$34.06 an Hour

[vern_humphrey]

Only if you can compare a brick or a car to our children.

Are teachers our children?

Brick masons build the houses in which our children live. Used car salesmen sell us (some of us, anyway) the cars in which our children ride. Farmers grow the food our children eat.

 

[harinkj]

Are teachers our children?

Brick masons build the houses in which our children live.

Who can afford a mason now-a-days? And check out how the houses have held up in central Florida after that last storm.

Used car salesmen sell us (some of us, anyway) the cars in which our children ride.

Toyota recalled more cars than it sold in the US last year.

Farmers grow the food our children eat.

No they don’t. Illegal Mexicans grow it. Or it is brought in from Chile.

Seriously, all sorts parts of our society are on a downward spiral.

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[mommyof4]

No they don’t. Illegal Mexicans grow it. Or it is brought in from Chile.

Seriously, all sorts parts of our society are on a downward spiral.

• Kathie :bowdown:

Not around here, they don’t!

 

[Thekla]

Well, since the reason property taxes are capped in California is due to a state proposition passed years ago, I would say the state could very well do something about it.

The only thing that the state can do, and most have, is put a cap on the levy. But it’s up to the School Board how they spend the revenues that they receive. That’s why some school districts spend 40% of their revenues on teachers’ salaries and some districts spend 45% of their revenues on teachers’ salaries.

 

[Thekla]

Why was Proposition 13 passed? Actually the biggest beneficiaries were the very large land owners like the Southern Pacific Corporation. Now they didn’t have to pay much for property tax to support education.

The entire matter shows how stupid the voters can be. Whether they are conservative or liberal.

• Kathie :bowdown:

I think that this was one of billionaire Warren Buffet’s pet peeves; his property taxes are higher for his modest home in Omaha than his mansion in Malibu. He thinks it’s stupid, too.

 

[YADA]

School districts know how to manipulate the political system.

Salary parity for teachrs is not ussually a part of teacher pay status discussions. It is far easier to use the general 'teachers are paid less than athletes" or “teachers educate the future doctors, nurses, etc” and “teachers pay is too low” complaints becuase they are hard to argue with and are too much like ether to grasp.

As many posters have noted to compare teacher pay with your average enginer, nurse, etc means you have to adjust the ‘yard stick’ so that you are measuring both positions in ‘yards’. The old apples and oranges comparison. Few teachers want to go there. ANd a real comparison of positions and compensation has to include benefits. [In my state for example the public retirement system had the public agency pay 6% into retirement and the employee pay 6%. After a salary parity study fro engineers and others at the state level and several years of nraises the state negotiated a state ‘pickup’ of the employees 6% in place of a regular 6% salary raise. It saved the state money, in not paying the employers FICA, th eemployees got the raise in that they got to keep the 6% they had been contributing. Within a couple of years every union and just about every school district, city, county and state agency followed suit]

That school teacher receives an annual base salary [for about 9 months of work], plus a retirement fund, plus insurance [usually family health, life, disability] and sick leave and vacation.

Before you take my head off I was married to a teacher, my father was a clollege teacher and I know many teachers. Yes teachers work hard. So do lots of professionals in a variety of careers. Yes teachers have to take continuing education classess but so do many professions. Teachers can attend 1 week sessions and earn a semester of credits. Most school districts have tuition assistance or pay the fees. Teachers are paid extra for those additonal credits and degrees earned above the education required of an entry level position. Summer classes, coaching and other extra duties are compensated.

Teachers, buy and large earn a fair wage and are well above the ‘poverty’ levels hinted at.

I am an engineer and own my own comapny. I do not make as much as the average teacher in my state and much less when you compare the complete compensation package. I recognize that I could earn more by going to work for a public agency or a large private firm. I make a decision to stay in business for myself. I think my employees are glad as they don’t have to look for another job…

 

[seek]

I’m 52. I’ve labored since I was 15. I’ve worked in union and non-union jobs all those years. There most certainly
are abuses by unions. But the abuses to the employees in
non union situations was and is far worse. It always seems
to me the whining about unions comes down to the support
of Economic Darwinism. Let corporations make as much
profit as possible, don’t restrict them in any way, and they’ll
do right by their workers. Well they don’t and won’t unless
some leverage, some power, twists some arms. It’s been
the history of management and labor struggles in America.
We have safety,pollution and child labor laws all because of this leverage, this arm twisting. 40 hr work weeks, lunch breaks, and so many other protections because of this meddling.

I wish I worked in a union situation today. The company I work for had record profits two years ago and my pay was cut.
They called it re-structuring of pay scales, or re-aligning.
IF you put a dress and lipstick on a pig and call her Monique
it’s still a pig. Believe me it was a pay cut. The CEO received
a 10 million dollar bonus and the stock split. Wall street
was happy but Main St shook their head in sorrow. 20 %
of our population has 80% of the wealth. If the answers are
always easy maybe were not asking the right questions.

 

[rlg94086]

Of course the “liberal” comment is true. I wasn’t talking about California at the time Prop 13 was passed. I was commenting on the fact that the strong liberal majority in the state for the last…15?..20?..years has been unable to do anything about it. The same very liberal voters in California who elect and re-elect Barbara Boxer with a strong majority are not willing to increase their own taxes for the benefit of their schools.

I remember Proposition 13 which was the proposition which set the limits on property tax. This “liberal” comment is not true. It was a conservative led proposition. And there were many conservatives in California then. Two conservatives, Javris and Gann, lead the effort.
democracyctr.org/demaction/proposition13.html
Interestingly, I remember that policemen and firemen individually supported the proposition because they said that their own salaries and job security would not be affected. What greed. Also, it used to be that every election would have the propositions begin with number 1 and then go from there. The law was changed so that each election would have the numbering continue from the last election until 200 was reached. Then they would go back to begin at 1 again. Why did they enact this change? Because the tax limit people were worried that a repeal would be put on the ballot and it would be done to get the number 13 and all of the stupid people who were for the original tax limit would accidentally vote for the repeal.

Why was Proposition 13 passed? Actually the biggest beneficiaries were the very large land owners like the Southern Pacific Corporation. Now they didn’t have to pay much for property tax to support education.

The entire matter shows how stupid the voters can be. Whether they are conservative or liberal.

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[rlg94086]

By the way. The way the law is written. The property taxes can shoot up if the title changes on the house. So if you move into a neighborhood and buy a 3 bedroom home for $1,000,000 you will pay through the nose. The family next to you who bought their house years ago when it was $60,000 won’t pay much at all. By the way that $1,000,000 is not out of line for a typical tract house in Santa Barbara. Go to a real estate web site and see for yourself.

• Kathie :bowdown:

Don’t have to…I lived in the Bay Area and experienced it first hand. The 30-year-old 2000 square foot 4-bedroom houses near us sold for $1.2 Million. They were nothing special. Forget about a new tract home…if you can find one, you will commute an hour to get to work.

 

[mystified]

Where I live the beginning salary for an elementary school teacher is $40,000 per year plus some might fine perks.
They average only 13 days per month actually with their 20 pupils in the classroom, including “minimum days” with the youngsters only present from one to three hours…enough for the district to count them present for ADA (average daily attendance) payments from the state.

Each year they get a raise, sometimes not a big raise, but a raise. If they take “continuing education classes,” they qualify for increases as well. In the private sector, one does not get pay increases for learning flower arranging, guitar playing, or square dancing, but, as a friend who admits “using the system” says, “If it is offered, why not take the money?”

Sorry, I find it hard to feel sorry for someone starting at only$40,000.Sure wish my retirement income was at least half of what our local retired teachers are receiving.

 

[system]

They average only 13 days per month actually with their 20 pupils in the classroom.

In a nine month school year that would be 117 days; 10 months 130 days.

The minimun number of days of school per year is 180.

Sure wish my retirement income was at least half of what our local retired teachers are receiving.

IF you can do what they do, go ahead.

 

[Fitz]

Tell me, Vern, are you a member of a teachers union, or do you even really know much about it? I’m just curious, because I am a member of the union, and never once in my years of membership, have I ever gotten the feeling, either from our local leadership or the national leadership, that the “union” was more important than the chidren we teach. If I ever do get that message, I’m outta there.

I am also a member of the teacher’s union. I was deeply embarrassed a few years ago when the national chapter hosted the Planned Parenthood march in Washington DC. I think the union does some very shady things. Ever since that time I have requested my political action money back each year. They send it in the spring every year- a measly $20. but they made me so mad!

 

[KittyKat]

Some teachers are really underpaid and some are highly overpaid. I had a few teachers in high school that should have been replaced by a monkey.
I had a few that had students grade papers and decorate the classroom and they would even let the class out early so that they could get home. They would be out of that building within 5 minutes, and if they couldn’t get any other stuff done during the day they didn’t do it.
My favorite teacher pretty much lived at the school and was always there, but that wasn’t the norm.

 

[mlchance]

The OP article is a load of nonsense.

I teach. My work day starts at 7:00 a.m. and officially ends at 3:45 p.m., but almost every day I’m at school until at 4:30 to 5:00 p.m. Then I get to go home, grade papers, type up exams, call parents, answer school-related emails, et cetera. This is just Monday through Friday.

There are also the infrequent evening meetings, sometimes to as late as 9:00 p.m., as well as open houses once in a while on Saturdays and even Sundays. During the summer last summer, I was contractually obligated to put in at least 120 hours of prep work for the following school year. There are also weekend and summer workshops to attend, lesson plans to type, et cetera.

Show me a teacher who works 180 days a year, 40 hours a week, and I’ll show you teacher who isn’t getting all his work done.

– Mark L. Chance.