‘A Catholic case for same-sex marriage’

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TheKingdomOfGod said:
Which you believe is to have children. By the same token infertile straight couples have no purpose in marrying? Should we ban infertile straight couples from marrying?
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So your finger is an eye because it can see as well as a blind eye.

The purpose of an eye does not change because it can not see.
 
TheKingdomOfGod said:
This reminds me of Aristotle’s laws of non-contradiction. X cannot X and Y at the same time. As you said a finger cannot be a finger and an eye at the same time, a woman cannot be a woman and a man at the same time.

That is why homosexuality is not sodomy.
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:rotfl:
You realize that makes no sense
 
Stephen168 said:
So your finger is an eye because it can see as well as a blind eye.

The purpose of an eye does not change because it can not see.
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So you’re arguing that an infertile couples should marry, not out of love, but because parts of their body have a set purpose?
 
Stephen168 said:
No I have not seen your argument at all
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You may not have seen it-

Firstly the Bible and God’s and his son’s most important message. Secondly my belief that the Bible contains mistakes, or at the very least wisdom which is plain wrong by any modern standard, because it was written by man and thus ‘homosexuality is an abomination’ could be one. Thirdly that religion should not and has not been used to freeze everything in time, it is intended to evolve with the times. Fourthly my innate sense of morality. Fifthly my prayers and conversations with God.

There you go.
 
TheKingdomOfGod said:
No, because we all have an innate sense of morality and would never do such a thing. Please don’t go down the road of bashing democracy.
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The Nazi regime puts the lie to these words. They legalized murder, torture, rape, and all other kinds of nastiness, and thought it perfectly moral.

Democracy has nothing to do with God-given morals, sorry. God does not run a democracy. The Kingdom of Heaven has God as its King.
 
TheKingdomOfGod said:
This reminds me of Aristotle’s laws of non-contradiction. X cannot X and Y at the same time. As you said a finger cannot be a finger and an eye at the same time, a woman cannot be a woman and a man at the same time.

That is why homosexuality is not sodomy.
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Sodomy is any sexual act that does not involve the vagina, so all homosexual sex is sodomy. This is the WORLD-WIDE definition for sodomy. I don’t know what you’re trying to say here, and it makes zero sense whatsoever.
 
Lochias said:
The Nazi regime puts the lie to these words. They legalized murder, torture, rape, and all other kinds of nastiness, and thought it perfectly moral.

Democracy has nothing to do with God-given morals, sorry. God does not run a democracy. The Kingdom of Heaven has God as its King.
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Indeed, God-given morals are innate within us. But God also gave us free will whilst here on Earth.
 
Lochias said:
Sodomy is any sexual act that does not involve the vagina, so all homosexual sex is sodomy. This is the WORLD-WIDE definition for sodomy. I don’t know what you’re trying to say here, and it makes zero sense whatsoever.
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I’m using sodomy as a broad definition for any sexual sin.
 
TheKingdomOfGod said:
Idoesn’t mean it anymore.
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:confused:

I strongly suspect that God is not revoking his law through you. It is quite clear on whether homosexuality is wonderful or not.

Also, do you mean marriage as in the holy sacrament? “For this cause shall a man leave father and mother and shall cleave to his wife: and they two shall be one flesh?” Wherefore they are no longer two, but one. What therefore God hath joined together, let no man put asunder."

A woman cannot be a father or a husband, and a man cannot be a mother or a wife. I won’t go into sexual practices, but these things seem to mean you can’t stretch marriage itself to fit another definition, don’t they?

I can in every sense understand somebody thinking that love is a good thing and that people living together in love is a good thing, and that we all sin so what they get up to is between them and God. I can understand you trying to be merciful and decent, but do you go as far as thinking this can be marriage as in what He has said we can do?
 
When a poster is claiming God has changed His mind recently - it’s probably time to quit the thread. 😦

His claim is truth itself can change to be untrue.
 
TheKingdomOfGod said:
Indeed, God-given morals are innate within us. But God also gave us free will whilst here on Earth.
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So how do you differentiate your views on homosexuality? How do you know it’s not just your free will choosing to believe what you’d like to believe? Especially in the face of all the evidence against homosexual sex in the Bible?

You say that you figure people either made mistakes, or God somehow changed His mind; yet you can’t point to a single shred of evidence to back those claims up. You just keep repeating the claims, over and over, as though they’ll become true if you say them enough.

Don’t you think there’s at least a possibility that your views are driven by your own will, and not God’s?
 
ephesians4 said:
:confused:

I strongly suspect that God is not revoking his law through you. It is quite clear on whether homosexuality is wonderful or not.

I don’t think he is revoking his law through me. I believe I am just understanding his law.

Also, do you mean marriage as in the holy sacrament? “For this cause shall a man leave father and mother and shall cleave to his wife: and they two shall be one flesh?” Wherefore they are no longer two, but one. What therefore God hath joined together, let no man put asunder."

A woman cannot be a father or a husband, and a man cannot be a mother or a wife. I won’t go into sexual practices, but these things seem to mean you can’t stretch marriage itself to fit another definition, don’t they?

You can stretch marriage to any definition you want in theory. I believe marriage is about love, not producing offspring.

I can in every sense understand somebody thinking that love is a good thing and that people living together in love is a good thing, and that we all sin so what they get up to is between them and God. I can understand you trying to be merciful and decent, but do you go as far as thinking this can be marriage as in what He has said we can do?

Yes.
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buffalo said:
When a poster is claiming God has changed His mind recently - it’s probably time to quit the thread. 😦

His claim is truth itself can change to be untrue.
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I never claimed that God had changed his mind recently. I am saying religion evolves with the time and that man wrote the bible so it may have mistakes. We have better wisdom available to us today than we did then.
 
Lochias said:
**So how do you differentiate your views on homosexuality? How do you know it’s not just your free will choosing to believe what you’d like to believe? Especially in the face of all the evidence against homosexual sex in the Bible? **

It could very easily be my free will alone, but I don’t believe it is.

You say that you figure people either made mistakes, or God somehow changed His mind; yet you can’t point to a single shred of evidence to back those claims up. You just keep repeating the claims, over and over, as though they’ll become true if you say them enough.

I think I’ve presented quite a lot of evidence.

Don’t you think there’s at least a possibility that your views are driven by your own will, and not God’s?

Of course there’s a possibility.
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