Zombies and natural death

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It’s amazing how you read my mind…

Hmmm. I can personally say that I have not, since the aborted unborn will have expired without a chance for infection, but I can see how the desire for them to avenge the crimes committed against them seems almost ironic.
Again, i suppose it depends on the whole how the infection came to be. In Resident Evil Apocalypse, the zombies from the grave yard got up, some of them had been dead for a while, so perhaps infection can spread to the dead, perhaps via water osmosing through the soil and into the corpses?

Or maybe a woman who had not yet turned, but had been infected, aborted, and the infection had spread to her foetus, and once the foetus died, it reanimated.
But yeah, it is creepy…Just like that scene in DOTD with the baby…gets me every time. Ugh. 😦
Everytime I watched ER I thought about that!

But it raises another set of questions, can a zombie baby grow?
 
I was just about to say something along these lines. God would protect his church. He said that the gates of Hell would not prevail against it. I think zombies would easily qualify as hell on Earth!!

I liked the idea of the women incubating the frozen fertilized eggs. The only issue is, what if they have all gone bad because the power was knocked out?
Have you considered the possibility that the whole calamity could be the will of God, and it truly is the Endtimes? After all, does not Scripture say that the world shall go through a tribulation like never before?

If the Second Coming is that close, this would be the worst time, ISTM, to lose sight of the teachings of the Church and go loco, justifying all sorts of actions normally sinful, on account of trying to prevent the creation of one zombie.

:cool:
 
As a side note, and a morbidly creepy one at that, am I the only Catholic who’s fantasized about aborted foetuses turning into zombies and devouring the abortionists?
This kind of happened in the Vincent Price movie “From a Whisper to a Scream,” comprised of 4 short stories. The first story is about a man who murders a pregnant woman. The gruesome baby comes back to life crying “daddy! daddy!” and then chomps on him.

Blessings
(it feels wierd to include my usual sign-off in this thread :D)
 
Again, i suppose it depends on the whole how the infection came to be. In Resident Evil Apocalypse, the zombies from the grave yard got up, some of them had been dead for a while, so perhaps infection can spread to the dead, perhaps via water osmosing through the soil and into the corpses?
The zombies in Resident Evil were not “infected.” They were exposed to a re-animating agent. Two completely different concepts. 🤓
Or maybe a woman who had not yet turned, but had been infected, aborted, and the infection had spread to her foetus, and once the foetus died, it reanimated.
That is a highly probable scenario. But I think the cause is more sinister than that. If you recall, the zombies in “Night of the Living Dead” were afraid of crosses. Since Romero intended DOTD to be a sequel to NOTLD, and if we maintain the continuity, then we have to admit a supernatural cause to the malediction.
But it raises another set of questions, can a zombie baby grow?
If one accepts a purely biological cause, that is probable. On the other hand, we really don’t know what the effects of the virus would be on the pituitary gland, or the myotic multiplication of cells. 🤓

Of the fast-moving zombie type (which we’ll call Class A), I would consider it not only probable, but possible (I’ll explain why shortly). Of the slow-moving zombie type (which we’ll call Class B), I theorize that it is altogether unlikely. The reason is evident - the slow moving type obviously has a deficiency in mitochondriatic generation, which is the energy source of all cell function, including growth. On the other hand, Class A zombies exhibit abundant proof of healthy mitochondria. 🤓

If one accepts a purely chemical cause (such as in “Return of the Living Dead” series, “Forest of the Dead,” and the “Resident Evil” series), then it would be altogether unlikely for the reason given above. Namely, every chemically-based zombification has always resulted in Class B zombies, hands down (unless my esteemed colleagues can produce a reputable case study otherwise). 🤓

If one accepts a supernatural cause, then I am inclined to reject infant growth as well, but not for the above reason. The supernatural cause is no doubt evil. The dead body is a mere vessel. It does not chomp away for the sake of nourishment (which would indicate a necessity for the cells of the body), but for the sole purpose of causing death, destruction, and mayhem. See also, “Dead and Breakfast.” 🤓

If one accepts a biological + supernatural cause, as was the case in the “House of the Dead” series, then the possibility of infant growth increases once again, but not as high as for the purely biological cause. Again, this can be gleaned from the movement of the zombies in House of the Dead, which is like a drunk Class A zombie. We’ll call these “Class C” zombies. 🤓

Finally, we have our final category of zombies - those zombified by a physical alien presence (e.g., “Invasion of the Body Snatchers,” “Slither,” “Puppetmaster,” et al). We shouldn’t classify these on the basis of their movement/energy states, but rather on the 100% certainty that an infant from these types of zombies will grow, as the purpose of these alien creatures is to mature and reproduce. We shall call this unique species, “Class D” zombies. 🤓

Thank you for your attention.

Blessings
 
I saw above someone mentioned this problem could be solved from a self-defense viewpoint. That may be the best way to look at this.

What is the Church’s definition of self-defense? In law, we typically talk about three things: how imminent the deadly threat is, whether there is any potential for the victim to “retreat” from danger, and whether the amount of force used was the minimum necessary. If a bitten person is about to become a zombie, and that zombie will unquestionably pursue the victim regardless of retreat, and if the only way to stop a zombie is to shoot it in the head (or drop a piano on it, if you prefer)… then it seems killing a person prior to them dying is less of a euthanasia and more of a classic self-defense. In that case, whether it is a person or a zombie is immaterial.

(BTW, anyone recall from Zombieland the nun dropping the piano on the zombie?!)
 
cameron,
The moral analysis is fairly close to the legal analysis, in fact, I would think that like some other aspects of common law, the genesis was in the Church’s moral teaching.

But you have a huge problem with imminence here. Even in legal self-defense, correct me if I am wrong, imminence is distinguished from that which is possible, or even that which is *probable.

*There has to be some sort of indication of an impending attack, like a raised arm, a threat coupled with a brandished weapon, etc. A threat of *future *harm, or likewise a threat of *contingent harm, *wouldn’t allow for the justification of self-defense in law, would it?

I think that is what you have here: the threat of future harm, or, if you’d like, a contingent threat (“when I die I will become a zombie and kill you”). I don’t think self-defense works as a justification for killing someone BEFORE they turn.

Morally, I don’t think it would be allowed either. The problem seems to me that you would be directly intending to kill an innocent person, who isn’t a threat.

VC
 
Check this one out Whitacre Girl:

i.imgur.com/enGFf.png

It is an image, but it is an image of text – it’s a short zombie story.

VC
creepy. LOL

I dunno. I don’t really get into zombies who have turned by a contaminant, or who are self aware. I just can’t imagine a contaminant that could do that, or how they could retain sentience and engage in cannibalism.

I personally embrace the ideas of a virus. A mutation of the rabies virus, or something, which is highly infectious because it has overcome the immunities we have created against it. You should read Max Brook’s Zombie Survival Guide. It’s got good theories. THe only thing with that is, I can’t tell if the people who are really into it are serious or not. I personally get into the idea as a work of fantasy. A “How would you survive this” which doesn’t scare me compltely to death because there is a chance for survival. Although lately I worry. It seems that survival is often based on luck - where you are when it happens. Given that I am an elementary school teacher (or at least, will be full-time in a coupe years when I finish school) my chances aren’t good. Careless parents send their kids to school sick all the time. I’m fone for! lol
 
The zombies in Resident Evil were not “infected.” They were exposed to a re-animating agent. Two completely different concepts. 🤓
Perhaps. But the “re-animating agent” was the Tyrant virus, or t-virus as it is more commonly known, thus, “infected” since to fall to a virus is to become “infected”.

Of course, I’m a Resident Evil purist, I hate the movies with a passion. I base a lot of my zombie knowledge on the RE games and other non-RE movie sources.

In the games there are zombies that have become “infected” or exposed to the infection.

Long and short of it, once the virus has infected enough cells to increase its population to a high level, it uses other cells to produce energy, which then powers the motor neurons and the basic lower brain functions. The need to feed is based on those baser instincts and the fact that the virus requires energy, without it, the virus will begin to break down the host’s cells, causing necrosis and death. This is seen in the games, particulary the first RE when a diary of an unfortunate chap is found, it details his infection and the slow death he suffers as the virus destorys his body to the point of death and then re-animation.

Should the victim be alive at the time of infection there is enough cellular energy to cause a very agressive zombie once death has occured, though the chemical reactions from the cellular break down causes massive brain damage. But a dead individual who is exposed to the virus will only have enough energy produced to provide only the basic of instincts.

As for the rest of your post, I accept your hypothesis on alternative means of zombie classification and infection or exposure to re-animating agents. My expertise tend to lie in the Resident Evil game genre, with a sort of “minor” if you will in zombie movie lore.
 
There has to be some sort of indication of an impending attack, like a raised arm, a threat coupled with a brandished weapon, etc. A threat of *future *harm, or likewise a threat of *contingent harm, *wouldn’t allow for the justification of self-defense in law, would it?

VC
The thign with this sort of behaviour, in that you’d have warning of the zombie approaching you with an obvious intention to devour your flesh, if you had the ability to run, I’d suggest one does it. It’d be a gross waste of ammo to shoot a zombie that really is no current threat to you.

Of course, then you have the added moral concern, well, while you have the ability to run away, what if that zombie stumbles around the corner into an alley with school children who are unable to flee due to fear or being cornered?

It also raises the question, would we as a society have any warning? For example, would the media report “zombie related crisis” or would it simply fob it off, on teh govt’s insistance, that incidences of “biting” were results of drunken bar fights?

The infection would start out gradually, and then speed up when enough people had been infected to spread the infection quickly, and then eventually it would plateau, of course, at that junction there might be very few survivors left to fall to infection.
 
. Given that I am an elementary school teacher (or at least, will be full-time in a coupe years when I finish school) my chances aren’t good. Careless parents send their kids to school sick all the time. I’m fone for! lol
You think you’ve got problems? I’m a registered bl–dy nurse!! I’d be at ground zero if this mess hit the fan.

I did make it clear to one of my bosses once, that if there was a zombie outbreak, I wasn’t coming into work.

I also suggested to one of the senior doctors who worked on emergency management plans, that a “zombie preparedness plan” might be in order. I mean, with all these viruses like SARS, Bird Flu, Swine Flu et al, it was only a matter of time before the zombie virus perked up.

And see, at least these guys are taking it seriously:

examiner.com/x-16753-Zombie-Examiner~y2009m10d1-University-of-Floridas-zombie-attack-plan
 
You think you’ve got problems? I’m a registered bl–dy nurse!! I’d be at ground zero if this mess hit the fan.

I did make it clear to one of my bosses once, that if there was a zombie outbreak, I wasn’t coming into work.

I also suggested to one of the senior doctors who worked on emergency management plans, that a “zombie preparedness plan” might be in order. I mean, with all these viruses like SARS, Bird Flu, Swine Flu et al, it was only a matter of time before the zombie virus perked up.

And see, at least these guys are taking it seriously:

examiner.com/x-16753-Zombie-Examiner~y2009m10d1-University-of-Floridas-zombie-attack-plan
Wow, they are such good boy scouts!! (you know…“Always be prepared!” LOL

I personally have never played the RE games. If I can play them on PC I will play them, but I can’t handle the controls on a console, and this already makes a difficult game impossible.
 
I personally have never played the RE games. If I can play them on PC I will play them, but I can’t handle the controls on a console, and this already makes a difficult game impossible.
I’ve played on both and I’ve got them on both. And I agree with you, the console controls are particuarly nasty, I really didn’t like it when I tried the Gamecube RE versions.

PC is much more responsive.

Mind you, when teh zombies do attack, at least we can say “This is heaps easier than doing it on the stinkin’ Playstation!”
 
Look at all these zombie fans.I’m scared to death of them(bad childhood experience),but I just love the movies and games.Slow zombies ftw!
 
Look at all these zombie fans.I’m scared to death of them(bad childhood experience),but I just love the movies and games.Slow zombies ftw!
Actually, I became a zombie fan because I saw 28 Days Later and it scared the tar out of me. Then I started thinking about how I could survive an attack to make myself feel better. My husband showed me Shaun of the Dead, Dawn of the Dead, and a couple others to get me over my fear, and then I found I love the survival scenarios.
vera dicere:
Mind you, when teh zombies do attack, at least we can say “This is heaps easier than doing it on the stinkin’ Playstation!”
Amen!!!
 
I have no doctrinal insight to add that hasn’t already been brought up, but I must say -

I am very much looking forward to banding with you folks to survive the zombie invasion!

I can picture it now - magnum in one hand, rosary in the other.

:cool:
 
I have no doctrinal insight to add that hasn’t already been brought up, but I must say -

I am very much looking forward to banding with you folks to survive the zombie invasion!

I can picture it now - magnum in one hand, rosary in the other.

:cool:
WIN!!!

Why am I suddenly thinking of Wolfwood from Trigun?

 
Okay, you people are really starting to scare me.
In real life, I have had SOOO many conversations about what we would do when (not if) the zombies started coming.
And now this?
I don’t normally believe in signs, but WAY too many people have been talking about zombies lately.

First Rule - Cardio.

Okay, this is a toughie actually, I suppose if you know, or even if you’re pretty darn sure that you’re going to be attacked, you have a right to defend yourself.
I’d go with that.

Has anyone read ‘Cell’ by Stephen King? I hate that man. He writes like 90% of a boko, and then when it comes to writing an ending he’s one of those ‘I’ll let the reader figure it out’ type of writers. Um, I’ didn’t pay $7.99 for MOST of a book, Mr. King. I paid $7.99 for the WHOLE BOOK, so why don’t you put down your latte and GET TO FREAKING WORK WRITING A RESPECTABLE ENDING?!?!

Anyway, it was all about zombies. Then of course I had gone to see Zombieland, not only because I love zombies, but because my boyfriend, Woody Harrelson was in it. Never you mind that he’s stoned out of his mind. He’s my boyfriend, and I love him. 😃
 
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