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Cal_Catholic
Guest
Demonstrators gather outside Sacramento-area high school where students were suspended for wearing T-shirts with anti-homosexuality slogans
Full article…
Full article…
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andzy
Guest
That’s just the beginning. Here in Europe, people have already been nearly sent to jail for speaking out against homosexuality, as it is considered “homophobic and spreading hate”. Soon some parts of the Bible might be forbidden on such grounds. And it’s not going to stop. And it is coming to the US, too.
L
Lance
Guest
This PC garbage is going to be the death of the nation. We are destroying ourselves from within.
M
mesquite_magic
Guest
On the other hand, do we want our students spreading hate for something that is not the homosexual person’s fault. If someone is born gay, that’s not they’re fault. It’s acting on their sexual feelings that is the sin, right?
Kim
Kim
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Riley259
Guest
They could have chosen more sensitive words and the statement “homosexuality is a sin” is not Church teaching. Homosexual acts are sinful but the disorder is not in and of itself sinful.
R
rpp
Guest
There was no message of hate. The only hate exhibited came from those promoting sexual deviancy.
D
deb216
Guest
Welcome to America, the land where the only sin is the judgment of sin. Everything else is okay.
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problemsSeeing
Guest
Is it the duty of any good person let alone a christian to hate? I agree with mesquite that hate is not the answer but as to whether or not a person is born gay or whether it is a personal choice i dont believe there is any conclusive evidence in support of either (though if something like homosexuality can be broken down into a psychological disorder then does not the whole of social characteristics fall into the same category?)
-Brick
J
John_Hiner
Guest
We should not let loose language confuse us. It is the duty of the faithful to hate, in certain senses of that word. Jesus hated the acts of some. We are all commanded to hate – as a necessary part of love of God. Consider these passages from the New Testament Scriptures:
If any man come to me, and **hate **not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. Luke 14:26 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
Itself remaineth alone. But if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that **hateth **his life in this world, keepeth it unto life eternal. John 12:25 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
For that which I work, I understand not. For I do not that good which I will; but the evil which I hate, that I do. Romans 7:15 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
Thou hast loved justice, and **hated **iniquity: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. Hebrews 1:9 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
But this thou hast, that thou **hatest **the deeds of the Nicolaites, which I also hate. Revelation 2:6 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
There are many more uses of the word “hate” in the Old Testament, many of which reflect parts of the Gospel that are still binding.
The Faith demands full emotional competence. Hate is one of the emotions that we must feel fully and in precisely the correct way. It is a dangerous but necessary emotion. We cannot be casual about understanding its nature or its targets. (We must be careful to understand the word “hate” were it appears above in the precise way that the Church understands it. We cannot accept popular meanings for an English word, when we are trying to understand the meaning of Scriptures and Church teachings understood and expressed before English was devised.)
Given all of this, we should not fall too easily into the simplistic and imprecise way of speaking favored by journalists and “activists” for various popular causes. Simple, thoughtless talk is the tool of the enemies of the Church, not of her children.
Spiritus Sapientiae nobiscum.
John Hiner
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goofyjim
Guest
We should hate actions not people.
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Riley259
Guest
Agreed. Good point.
R
rpp
Guest
J
John_Hiner
Guest
This is true, but only in a certain sense. I am beginning to discern that in modern English, this might be too glib a summary.
First of all, two of the verses that I quoted before say:
“If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea and **his own life **also, he cannot be my disciple. Luke 14:26 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.) The “hate” here is of one’s father, mother, wife, children, brethren, and sisters, and one’s own life.
Further, "Itself remaineth alone. But if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world, keepeth it unto life eternal. John 12:25 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition.)
These are not actions.
I think there is more here to consider.
Pax Christi vobiscum.
John Hiner
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goofyjim
Guest
There are three things that last: faith, hope, and love. And the greatest of these is love.
F
fix
Guest
I have a few questions.
- Is this homosexual group promoting that folks with SSA remain chaste or do they promote that they are “free” to act on their desires?
- Is promoting a message that is contrary to the goal of this homosexual lobbying group automatically “hate” simply because it is contrary?
- Does the assertion one is born “gay” somehow mean those who claim such are unassailable? I mean simply because one claims something does not mean the discussion gets shut down.
B
BillP
Guest
Name ONE.
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andzy
Guest
Ake Green, a Swedish Protestant minister was sentenced to a month in jail for “hate” preaching (against homosexuality):
cbn.com/CBNNews/CWN/091004sweden.aspx
He was later acquitted on grounds of free speech.
As far as I know, nobody has been actually jailed for it so far (that’s why I said “nearly jailed”). But I am convinced it won’t be too long until somebody is given a real jail time for defending Christian values.
And what’s maybe even worse, the EU is trying to impose its “tolerance” values on its member countries that do not support homosexuality, like Latvia and especially Poland.
J
John_Hiner
Guest
We should consider this question carefully, because I think the point is well taken in an important sense. This point is important because it helps us realize what our duties are and what issues we must defend.
I suggest that the sense of “hate” attributed to the “homosexual lobbying group” above is the same sense in which the word appears in the Gospels. That is to say: the sense of “hate,” which is something like “to disapprove and work against the goals desired by the other,” is what the “homosexual lobbying group” is seeking to make illegal – at least when the “other” is that group. Further, this same sense of the word “hate” is what the Savior directed us to do in passages like, “If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.” Luke 14:26. See also John 12:25, Romans 7:15, Hebrews 1:9, Revelation 2:6, and others.
This is not the emotion based and destructive sense of the word “hate” that is usually meant when people use that word. It is a reasonable and deliberate sense of the word, which in usual vocabulary might be called “opposition.” However, the deliberate sort of “hate” commanded by the Savior and the impassioned and uncontrolled feeling of “hate” which is the usual English meaning are related.
It has been a political tradition since the founding of the United States, and before, to support deliberate policy choices on which political parties disagree by emoting the members of parties and whipping them into a “frenzy of opposition” so to speak. In this tradition, “I hate conservatives” or “liberals,” “Democrats,” “Republicants,” “Loyalists,” “Whigs,” “polluters,” etc. are all too common. We also experience this connection of strong emotion and policy in time of war, when we “hate the Germans,” “English,” “Iraqis,” “Taliban,” “Terrorists,” etc.
As disciples of Christ, we are commanded to “hate” in the deliberate sense, but to resist the emotions associated with this ‘hate,” if they push us beyond the limits set by reasonable opposition to the evil which we oppose, or beyond the limits of love. In other words, we are commanded to “hate” in this reasonable and deliberate sense, but only in the service of love. We are permitted and even encouraged to feel the emotion of hate, but only in support of love and only in opposition to evil.
We cannot do without the emotional aspect of hate, because we need the strength it can give us in our struggles. The sense in which we must “hate our lives” is very intense. Our flesh uses many emotional weapons against us, when we are fasting, or doing works of charity, or called on for works of heroic virtue. Without emotional weapons such as hate of evil, few of us would be able to persevere in love in the face of such attacks. So, we cannot give up either the practice of “hate” or the emotion of hate, if we are to love as the Lord commanded.
This all suggests that we can neither deny that we hate, nor can we allow the word “hate” to be stolen and criminalized. Hate plays an important part in the practice of love. It cannot be a crime. We should oppose “hate crime” as a concept, and focus the political issues in a ways that allow the distinctions above to be made. Otherwise, living the Gospel will become illegal (again) and our ability to understand our duties under Jesus’ commands will become less and less clear.
Pax Christi nobiscum.
John Hiner
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GreenJeans
Guest
Someone more eloquent than I once said fascism is always descending on America, but always tends to land in Europe.
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