2 Corinthians 10:3-5 and Pacifism?

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“…Indeed, we live as human beings, but we do not wage war according to human standards; for the weapons of our warfare are not the weapons of the world, but they have divine power to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle raised up against the knowledge of God, and we take every thought captive to obey Christ…”

- 2 Corinthians 10:3 5

I have read Bible commentaries on this verse which seem to suggest that it is supportive of pacifism. Is it pacifistic? Or is it merely saying that that the faith should never be forced upon others but spread simply through reasoned arguement and debate?

What do you think?
 
Okay, let’s look at the context.

Paul starts out the passage begging people [to do something] by Christ’s meekness and gentleness. There’s an aside pointing out that he’s gentle with them when he’s with them, but speaks more boldly and plainly in his letters from far away. He begs that God forbid he be as bold toward them as he proposes to be against those who think Christians “walk according to the flesh.” [Because Christians are now living new lives in God, not just in the flesh.]

The passage goes on to explain that all Christians are engaged in a struggle of prayer and action to fight demons and their own flesh and bad thoughts, as soldiers of God, with supernatural weapons (Baptism, prayer, fasting, et al). They do not do this by their own strength (the flesh), but by God being now part of them.

This doesn’t mean that Christians only do that; it doesn’t mean they don’t eat, drink, get married, do business, or serve as soldiers, for that matter. It means that a Christian’s most important business is to serve God as a Christian, living as God commands (including keeping control of one’s thoughts), and that one should always be ready to fight spiritual battles by doing their duty as Christians (including prayer, et al).

Paul then goes on to say that people who are impressed by his letters but not impressed by his lack of personal charisma should grow the heck up, and realize that he’s the same guy either way, even if he’s better-looking as a writer than in person. 🙂

There’s not really a darned thing in here about pacifism, soldiers, battlefields, etc.
 
“…Indeed, we live as human beings, but we do not wage war according to human standards; for the weapons of our warfare are not the weapons of the world, but they have divine power to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments and every proud obstacle raised up against the knowledge of God, and we take every thought captive to obey Christ…”

- 2 Corinthians 10:3 5

I have read Bible commentaries on this verse which seem to suggest that it is supportive of pacifism. Is it pacifistic? Or is it merely saying that that the faith should never be forced upon others but spread simply through reasoned arguement and debate?

What do you think?
It’s not about human conflict at all, it’s about spiritual battle. Just as when Margaret Thatcher in IRON LADY said to the US command, “I do battle every day,” she was not referring to physical conflict.

Christians are allowed to disagree on the issue of participation in armed conflict.

ICXC NIKA

ICXC NIKA
 
Dear Mintaka!

Thank you very much for your reply!

I agree with you that its not about battlefields or pacifism. 🙂 I think some people are perhaps reading their own ideological bias into this passage and trying to strain out a gnat whilst swallowing a camel, so to speak. I for one firmly believe in the Just War doctrine, although I largely do believe that every war is a defeat for humanity, and should only be waged as a final resort after all peaceful means to resolving a conflict have been tried and failed.

What do you think of the part though where Paul talks about “destroying arguments”? You have excellently described the literal meaning of this passage in its proper context, but do you think that “implicitly speaking” (and remember that scripture has many levels of meaning) Paul could be suggesting that Christians do not use physical violence in spreading the faith but only arguments, and the conversion of hearts and minds? As St Bernard of Clairvaux once said, “Faith is a matter of persuasion, not of imposition”. For some reason - and I am probably way off track - I keep getting the impression that this is what St Paul is implying here. What else does he mean by “destroying arguments”? To me, its almost like he’s saying that Christians do not use physical, wordly means (Ie weapons or violence) to spread the gospel, but rather spread it through the “destroying of arguments” (peaceful means; reasoned discusion/debate) and the rather than physical incarceration, the “captivity of thoughts” (captivating the minds of people through reasoned debate, rather than physical compulsion).

After all arguements are obstacles brought up by other people, whereas you suggest that Paul is only speaking about personal warfare against demons and bad thoughts within ourselves? Do you know what I mean or am I speaking gibberish? Could it also be about how the faith is presented rather than pacifism (as you correctly proved false) and simply “inner struggle”?

The use of the word “argument” makes me think that St Paul has a wider meaning than just inner spiritual warfare, although I recognize that he does entail this. Must this passage be read only as a description of personal, inner struggle or can it also be seen as having an interpersonal significance as well? (Although not a political meaning as with “pacifism”).

Rather than pacifism or simply inner struggle, I keep reading it as having an interpersonal meaning: That religion is not to be spread through compulsion or worldly means (ie war, the traditional Islamic doctrine of Jihad) but only through the “destruction of arguments” and “captivity of thoughts”.

And even though I don’t believe it advocates pacifism (since that would contravene the idea of a Just War) I do feel that it does stress a certain non-violence; peaceful, spiritual means over worldly, violent means when possible.

But as I say I’m probably reading too much into it! 😃
 
The early Christians had extremely strong and extremely diverse opinions on whether or not Christians should fight. Both St. John the Baptist and Jesus expressed approval of individual soldiers’ service, as long as they did their job fairly; and obviously centurions were important early followers of Jesus in the Gospels and Acts. This followed on from Old Testament tradition, because obviously being “the Lord of Hosts” and leading Israel into battle are not very pacifist.

However, it’s also always been clear in the OT and NT that God would prefer that everybody be at peace under His rule, and that just because He permits people to defend themselves now, that doesn’t mean fighting is totally okay and the way He meant it to be. Both the OT and NT are very clear that when the Lord comes to judge everyone, peace will descend upon all things, from the animal kingdom to all the peoples of the world.

So just as not everyone is called to wander the roads as an evangelist with no money and only one set of clothes, but some people clearly are; and not everyone is called to live celibate like he’s already in Heaven where there’s no marriage, but some people are; so not everyone is called to live the way we will live after the Judgment, but some people choose to make themselves a sign of that.

Strictly speaking, though, that’s not being a pacifist. “Pacifist” originally came from a word meaning “someone who makes peace among others” – a “peacemaker”, a reconciler. It has come to mean someone who instead is an activist against making war or defending oneself. Strictly speaking, someone who refuses to fight would be a “peaceable” person or a person sworn not to bear arms, not a peacemaker or a peace activist. So pacifist is kind of a misleading term.

Back to the point…

So there was disagreement among early Christians about the suitability of military service. Service in the Roman military included a great deal of pagan worship of the goddess Roma and perhaps the Legion’s own insignia/standard. (Although Christians were often allowed to get out of it, or found a way to be doing something else on days of Legion ceremony.) It rendered one unable to legally wed any woman during the twenty years you had to serve in the Legions (although you could marry in the Church, no problem); it made it hard to go to Mass when on campaign; and it exposed one to immoral practices (like looting, gambling, fast women, bad stuff in camp life, etc.)

However, Christianity apparently had already spread throughout the Legions and other Roman military forces, because all those centurion guys apparently were not shy about spreading their faith. A lot of Christian centurions apparently tried to get other Christians in their units, because fairly soon we hear of all-Christian or mostly-Christian military units all over the place. People like Justin Martyr were glad to talk about their heroic deeds in war. Whenever the Roman world cracked down on Christianity, individual military Christians (and on one occasion, a fairly large unit) were martyred just as bravely, with typical Roman Army stoicism and jokes. We know that plenty of Army guys were buried in Christian catacombs as Christians. There were plenty of 'em.

Now, the major issue was clergy. If you were a bishop, or later, a priest, you were definitely supposed to keep your hands clean of violence, because you had to serve Mass with those hands. (And Church history is full of different ideas about what this principle meant.) Monks and hermits generally didn’t want to do anything violent, either; so a guy who wanted to be a monk usually would soon want out of the Legions.

This became a problem after a while, because modern Romans of the Empire mostly didn’t want to serve twenty years in the Legion. (By then they weren’t desperate to get off the boring farm, because slaves did most of the farming by then. They could stay home in the slums and live decently off imperial bread and circuses welfare. And if they came from merchant families or wealthy families, they had better things to do with their lives. The only reason to join up was to get elected to imperial offices, and you didn’t need to serve in the army anymore for that, at least a lot of the time.) So by the time we were a couple centuries past Jesus, the emperors started passing laws that said anybody whose dad had served in the Legions also had to serve in the Legions, no matter what career they’d prefer. This was why a lot of guys like St. Martin of Tours made a big point of refusing to bear arms in the military; they were protesting against not being allowed to get out of the Legions even to pursue their exciting careers of prayer, fasting, celibacy, and owning nothing.

(And obviously when monasteries were invented, even though monasteries were full of young men of the right age, the Church always kind of objected to them getting drafted.)

So basically… the Church generally didn’t object to people serving in the military, or to wars per se, because of the precedent of Israel. But when the Church was in a position to advise emperors and kings and other governments, it tended to advise peaceful positions, because (if nobody is trying to kill you) peace is better than war. And if you have to fight, you’re supposed to fight in a just manner for just reasons, not just run around raping and pillaging.
 
2 Corinthians 10:1-18, seems to be Paul’s defense of his ministry against radical religious opponents (the “super-apostles”?), who criticize him for his lack of “power”. “We destroy arguements”, seems to me to be Paul characterizing his opponents as debaters and “wage war…destroy, and take…captive” is warfare imagery that I see as applying to Paul’s religious debate with his opponents, rather than to purely inner struggle against negative thoughts and emotions. I thus read this as Paul saying that Christians do not use “physical weapons” (ie violence/force) against their opponents, but spiritual/mental weapons of prayer, reasoned debate and the “captivity of thoughts” (conversion of hearts and minds, as opposed to forced conversion).

My question then is this: Could this passage have an interpersonal application rather than a purely personal one?

I’m suggesting that this passage, often interpreted in a political manner (as denoting a condemnation of warfare) or as pertaining to a purely personal, inner struggle against against evil thoughts, could actually be about how the faith is spread, through passive, spiritual means rather than force/compulsion (not denying the inner struggle aspect as well though).
 
And I’m still fascinated by the verse, “We do not wage war according to human standards”. Although I don’t think its political or pacifistic, I do think it seems to be suggesting that Christians do not use violence but reasoned discussion, as Pope John XXIII once said:

“…The weapons of truth, then, must be used in defense against these weapons of evil…God created men as brothers, not foes…The various nations are simply communities of men, that is, of brothers…We are called brothers. We actually are brothers. We share a common destiny in this life and the next. Why, then, do we act as though we are foes and enemies? Why do we envy one another? Why do we stir up hatred? Why do we ready lethal weapons for use against our brothers? There has already been enough warfare among men! Too many youths in the flower of life have shed their blood already! Legions of the dead, all fallen in battle, dwell within this earth of ours. Their stern voices urge us all to return at once to harmony, unity, and a just peace. All men, then, should turn their attention away from those things that divide and separate us, and should consider how they may be joined in mutual and just regard for one another’s opinions and possessions…For discussion can lead to fuller and deeper understanding of religious truths; when one idea strikes against another, there may be a spark…”

- Pope John XXIII, AD PETRI CATHEDRAM (On Truth, Unity and Peace), 1959

Now Pope John XXIII was not a pacifist by any means, but again I feel that we see this emphasis on peaceful discussion as opposed to violence and compulsion.

And so Pope Paul VI said, when speaking about how Catholics should approach atheists:

“…The Church can regard no one as excluded from its motherly embrace, no one as outside the scope of its motherly care. It has no enemies except those who wish to make themselves such. Its catholicity is no idle boast. It was not for nothing that it received its mission to foster love, unity and peace among men…For the lover of truth discussion is always possible…”

- ECCLESIAM SUAM ENCYCLICAL OF POPE PAUL VI , AUGUST 6, 1964
 
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