“Iuvenescit Ecclesia.” ANYONE?

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Letter “Iuvenescit Ecclesia” to the Bishops of the Catholic Church
Regarding the Relationship Between Hierarchical and Charismatic Gifts
in the Life and the Mission of the Church


A major document from the Vatican, issued in May this year. Anybody here familiar with this to comment?
 
Letter “Iuvenescit Ecclesia” to the Bishops of the Catholic Church
Regarding the Relationship Between Hierarchical and Charismatic Gifts
in the Life and the Mission of the Church


A major document from the Vatican, issued in May this year. Anybody here familiar with this to comment?
I am not sure what comment you want.

It’s from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

This is the text: vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20160516_iuvenescit-ecclesia_en.html
 
I am not sure what comment you want.

It’s from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

This is the text: vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20160516_iuvenescit-ecclesia_en.html
Thank you Father. Yes, I think you are the person, not excluding others of course.

A few things for starter.

I think it is a VERY major document especially as it spells out doctrine on this issue which has not been spoken of candidly before - that the hierarchical gifts (gift from the ordination) and the charismatic gifts are not to be opposed as they are complimentary to each other.

It seems to speak about the institutional church and the church of charity. The former as exemplified by St Peter, the first Pope and all the Popes after him; and the latter, perhaps identified by St Paul (?), who preached to the gentiles, and spoke about the charismatic gifts (1 Cor 12-14).

What do you think? How significant is this document in view that it is being given to the Bishops, about the two gifts?

And with the guideline/criteria therein, the Bishops can discern whether any church movement under an him has an authentic charism or not?

Is this a breakthrough by Pope Francis on this issue which seems to divide the Church for the last fifty years?
 
Thank you Father. Yes, I think you are the person, not excluding others of course.

A few things for starter.

I think it is a VERY major document especially as it spells out doctrine on this issue which has not been spoken of candidly before - that the hierarchical gifts (gift from the ordination) and the charismatic gifts are not to be opposed as they are complimentary to each other.

/…/
It’s a significant document. I wouldn’t get into a semantics argument, personally, over “significant” and “very major”

In form, it’s a document from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith that was ordered published by the Pope. Theologians were accustomed to 3 or 4 documents per year from the CDF but that hasn’t been the case in the pontificate of Francis. Like Dominus Iesus almost 20 years ago, this is a very needed document

It’s developing the articulation of Lumen Gentium 4 on the hierarchical gifts and the charismatic gifts with which the Church is enriched; it develops a treatment of those gifts and their interaction…specifically in the light of events and also the way things have actually developed in the past 50 years

A major issue has been the polarisation of the charismatic gifts that have been in tension with the hierarchical gifts. In point of fact, the hierarchical gifts with which the Church is endowed by her Divine Founder, are also charismatic. The apostles and their successors are imbued with gifts from the Spirit as well as the gift of the fullness of Sacred Order. Conversely, when the Holy Spirit imparts charisms, they’re not primarily for the sanctification of the individual nor amorphous but for the building up of the Body of Christ and have to be integrated into the Church’s operation. It is not that one is black and one is white, in other words

This has been a real issue with some of the new forms of consecrated life and some of the new ecclesial movements. They’ve presented challenges in terms of canonical structure, operating within the parameters of canon law, and especially integrating harmoniously with the diocesan structure

On the one hand, we recognise the work of the Spirit in giving new gifts and graces and indeed there are historic failures known to Church historians for falling short in that area.

However, at the same time, to have parallel structures and “shadow” institutions is harmful not only to the institutional Church, glimpsed at the level of the diocese, but it can also do harm to individual members of the faithful who can suffer because of inadequate oversight by responsible pastors (by which the Church in this instance means the bishops)

Frankly, we saw that with one famous group whose founder turned out to be a tragic and actually evil person; the groups which emanated from him had inadequate oversight, which would devolve especially to the bishop; their charismatic status gave them a certain de jure as well as de facto exemption that was, in the end, unfortunate

No less, imbalance in approaching the two gifts can lead to distortion in how one views the Church’s functioning…and one’s place in it

I can tell you that this document was a long time on the drafting table

It is, from my initial perspective, more theological than merely pragmatic – which, I think, is of greater utility. It is, if I may say it, not like a dressmaker’s pattern. Given that, it is also a document the fruitful implementation of which will require reflection and discernment…by bishops together with their presbyterates and their theological advisors

It’s also however going to provide very needed guidance to the new generation of the new ecclesial movements/new forms of consecrated life. In most instances, the founder or foundress has died. They are, of course, the initial locus of the charism. Mother Teresa of Calcutta, for example, was not only the repository of the charism of the Missionaries of Charity, she personified the charism and exemplified the charism’s manifestation or presence in the Church. We now have her second successor. Her spiritual daughters (and sons – there is a male branch) are carrying forward the particular gifts that the Spirit was/is giving to the Church through the life and vocation of Mother Teresa

Now, however, as the years are passing, the charism must stabilise itself and become solidly rooted in the life of the community and in the Church. It also must take stable root in their constitutions and the interactions with the dioceses and the bishops and the other institutes

I picked the Missionaries of Charity but this applies to every new religious community, new form of consecrated life and new ecclesial movement. So the challenge is on both sides

There are other manifestations of charismatic gifts that we encounter in the last 100+ years that challenge and are challenged by interacting with the Church as manifested in the person of the bishop of the diocese, the bishops of the world as they constitute together the college of bishops as well as the Holy See and these need to be addressed, too

As I assimilate the document, my focus has been mainly on certain aspects with which I have had my own experiences because of my own sphere of responsibility. I need to spend more time really processing the document at a higher altitude than focusing on the specific points that directly affected the work I had done – so that I can better answer questions about the document in toto

I do think it will be of great help to both sides…but, of course, as with most things like this which emerge from the Holy See, it doesn’t arrive in any place as an already built reality. It is, rather, what needs to be implemented on all sides to make a situation better. If you wish, I will come back to this thread after I have had more time to contemplate the text and, of course, do so with some of my confreres as we work through it together
 
It’s a significant document. I wouldn’t get into a semantics argument, personally, over “significant” and “very major”

In form, it’s a document from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith that was ordered published by the Pope. Theologians were accustomed to 3 or 4 documents per year from the CDF but that hasn’t been the case in the pontificate of Francis. Like Dominus Iesus almost 20 years ago, this is a very needed document

It’s developing the articulation of Lumen Gentium 4 on the hierarchical gifts and the charismatic gifts with which the Church is enriched; it develops a treatment of those gifts and their interaction…specifically in the light of events and also the way things have actually developed in the past 50 years

A major issue has been the polarisation of the charismatic gifts that have been in tension with the hierarchical gifts. In point of fact, the hierarchical gifts with which the Church is endowed by her Divine Founder, are also charismatic. The apostles and their successors are imbued with gifts from the Spirit as well as the gift of the fullness of Sacred Order. Conversely, when the Holy Spirit imparts charisms, they’re not primarily for the sanctification of the individual nor amorphous but for the building up of the Body of Christ and have to be integrated into the Church’s operation. It is not that one is black and one is white, in other words

This has been a real issue with some of the new forms of consecrated life and some of the new ecclesial movements. They’ve presented challenges in terms of canonical structure, operating within the parameters of canon law, and especially integrating harmoniously with the diocesan structure

On the one hand, we recognise the work of the Spirit in giving new gifts and graces and indeed there are historic failures known to Church historians for falling short in that area.

However, at the same time, to have parallel structures and “shadow” institutions is harmful not only to the institutional Church, glimpsed at the level of the diocese, but it can also do harm to individual members of the faithful who can suffer because of inadequate oversight by responsible pastors (by which the Church in this instance means the bishops)

Frankly, we saw that with one famous group whose founder turned out to be a tragic and actually evil person; the groups which emanated from him had inadequate oversight, which would devolve especially to the bishop; their charismatic status gave them a certain de jure as well as de facto exemption that was, in the end, unfortunate

No less, imbalance in approaching the two gifts can lead to distortion in how one views the Church’s functioning…and one’s place in it

I can tell you that this document was a long time on the drafting table

It is, from my initial perspective, more theological than merely pragmatic – which, I think, is of greater utility. It is, if I may say it, not like a dressmaker’s pattern. Given that, it is also a document the fruitful implementation of which will require reflection and discernment…by bishops together with their presbyterates and their theological advisors

It’s also however going to provide very needed guidance to the new generation of the new ecclesial movements/new forms of consecrated life. In most instances, the founder or foundress has died. They are, of course, the initial locus of the charism. Mother Teresa of Calcutta, for example, was not only the repository of the charism of the Missionaries of Charity, she personified the charism and exemplified the charism’s manifestation or presence in the Church. We now have her second successor. Her spiritual daughters (and sons – there is a male branch) are carrying forward the particular gifts that the Spirit was/is giving to the Church through the life and vocation of Mother Teresa

Now, however, as the years are passing, the charism must stabilise itself and become solidly rooted in the life of the community and in the Church. It also must take stable root in their constitutions and the interactions with the dioceses and the bishops and the other institutes

I picked the Missionaries of Charity but this applies to every new religious community, new form of consecrated life and new ecclesial movement. So the challenge is on both sides

There are other manifestations of charismatic gifts that we encounter in the last 100+ years that challenge and are challenged by interacting with the Church as manifested in the person of the bishop of the diocese, the bishops of the world as they constitute together the college of bishops as well as the Holy See and these need to be addressed, too

As I assimilate the document, my focus has been mainly on certain aspects with which I have had my own experiences because of my own sphere of responsibility. I need to spend more time really processing the document at a higher altitude than focusing on the specific points that directly affected the work I had done – so that I can better answer questions about the document in toto

I do think it will be of great help to both sides…but, of course, as with most things like this which emerge from the Holy See, it doesn’t arrive in any place as an already built reality. It is, rather, what needs to be implemented on all sides to make a situation better. If you wish, I will come back to this thread after I have had more time to contemplate the text and, of course, do so with some of my confreres as we work through it together
Your initial insights are appreciated.
 
This is so timely and of great interest to me, especially since I viewed EWTN’s Lenten Symposium presented both Saturday and Sunday this past week. Father Bramlage spoke in particular about the effect of the charismatic gift of healing as being efficacious and even necessary for evangelization and a manifestation of God’s mercy.

I had a lot of prayerful questions that have seemingly been answered by reading the document shared here today. The Symposium is nearly an hour, but I hope some of you may have seen it and can comment about it in light of this document from the Vatican.

I may, after reviewing it again, highlight some of the aspects that Father presented., such as his opening words youtube.com/watch?v=4R6eIpAb24o&t=8m50s
 
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