frustrating when trying to have a dialogue with somebody who holds vastly different beliefs (i.e. fundamentalists). Sorry for the confusion.

OK, in that case please excuse my comments. You were just so accurate in your imitation I couldn’t tell you from the real thing! I too am sorry for the confusion.

 

[VociMike]

jimmy:

I think he was agreeing with you. He is a Catholic.

Yeah, looks like I goofed. Leave it to me to argue with somebody who’s agreeing with me!

 

[Lorarose]

Hello folks, I have got the book(Patrologia Latina vol. 76). There actually is a homily 33. Sorry to Zippy for saying there wasn’t. I will work on the translation and then post the latin with the english. It is a few pages, so I will need a little time to complete it.

Impressive work Jimmy!!
Do you know how to translate latin? Or do you feed it into a program?

Do you think Zippy might return if we wind up eating crow?

 

[Lorarose]

I am not discrediting what she wrote. Some people like it and others do not.

From what I’ve read, Catherine Emmerich didn’t write down anything.
While she has been declared a “Blessed” (is that right?), the writings themselves have not been approved.
Apparantly she dictated her experiences to the author, but it is difficult to distinguish where her words leave off and where his begin.

 

[mercygate]

chevalier:

Errr… is there any way to assert that Saint Mary Magdalene had or had not been a prostitute before she repented of her sins? And, even if she had not actually been a prostitute (the appellation “Magdelene” is said to have been made after a military camp), is repenting of prostitution so much different from repenting of immoral life? Unless you can assert that there actually was no immoral life in question.However, I seriously doubt any such statements could be positively proved. We just don’t know.

It is my understanding that only seven passages of Scripture have been definitively interpreted by the Church. Catholics are quite free to believe, for example, that the world was made in six days or that it was made in millions of years. Jonah either was swallowed by a whale and miraculously survived, was swallowed by a whale and survived via extraordinary circumstances shy of miraculous, or is a literary device. I see no reason to see that the almost universal understanding that the Magdalene was a prostituie in earlier centuries should not fall under the same latitude. Her status prior to her conversion does not touch upon any doctrinal matter.

 

[jimmy]

Lorarose:

Impressive work Jimmy!!
Do you know how to translate latin? Or do you feed it into a program?

Do you think Zippy might return if we wind up eating crow?

I can translate a little. I am in latin 2 so I know the basic rules and stuff. But, this is a little different than I am used to. The stuff we learn in class is a little simpler.

Well, it depends on what you mean by eating crow. I have looked at the latin and it is about Mary Magdalene. It starts off by quoting Luke 7;36-50. The quote she gives is also real.

But, zippy is complaining about it because she says he is trying to degrade women by degrading Mary Magdalene. From the way it starts off, it does not seem like he is trying to degrade Mary Magdalen. The homily is primarily about Luke 7;36-50, not the other passages.

I wil work on it though.

 

[jimmy]

I am going to post the beginning of the passage in question. This is all of the first paragraph. If anyone who is good with latin would like to offer a translation that would be helpful.

(It starts by quoting Luke 7;36-50 )

1. Cogitanti mihi de Mariae poenitentia, flere magis libet quam aliquid dicere. Cujus enim vel saxeum pectus illae hujus peccatricis lacrymae ad exemplum poenitendi non emolliant? Consideravit namque quid fecit, et noluit moderari quid faceret. Super convivantes ingressa est, non jussa venit, inter epulas lacrymas obtulit. Discite quo dolore ardet, quae flere et inter epulas non erubescit. Hanc vero quam Lucas peccatricem mulierem, Joannes Mariam nominat, illam esse Mariam credimus de qua Marcus septem daemonia eject fuisse testatur. Et quid per septem daemonia, nisi univera vitia designantur? Quia enim septem diebus omne tempus comprehenditur, recte septenario numero universitas figuratur. Septem ergo daemonia Maria habuit, quae universis vitiis plena fuit. Sed ecce quia turpitudinis suae maculas aspexit, lavanda ad fontem misericordiae cucurrit, convivantes non erubuit. Nam quia semetipsam graviter erubescebat intus, nihil esse credidit quod verecundaretur foris. Quid ergo miramur, fratres, Mariam venientem, an Dominum suscipientem? Suscipientem dicam, an trahentem? dicam melius, trahentem et suscipientem, quia nimirum ipse eam per misericordiam traxit intus, qui per mansuetudinem suscepit foris. Sed jam textum sancti Evangelii percurrentes, ipsum quoque ordinem quo venerit sananda, videamus.

 

[jimmy]

bump

 

[Lorarose]

Hey Jimmy!

Thanks for the update.
I haven’t a clue what any of that means.
I picked out one word that I think must mean “penitent” or “penance” - but that’s pretty much it.

 

[jimmy]

Lorarose:

Hey Jimmy!

Thanks for the update.
I haven’t a clue what any of that means.
I picked out one word that I think must mean “penitent” or “penance” - but that’s pretty much it.

poenitentia means repentance.

 

[mercygate]

jimmy:

poenitentia means repentance.

This passage isn’t degrading Mary Magdalene. It is comparing the seven evil spirits to the capital sins, and holding her up as a model of penitence. My Latin ain’t what it used to be but that much is pretty clear. Since Zippy brought this passage to our attention, it would be only fair play for Zippy to offer the translation.

 

[MaggieOH]

mercygate:

This passage isn’t degrading Mary Magdalene. It is comparing the seven evil spirits to the capital sins, and holding her up as a model of penitence. My Latin ain’t what it used to be but that much is pretty clear. Since Zippy brought this passage to our attention, it would be only fair play for Zippy to offer the translation.

That is my understanding of the story anyway - that the seven demons are comparable to the seven capital sins.

MaggieOH

 

[jimmy]

mercygate:

This passage isn’t degrading Mary Magdalene. It is comparing the seven evil spirits to the capital sins, and holding her up as a model of penitence. My Latin ain’t what it used to be but that much is pretty clear. Since Zippy brought this passage to our attention, it would be only fair play for Zippy to offer the translation.

That is what I have noticed but I am having a little trouble translating it. If possible could you give a little help?