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catholic2
Guest
kool. have a great life!
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soulsearcher322
Guest
I’m curious,
I have heard that in the original greek text, Matthew 28:1, the word sabbath is plural. Is this true?
Thanks
I have heard that in the original greek text, Matthew 28:1, the word sabbath is plural. Is this true?
Thanks
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COPLAND_3
Guest
Names for festival days are often in the plural in classical usage: ANQESTHRIA, DIONUSIA, KARNEIA, AFRODISIA: regularly in the neuter plural.
There are also two possibilities: The author takes “sabbatwn” as week, which is its meaning in various Greek texts from the period. Or the translator saw the Aramaic Shabbath and took it as a plural (as happens in John when Jerusalem is placed in the plural in Greek because its ending is dual in Aramaic). The Gospel was orignally written in Matthew, so that is highly possible.
There are also two possibilities: The author takes “sabbatwn” as week, which is its meaning in various Greek texts from the period. Or the translator saw the Aramaic Shabbath and took it as a plural (as happens in John when Jerusalem is placed in the plural in Greek because its ending is dual in Aramaic). The Gospel was orignally written in Matthew, so that is highly possible.
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Huiou_Theou
Guest
I just did a quick check, as I have finally recovered some of my lost Greek tools.
σαββατ-ων is fairly interesting. The above naming of the god’s – except Karnea, who I don’t recall being a god…
Are you seeing some kind of connection with respect to the pagan festivals around the Israelites, eg: Astarte, Ashteroth, Innana, etc. were associated with the ferility cults of the area, and the old testament is chock full of apologets against these type of things. Eg: God took the staff of Moses and turned it into the serpent which ATE the magicians serpent – showing that he ruled even over the other fertility gods – and then at the sin of the golden calf, the rising up, and the serpents in the desert were all signs of the same problem. That’s why the serpents began biting, and God had moses crucify the serpent symbolically – they had known the sign of Moses, and still rebelled. Indeed the serpent would even in crucified form be worshipped wrongly…
But God does appear to do this repetitively, eg: Jesus is the sun in Revelation – he has usurped the egyptian sun god. A celibate man on the cross, he took up the position of reminding people of their guilt – like the serpent – but it is almost if he were mocking the fertility of the serpent.
As to the specific Greek – I will stay shallow for now. There is an incosistency in the way sabbath is used that I do not understand.
Some examples where definite articles are used, would be these:
το σαββατ-ον Neuter normal ending.
τοις σαββατ-οισ Dative plural feminine.
του σαββατ-ου Looks genitive…
των σαββατ-ων This one is a problem, as the stem ends in τ and I have seen several instances where similar words (τ,δ, & θ) used it as a nominative/subject, sometimes even dropping the constant stem and the ν at the end so it is just ω
A good place to look for thought is when Moses gave the commands – Exodus 20:8 – The singular and plural issues are quite strong there including των which is usually the plural genitive whether neuter of feminine. I learned early on that the neuter developed from the feminine, and one of the main uses of the singular is as a collective noun.
I am still looking for other examples, but I would also notice that the sabbath is spoken of as feminie (her singular) and that an ordinal is used for the 7th day, and not a cardinal 7 days.
For ειρ singular in a femine role, I normally see the constant followed by N.G.D.A – -α -ας -αι -αν where the ι would be a subscript if I knew how to work this keyboard.
There is a masculine singular that seems to follow this patterni too: -ων -ος -ι -α
The dead give away is the genitive uses -ος , but I don’t see that in my cursory searches.
The other pattern for τ,δ,θ is the standard one in the plural – .α -.ων -.σιν] -.α and these are often masculine/neuter.
I don’t have time to play, but God bless you.
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Huiou_Theou
Guest
Boy, just reread my last post – after two days no sleep, eyes start playing tricks. So here’s a couple of corrections.
That was supposed to be masculine/neuter plural, not feminine. τοις
And the disconnected second sentence is because the names of the festivals are all from the names of the Greek “gods” whom they honor – the endings of the “god’s” names being changed to signify the festival.
and the ειρ was supposed to be τ,δ,θ…
sheesh!
That was supposed to be masculine/neuter plural, not feminine. τοις
And the disconnected second sentence is because the names of the festivals are all from the names of the Greek “gods” whom they honor – the endings of the “god’s” names being changed to signify the festival.
and the ειρ was supposed to be τ,δ,θ…
sheesh!
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COPLAND_3
Guest
Huiou Theou
I totally understand! After I reread mine I realized that I really did not answer it the way I really wanted to because I rushed into it and was not very specific.
I totally understand! After I reread mine I realized that I really did not answer it the way I really wanted to because I rushed into it and was not very specific.
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toddvetter
Guest
There is a study at this link that goes into the most detail to date for answering the question or posiblity of a wednesday Crucifixion. Turns out it is very possible. those who say it is not do not know the Laws that Christ fulfilled very well.
thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/death%20and%20resurrection%20time%20line.pdf
By page 34 Every verse of bible testimony applicable to this topic will be covered including historical references and ancient manuscripts. this is the best study to date for the posiblity of a friday death, thursday, death or Wednesday death since it is objective and gives each posibility the opportunity to make it’s case.
God Bless.
thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/death%20and%20resurrection%20time%20line.pdf
By page 34 Every verse of bible testimony applicable to this topic will be covered including historical references and ancient manuscripts. this is the best study to date for the posiblity of a friday death, thursday, death or Wednesday death since it is objective and gives each posibility the opportunity to make it’s case.
God Bless.
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puzzleannie
Guest
if I was making an analogy and I told you, “I am taking a 3-day weekend vacation at the Island” and I left sometime on Friday afternoon, drove to the Island, spent Saturday at the beach, and drove home, arriving sometime Sunday, would you accuse me of lying because I did not spend precisely 72 hours at the beach? the use of the expression 3 days and 3 nights is meant to imply completion of the events that occupied that period of time, it is not meant to imply clock time. We know this is true if we recall that the sacrifice of calvary completes the sacrifice at the Last Supper. Sundown Thursday to sundown Friday, the first day, a complete event comprising the last supper, the passion, the death, and the burial. Evening Friday, the beginning of the Sabbath to evening Saturday, the second day, the time in the tomb. Evening Saturday to Sunday night, the Third day, a sequence of events comprehensively called the Resurrection, which includes his appearances to his disciples at various times and places culminating with his appearance in the upper room on Sunday evening.
we need to cease thinking in linear time, in the manner of a play by play account of a ball game or political election, when you are speaking of the Deity who exists and acts outside time. we need to cease limiting God’s action by our own paltry human understanding, and implying that what we cannot understand and express in purely human, or terrestrial terms, cannot therefore be true. The actions of God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, in that three days, now commemorated as the liturgical season of the Triduum is one saving event, not a series of isolated events, that happened in human history for human witnesses, but the reality of which goes far beyond the capacity of those humans to comprehend.
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
I believe the Saturday Sabbath is a prophecy of Jesus being laid to rest in the tomb on Saturday. God finished creating the world on a Friday, and He finished redeeming the world on a Friday.
I believe that the sign of Jonah, “three days and three nights”, refers to both His suffering and death.
blessedcause.org/BlessedCause%20Exclusives/The%20Sign%20of%20Jonah.htm
I tried to read that link you gave. But fifty pages of unstructured text was too hard to read.
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