10 Pro-Gun Myths, Shot Down

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Good Evening Deus Tecum: I simply observe behaviors and do the math. There are patterns to behavior.

Thanks,
Gary
Nice to meet you. You seemed to suggest, though I will not scroll back to look, that 100% of people with the issues you mentioned will act out violently, and/or illegally, and if that is what you suggest, I disagree.
 
So for the woman in this story who defended herself with a gun against the intruder
usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/10/16449815-911-tape-shoot-him-again-husband-tells-wife-hiding-from-home-intruder

or perhaps this woman in Oklahoma who defended herself and her baby with a gun against an intruder:
abcnews.go.com/US/okla-woman-shoots-kills-intruder911-operators-shoot/story?id=15285605

Is it your position that society would be better off had they not had the guns?
Good Evening Shockerfan: Giving a handful of stories is anecdotal rather than statistical. I would offer the idea that the number of people who stave off gun violence with more gun violence are statistical outliers, and are little cause to foster or spread paranoia.

Thanks,
Gary
 
This offers no rationale as to why a law-abiding, responsible citizen should not be able to own a gun.
Good Evening Christus: I rather think that the burden of reasoning lies not with me, but with the ones who would promote the introduction of devices designed to kill people into a modern civilized society.

Thank you,
Gary
 
Nice to meet you. You seemed to suggest, though I will not scroll back to look, that 100% of people with the issues you mentioned will act out violently, and/or illegally, and if that is what you suggest, I disagree.
Nice to meet you as well Deus Tecum. I am simply saying that behavior is progressive, and did not suggest that 100% of such people are dangerous. However, having spent a good deal of time interviewing violent criminals, I can say with certainty that such phrases are thematic in their dialogs, and predictable. These people are also very cunning and have very convincing stories. Until you’ve heard them several dozen times. You may, however, keep company with who you like. I am just giving an account of who I personally avoid, because I have seen enough violence already.
 
Good Evening Shockerfan: Giving a handful of stories is anecdotal rather than statistical. I would offer the idea that the number of people who stave off gun violence with more gun violence are statistical outliers, and are little cause to foster or spread paranoia.

Thanks,
Gary
Gary,

Like I said to another, studies that I have seen on DGUs range from a high of 2 million times per year (Kleck Study) to some that go as low as 100,000. I found this article that also talks about the spread:
businessweek.com/articles/2012-12-27/how-often-do-we-use-guns-in-self-defense

Either way, they still out number gun related murders, so I don’t think that DGUs are merely outliers.

The question I posed is a fair one, if you are a person who seeks to disarm law abiding citizens. If you aren’t one of those then the question really doesn’t matter, but if you are, I would appreciate an answer.

Best Wishes.

Shockerfan
 
Good Evening Christus: I rather think that the burden of reasoning lies not with me, but with the ones who would promote the introduction of devices designed to kill people into a modern civilized society.

Thank you,
Gary
No, that matter was settled , in America at least, in 1791 when the bill of rights was ratified. The burden of reasoning rests with those who intend to change the law of the land established for more than two centuries which was proclaimed by our founders as a civil right fundamental to the operation of our republic and the freedom of our people. Nice try, though.
 
The original idea behind owning gus was to keep the government from ever raining tyranny down on the people. It also gives us a leg up if there was ever an invasion of any sort.

I also have to think of Washington D.C… What a septic tank. They have a gun ban. It hasn’t helped.
 
The point I was making goes to question of rights and equality within the community overall. How is the ‘common good’ served by laws. When the government determines policy, it should consider how the goal of that policy affects each individual persons rights and safety. Rich, poor, strong, weak, healthy, sickly.
The current gun laws *do *attempt to balance rights with safety though, as for example curtailing weapons rights for citizens with criminal histories. If one owns a gun and uses it responsibly, the public’s safety is not endangered. That person retains his right because he has given no reason for it to be revoked. The weak and the sickly also have the right to bear arms. The poor have that right as well; that is, the right to *bear *arms – not the right to be *given *one in the event they don’t have the money to pay for it.
Say we are speaking health care. The ideal would be to have a system that gives all people access to health care if they need it. Health care is a basic human right. We don’t say to people only those who are responsible with their health should have access to healthcare. We recognise that there are many conditions genetic (and self imposed within reason) that are worthy of treating regardless of the a persons private capacities.
Only in the opinion of some is healthcare a basic human right. Unlike gun ownership, healthcare is a service, and the idea that someone is entitled to another person’s labor without paying for it is quite a debatable subject; hence, the uproar over Obamacare. I understand you may be theorizing about universal rights in abstract terms, but this analogy doesn’t align with the subject of protection of life. Guns protect the life of the individual from an external threat; healthcare prolongs the life of the individual who is ill.

The right to bear arms is granted to American citizens because it affords people the opportunity to defend their lives and property - at their own expense and to their own capabilities. Everyone has the right to preserve their lives in ways that do not infringe upon the rights of others and do not take from others. For some people, self-protection might entail installing a security system in their homes or cars. For others, it may mean getting a really big dog. And for others, it means possessing a gun.

If you think about it, your argument that *everyone *– rich or poor – deserves equal access to gun ownership would no longer hold up if the laws meant to restrict the ownership of civilians were enacted while the very same politicians who wrote those laws walked around with armed bodyguards. That, in essence, would be an affirmation that the safety of public officials is paramount to those of us who don’t have such prestigious government jobs.
Likewise, personal safety. Everyone should have equal access to means for safety within governmental policy. If you are saying put a gun into the hands of qualifying people in order that they can feel and be safe, but let those who don’t qualify take care of themselves, that is a fundamentally unfair system.
Again, every adult *does *qualify for gun ownership, barring contingencies. It’s people who have already harmed others run that the risk of having this access taken away. And justly so.
It means far more guns in the community to be turned on innocent people making far greater danger for the weak and vulnerable than if no one was allowed guns. It is a fact that can’t be denied that more guns means more violent gun crimes by virtue of the availability of guns. The strong get stronger the weak get weaker by such a philosophy.
I have to resurrect the counter-argument that is always brought up, and yet which is seldom addressed by the gun control crowd: Criminals who want to use guns will get their hands on them regardless of whether they have allowance. Revoking the right for the “weak” - AKA: responsible and law-abiding - to own a gun is what deliberately creates an environment in which the lawless run amok and the innocent have no comparative method with which to defend themselves.
Why should we tourists be vulnerable to your criminals with guns? * You *are safe walking down the street with your concealed weapons but what about the tourists who are left to throw their luggage at the gunman or die? Fair. Not at all.
Tourists shouldn’t be vulnerable – that’s why I usually tell them to stay away from dangerous neighborhoods when they are visiting. The U.S. government’s duty is not to extend all rights to foreign nationals, regardless of how unfair it might seem.
Mind you if I did come to the US, I’d bring a ‘that’s not a knife. This is a knife’ with me. :cool:
I would literally pay to see that. Extra points if you threaten a would-be offender while wearing a crocodile tooth-studded hat! 😃
 
Amen. Most everyday objects could be used as an “assault weapon” (that is, something you use to attack someone with). School kids have scissors and pencils at arm’s length, which could be used as shivs. And you can buy all the bomb-making components used by Timothy McVeigh at Walmart without any restrictions (heck, you could buy bleach, an axe, and trash bags all in the same purchase).
Let me know the last time someone killed 30 people in one incident with scissors or pencils (or bats or knives, for that matter). This whole line of agrument is ludicrous in the extreme; everyone knows deep down that firearms are capable of killing on a larger scale and with much more speed, precision and facility (ease) than any other weapon. Yes, that includes motor vehicles and bombs (notice the words “precision” and “facility”). That is exactly why anti-gun control advocates are so vehement in their opposition. The possession of guns gives them a sense of power that nothing else does.
 
Question for Mr. Sock and others here who agree with him:
What do you propose? How do you interpret the 2nd Amendment- given that SCOTUS has always interpreted it strictly?

I also want to point out the obvious: Mother Jones, which has compiled these “statistics,” is a far left magazine and anything appearing in their magazine is certainly biased.
 
Thank you so much for your concern! I have a psychiatrist who I see regularly. I have also been hospitalized several times, but what a joke! No therapy for the suicidal thoughts whatsoever! They just changed my meds and sent me home.

LOVE! ❤️
That is unfortunate- prayers for you!🙂
Having lost a family member recently who was in treatment, I have come to agree with the Scientologists on this one point- psychiatry is an industry of death. It is a poor substitute for spiritual healing and the freewheeling prescription of powerful psychotropic drugs by these so called “healers” is appalling.
 
Let me know the last time someone killed 30 people in one incident with scissors or pencils (or bats or knives, for that matter). This whole line of agrument is ludicrous in the extreme; everyone knows deep down that firearms are capable of killing on a larger scale and with much more speed, precision and facility (ease) than any other weapon. Yes, that includes motor vehicles and bombs (notice the words “precision” and “facility”). That is exactly why anti-gun control advocates are so vehement in their opposition. The possession of guns gives them a sense of power that nothing else does.
Much of what you say regarding the power and precision of firearms is true, which is why the bill of rights prohibits the state and its agents from holding a monopoly on them against its sovereigns.
 
Much of what you say regarding the power and precision of firearms is true, which is why the bill of rights prohibits the state and its agents from holding a monopoly on them against its sovereigns.
Yes and thank you for bringing up the Bill of Rights Inego, something which the socialist Mother Jones writer studiously avoids (I don’t know for a fact that the writer is a socialist but it’s a safe assumption considering that Mother Jones is named for a socialist agitator and promotes the socialist agenda).

At any rate, the Bill of Rights is either sacrosanct or it isn’t. As soon as we start talking about doing away with one of the first ten amendments, it’s relatively easy to start talking about doing away with the others, including freedom of religion.
 
Question for Mr. Sock and others here who agree with him:
What do you propose? How do you interpret the 2nd Amendment- given that SCOTUS has always interpreted it strictly?

I also want to point out the obvious: Mother Jones, which has compiled these “statistics,” is a far left magazine and anything appearing in their magazine is certainly biased.
They certainly do not list good references for their statistics. This is why I believe we need trusted, neutral researchers to prepare an honest list of both the negative and positive aspects of owning a gun. Anybody wanting to own a gun should be able to weigh the pros and cons. Right now the mass media and NRA seem to be presenting only the positive aspects and scarring people into thinking they may be a victim of a violent crime, which is rather low in probability.

I personally agree with many of the statistics on the potential negative consequences of gun ownership because they are consistent with what I learned when studying gun ownership at the School of Public Health at UCLA.

LOVE! ❤️
 
What caliber handgun did Cain kill Abel with? It seems that the problem might just be with the human heart, huh? **Matthew 15:19, Mark 7:21
**
So, why is it that rather than addressing the human heart, we seek a physical solution to a spiritual problem? Bishop Morlino addresses the source of the problem: isthmuscatholic.org/resources/media/448/
You’re twisting my post somewhat. It was meant as asking a fellow poster to include handgun homicides into his analysis. But I wholeheartedly agree that the real problem is spiritual, and this is why many people should not own a gun. The statistics are clear that guns are FAR more likely to be used in committing a homicide than are other methods. Statistics also show that domestic suicides and murders are very common.

LOVE! ❤️
 
You’re twisting my post somewhat. It was meant as asking a fellow poster to include handgun homicides into his analysis. But I wholeheartedly agree that the real problem is spiritual, and this is why many people should not own a gun. The statistics are clear that guns are FAR more likely to be used in committing a homicide than are other methods. Statistics also show that domestic suicides and murders are very common.

LOVE! ❤️
Twisting? Seeking a physical solution to a spiritual problem strikes me as twisting (reality).

We can save over 3X as many lives by banning cars. 30,000+ deaths per year - no guns required. Remember: cars are already taxed, regulated and licensed. So are the drivers. None of that saves even a single one of those 30,000. Clearly, cars must be banned.

I’ll bet you use one. Thus, you are a potential killer. But, no problem, as it would be accidental.

Did you even bother to listen to Bishop Morlino?

Please do.
 
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