‘Witch hunts’ rooted in putting laws above God’s truth, pope says

[gilliam]

VATICAN CITY (CNS) — A heart that clings to the letter of the law is closed to the Holy Spirit and God’s truth, Pope Francis said at morning Mass.

Such hardened hearts often were behind the persecution of innocent men and women seeking to follow God’s will, the pope said April 11 in his homily during Mass in the Domus Sanctae Marthae, where he lives.

The history of the church “tells us of many people who were judged and killed, although they were innocent — judged according to the Word of God, against the Word of God,” he said. “Let’s think about the witch hunts or St. Joan of Arc, many others who were burned, condemned because — according to the judges — they weren’t in line with the Word of God.”

“This is the role model of Jesus, who, in order to be faithful and having obeyed the word of the Father, ends up on the cross,” he said.

cnstopstories.com/2016/04/11/witch-hunts-rooted-in-putting-laws-above-gods-truth-pope-says/

 

[Seamus_L]

Since he became Pope, I’ve never been able to understand why Francis so often speaks as if he believes the Catholic Church is dominated by traditional, conservative minded folks, when the reality is that liberal Catholics are now quite the great multitude.

 

[Emperor_Markus]

With all due respect, talk like this makes me nervous…I wonder if we are straying too far from our traditions.

Some of these “witch hunts” that we hear about in modern academia are inflated stories about isolated incidents. I recognize it is tragic that they happened, but I’m truthfully hesitant to believe these witch hunts were as prevalent as we are made to believe.

 

[R_H_Benson]

Since he became Pope, I’ve never been able to understand why Francis so often speaks as if he believes the Catholic Church is dominated by traditional, conservative minded folks, when the reality is that liberal Catholics are now quite the great multitude.

Agreed. While I agree with what the Holy Father is saying, I don’t understand the need for the constant chastisement of traditionalists who are already a small minority. Many in the traditionalist camp are charitable, loving people who do not fit the “pharisaical” stereotype with which they are constantly unjustly labeled. If the goal is the unification of the factions that exist within the Church, why the relentless assault on this group composed of relatively few souls? Doesn’t such constant, often unwarranted rhetoric only serve to further drive the wedge of division? Wouldn’t, for once, focusing on the positive aspects of traditionalism, help to heal the wounds? And lastly, it seems that if anyone is in need of correction, isn’t it the vast majority of the Catholic faithful who disregard the law in its entirety?

 

[zab]

Since he became Pope, I’ve never been able to understand why Francis so often speaks as if he believes the Catholic Church is dominated by traditional, conservative minded folks, when the reality is that liberal Catholics are now quite the great multitude.

Well, if you look at Pewsitter.com you will take note of the effect that the worst of the ultra conservative / traditional groups are having. I am NOT a liberal. In the 80’s and 90’s I as well as other faithful Catholics, had to endure ill treatment from the left. Now, what I see, is that those who are on the far right are causing the most havoc today. They have done this for many years, but they are now at the top of their game, misrepresenting the words of our Holy Father. They spread distrust and even hatred of our Holy Father, and speak of him and refer to him in a disrespectful manner. We need to pray for our Holy Father every day as well as all of our priests and religious.

 

[deaconjohnO]

Well, if you look at Pewsitter.com you will take note of the effect that the worst of the ultra conservative / traditional groups are having. I am NOT a liberal. In the 80’s and 90’s I as well as other faithful Catholics, had to endure ill treatment from the left. Now, what I see, is that those who are on the far right are causing the most havoc today. They have done this for many years, but they are now at the top of their game, misrepresenting the words of our Holy Father. They spread distrust and even hatred of our Holy Father, and speak of him and refer to him in a disrespectful manner. We need to pray for our Holy Father every day as well as all of our priests and religious

.

I am not seeing it this way. The Church steered for the most part by its attachment to academia. Catholic academia is dominated by liberalism it has been for decades.

 

[Lormar]

Agreed. While I agree with what the Holy Father is saying, I don’t understand the need for the constant chastisement of traditionalists who are already a small minority. Many in the traditionalist camp are charitable, loving people who do not fit the “pharisaical” stereotype with which they are constantly unjustly labeled. If the goal is the unification of the factions that exist within the Church, why the relentless assault on this group composed of relatively few souls? Doesn’t such constant, often unwarranted rhetoric only serve to further drive the wedge of division? Wouldn’t, for once, focusing on the positive aspects of traditionalism, help to heal the wounds? And lastly, it seems that if anyone is in need of correction, isn’t it the vast majority of the Catholic faithful who disregard the law in its entirety?

 

[tseleehw]

Yes, I have to echo other posters in this thread and say that I have never had an experience at three different parishes with these supposed evil, judgmental, traditionalist, arch-conservative Catholics ostracizing or shaming anyone for their moral behavior, lifestyles or actions. Is it perhaps different in other countries outside the U.S.? I’d like to give Pope Francis the benefit of the doubt, but I’m wondering if he’s imagining a problem where none exists, or at the least greatly exaggerating the scope of it? Or perhaps I’ve just been lucky. Maybe he was referring to clergy, specifically, which I would be less knowledgeable about.

I have met plenty of Catholics who think that every sin or heresy under the sun is just fine though.

 

[Crusaderbear]

Small in America, but in other parts of the world, traditionalists are the majority.

 

[Lormar]

Well, if you look at Pewsitter.com you will take note of the effect that the worst of the ultra conservative / traditional groups are having. I am NOT a liberal. In the 80’s and 90’s I as well as other faithful Catholics, had to endure ill treatment from the left. Now, what I see, is that those who are on the far right are causing the most havoc today. They have done this for many years, but they are now at the top of their game, misrepresenting the words of our Holy Father. They spread distrust and even hatred of our Holy Father, and speak of him and refer to him in a disrespectful manner. We need to pray for our Holy Father every day as well as all of our priests and religious.

I remember how Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI were spoken about by the National Catholic Reporter crowd. It wasn’t much better. But no one seems to remember that.

And speaking of spreading distrust and even hatred, that’s what many have done regarding the traditionals. Calling them names (“pharisees” is a big one) doesn’t help win their hearts. Not all traditionals are bad. As another poster said, many of them are very kind and charitable people.

And if some traditionals are acting up today, that often happens when someone has been badgered and provoked and antagonized. Sooner or later, rightly or wrongly, they lash back.

 

[zab]

I remember how Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI were spoken about by the National Catholic Reporter crowd. It wasn’t much better. But no one seems to remember that.

And speaking of spreading distrust and even hatred, that’s what many have done regarding the traditionals. Calling them names (“pharisees” is a big one) doesn’t help win their hearts. Not all traditionals are bad. As another poster said, many of them are very kind and charitable people.

And if some traditionals are acting up today, that often happens when someone has been badgered and provoked and antagonized. Sooner or later, rightly or wrongly, they lash back.

I remember, too. I personally suffered from those attacks when I was involved in detention ministry that was run by liberals (nuns, lay persons) who incorporated creation spirituality and feminism into all of their services. On two occasions I had to defend myself for two hours each time from attacks and accusations and lies that were said about me because I held faithfully to the teachings of the Church. But today, most of the attacks that I see and read in the papers and on the internet is from the far right. As I wrote earlier, these attacks have been around for a long time. And some of these far right groups were not without their own attacks against Pope John Paul II. Their influence seems to be gaining ground now from what I read. I won’t be misled by them.

 

[Lormar]

I remember, too. I personally suffered from those attacks when I was involved in detention ministry that was run by liberals (nuns, lay persons) who incorporated creation spirituality and feminism into all of their services. On two occasions I had to defend myself for two hours each time from attacks and accusations and lies that were said about me because I held faithfully to the teachings of the Church. But today, most of the attacks that I see and read in the papers and on the internet is from the far right. As I wrote earlier, these attacks have been around for a long time. And some of these far right groups were not without their own attacks against Pope John Paul II. ** Their influence seems to be gaining ground now from what I read. I won’t be misled by them**.

If their influence is gaining ground, it is because many Catholics are confused and disheartened by this papacy.

By all means, do not be misled by them.

 

[Nozzer]

Well, if you look at Pewsitter.com you will take note of the effect that the worst of the ultra conservative / traditional groups are having. I am NOT a liberal. In the 80’s and 90’s I as well as other faithful Catholics, had to endure ill treatment from the left. Now, what I see, is that those who are on the far right are causing the most havoc today. They have done this for many years, but they are now at the top of their game, misrepresenting the words of our Holy Father. They spread distrust and even hatred of our Holy Father, and speak of him and refer to him in a disrespectful manner. We need to pray for our Holy Father every day as well as all of our priests and religious.

I agree totally.

 

[Seamus_L]

The existence of such sites doesn’t change the fact that virtually every survey of what Catholics believe shows a Church that increasingly rejects Traditional teaching on marriage, divorce, contraception, homosexuality, ordination of women, etc.

 

[R_H_Benson]

Now, what I see, is that those who are on the far right are causing the most havoc today.

Could you give a few concrete examples of this, and how the “havoc” these people create is having a negative effect on the Church to the extent that it warrants the constant ridicule of the Holy Father?

Meanwhile, the progressive side of the Church continues to win “victory” after “victory” with rarely a peep from the Holy See.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

I don’t see anything different between Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict XVI and Pope Francis.

They all said the same thing and they all spoke from the position of mercy and compassion for the human race.

Those who have attacked the Pope’s, whether they be progressives or traditionalists, just aren’t listening.

Jim

 

[Neofight]

I don’t see anything different between Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict XVI and Pope Francis.

They all said the same thing and they all spoke from the position of mercy and compassion for the human race.

Those who have attacked the Pope’s, whether they be progressives or traditionalists, just aren’t listening.

Jim

Exactly, Jim!

The most recent example was the response on the supposed ambiguity of the Holy Father’s exhortation. It seems many totally missed the Love and the Joy his writing took its title from.

PEACE AND ALL GOOD!

 

[zab]

Could you give a few concrete examples of this, and how the “havoc” these people create is having a negative effect on the Church to the extent that it warrants the constant ridicule of the Holy Father?

Meanwhile, the progressive side of the Church continues to win “victory” after “victory” with rarely a peep from the Holy See.

I can’t speak for what others are experiencing in their parishes across the country. But our parish has come a long way over the years. Liturgical abuses have all been corrected. We have beautiful liturgies. Our number of altar servers has grown. And the boys are anxious to serve Mass. We have as many as 7 or 8 most week day mornings! We have a beautiful choir (choirs) that sing the psalms, chants and traditional hymns. Our pastor gives wonderful homilies and is not afraid to teach what the church teaches on the social issues of today like abortion, euthanasia, gay marriage. It is so different from the time we moved to this parish in the early 80’s when it was a more moderate parish and some feminist had their way with the pastor on certain issues. Our pastor makes sure that we have access to wonderful retreats and parish missions and that our youth have programs that are truly beneficial to their spiritual growth. I could go on and on about our wonderful parish. I have not heard anything coming from Pope Francis, “that warrants the constant ridicule of the Holy Father.” I admit that there have been a few occasions when reading headlines in the newspaper and online that raise my eyebrows, but after reading the whole story I get a different opinion. Just because we may not initially understand why he says this or that or does this or that does not mean that his words and actions warrant the out right ridicule and uncharitable reference to his name. If there were truthful reports of some unholy activity that our Holy Father engaged in, that would be of great concern. I have heard nothing to make me think less of him. He is our Holy Father, worthy of our respect. I shouldn’t have to point out that the people who listened to Jesus did not always understand the things he did and said either. Pope Francis is not Pope Benedict XVI nor Pope John Paul II. Thanks to Pope Benedict, we have gotten rid of all the previous liturgical abuses and we have the beautiful liturgies that we have today. Thanks to John Paul II we have all the Encyclicals that he wrote clarifying the teachings of the church helping us to have a better understanding of what we had always been taught but may not have fully understood. And, too, we remember John Paul II with his message “God Loves You!”. We respect the gifts that our previous popes have given to the Church. We should respect the gifts that Pope Francis has to give the Church as well. We should listen to what he is trying to teach us instead of listening to those havoc mongers who are trying to stir up discord.

 

[Darryl1958]

The greatest number of deaths and persecutions during the times of the witch hunts occupy the era when the Protestant Reformation came to the fore. The people of Europe at the time were a deeply believing people, deeply believing in the Church, and the idea that your neighbour could be acting outside of the Church was a real enough reality. People were naturally suspicious, and frightened too

Far from being the source of the persecution, the laws of the Church helped to moderate the excesses of the witch hunts, actually demanding some kind of proof, rather than succumbing to superstition, which is more typical of a frightened population in times of deep disruption.

 

[roseofshannon]

My experience has been the exact opposite.

Here is why I sadly have distrust:

My Dad had affairs and left my Mom after more than 40 years of marriage.

He lives on a golf course and she lives in a mobile home…you do the math. (He told her she wouldn’t get a dime!)

My Mom applied for an annulment but it was denied.

After seeing him and his girlfriend (the one he met in an “anointed moment”, not the earlier one which was “sent by God”) frequently at daily Mass, his pastor told them that since they are clearly in love he would marry them.

So the pastor performed a “Catholic wedding” for them at morning mass–without an annulment.

He has been a leader in the Church for many, many years and has photos of himself kissing Pope JPII’s ring and standing with Cardinal Ratzinger which he loves to share.

He leads a Catholic Men’s Bible Study, in his parish, gives retreats and brings communion to the sick.

As the patriarch of our family with many grandchildren, he is bringing scandal to my kids as well as many others.

I don’t think this new development from Pope Francis will help very much.

Plus I know many who were told by priests in the confessional that pre-marital sex, masturbation, and contraception are not sins and do not need to be confessed.

Pope Francis had an opportunity to promote Natural Family Planning when discussing the Zika virus but allowed for interpretation that contraception could be used instead.

No legalism and witch hunts here.

I love and pray for our Dear Pope Francis and all our priests, but I wonder where the call to repentance is?

In this year of Mercy it is well to remember what the Catechism says:

136 There are no limits to the mercy of God, but anyone who deliberately refuses to accept his mercy by repenting, rejects the forgiveness of his sins and the salvation offered by the Holy Spirit.137 Such hardness of heart can lead to final impenitence and eternal loss.