"36,000" denominations

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Philthy:
OK-

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For example how about these basic criteria for starters:

Infant baptism is valid Y N
Baptism is part of salvation Y N
Once Saved Always Saved Y N
Real Presence Y N
Trinity is Truth Y N
Sola Scriptura Y N

…
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Besides Y and N, I’d add K for Kinda-sorta. I don’t say that to be mean, but that is the way things are. So, the formula would be (avg. number of positions)^(number of issues) = number of camps. Doing the math, it makes you realize that there must be a good number of people who still, in good conscience, wouldn’t feel completely allied to any given recognized Protestant denomination.
 
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DeFide:
Besides Y and N, I’d add K for Kinda-sorta. I don’t say that to be mean, but that is the way things are. So, the formula would be (avg. number of positions)^(number of issues) = number of camps. Doing the math, it makes you realize that there must be a good number of people who still, in good conscience, wouldn’t feel completely allied to any given recognized Protestant denomination.
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To me–a person not deeply immersed in theological or social studies-- a denomination not only has different faith traditions, but different heads of the church. **that’s **how you know the Catholic Church…the TRUE one… is the single Church it proves to be. We have a head. basically you have a church to fit your personality now. And if you are kinda sorta on a few issues, and u dont fully care to understand them, you are non-denominational. So how many non-denominational denominations are there? :whistle:
Is non-denominational counted as a denomination?
 
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dumspirospero:
Well…considering that there will be 3 (3 is just a rough number…sometimes there are more and sometimes less) Baptist Churches, etc. in one town, and all of them have somewhat different beliefs and teachings on certain things…even though they claim to be Baptist in name…they are different, therefore I look at them as 3 different Protestant religions…therefore, by my logic and I could be wrong…there are probably countless numbers of protestant religions out there, because there is no uniformity among them.
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Firstly all Baptist churches agree the same thing. There are more than one parishes but to be a Baptist church it needs to believe certain things. The same thing with Catholic Churches. There are many parishes but they need to believe the same things. It is the same way with any denomination. Then you get into splits within a denomination, such as Southern Baptist. All of those churches believe the same things as each other.
By your logic there are then countless divisions of the Catholic Church.
 
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bjcros87:
Firstly all Baptist churches agree the same thing. There are more than one parishes but to be a Baptist church it needs to believe certain things. The same thing with Catholic Churches. There are many parishes but they need to believe the same things. It is the same way with any denomination. Then you get into splits within a denomination, such as Southern Baptist. All of those churches believe the same things as each other.
By your logic there are then countless divisions of the Catholic Church.
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Baptist churches are autonomous and have varying beliefs regarding different doctrines.
 
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Philthy:
OK-

So we all realize that the number of denominations is a function of the definition of a denomination, correct? The concept of counting each country as a separate denomination was truly moronic - doesn’t it make you wonder how people that make such decisions ever learned how to write in the first place - let alone publish a book?! How stupid can you be?
Let’s take the thread in a slightly different direction (or if I should start another one let me know):

**What are some absolutes for distinguishing between “faith traditions” that we can agree on when using the term “denomination”? **

For example how about these basic criteria for starters:

Infant baptism is valid Y N
Baptism is part of salvation Y N
Once Saved Always Saved Y N
Real Presence Y N
Trinity is Truth Y N
Sola Scriptura Y N

Do you realize that with just these 6 issues there is a potential for 64 denominations and it doubles each time you add another issue? How many different issues would you think are necessary to raise the potential denominations to over 30,000? Just 15 issues creates a potential 32,768 denominations. I don’t know, but fifteen issues doesn’t seem like a lot to me. Anybody else have some additional criteria they would like to suggest?

Phil
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Perhaps we should start listing all the areas that we know Protestant Churches disagree with each other on. Then we can do the math to come up with the max number of denominations grouped by what they believe (whether or not they are an organized group). This would only give us a theoretical maximum…but I’m pretty sure that the real numbers would be pretty close!
 
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Isidore_AK:
Perhaps we should start listing all the areas that we know Protestant Churches disagree with each other on. Then we can do the math to come up with the max number of denominations grouped by what they believe (whether or not they are an organized group). This would only give us a theoretical maximum…but I’m pretty sure that the real numbers would be pretty close!
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This is my list of major issues protests split on. It doesn’t include more minor causes of protestant splits, such as style of service, church, government, vestments, attitude to alcohol, pastoring styles, tithing, methods of receiving communion etc.

Should there be infant or Adult baptism?
Does baptism confer Grace or is it just a symbol?
Is our destiny governed by Calvinist Predestination or Arminian Free Will
Once Saved Always Saved?
Is there assurance of Salvation?
Can one lose Salvation?
Is Salvation a one-off event or a lifelong journey?
Does hell exist?
Can one be saved outside the Christian Church?
Should images be used in worship?
Does the Church replace Israel?
Is Divorce permissible
Is Abortion murder?
Is prophecy still given?
Are there still Miracles?
Are miracles guaranteed if you have enough faith?
Will there be a pre-trib Rapture?
Premillenialism or Postmillenialism?
Will there even be a millennium?
Speaking in Tongues - valid or deception?
Baptism in the Holy Spirit - is it real?
Are demons real?
What role do Works have in Salvation?
What is the Nature and Function of Sacraments?
Is Jesus physically present in Communion?
Are the Sacraments necessary to salvation?
What form of Authority should exist in the Church?
Does a minister need to be ordained?
What does ordination confer?
Is Apostolic Succession necessary?
Can women be Pastors?
Can homosexuals be admitted to Church?
Does God promise Christians material prosperity?
 
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Isidore_AK:
Perhaps we should start listing all the areas that we know Protestant Churches disagree with each other on. Then we can do the math to come up with the max number of denominations grouped by what they believe (whether or not they are an organized group). This would only give us a theoretical maximum…but I’m pretty sure that the real numbers would be pretty close!
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There was a book written in the 15 or 1600’s called “250 Interprutations of This is my Body” No lie. Is that what ya mean. 🙂
 
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Mickey:
Baptist churches are autonomous and have varying beliefs regarding different doctrines.
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I don’t think they are autonomous. All of the Baptist churches in a convention believe the same thing. Now there are many conventions. When I googled baptist convention, there came 915,000 results. I don’t think that all of those are really baptist conventions. However, all of the parishes in a convention teach the same thing. To see what the Southern Baptist Convention believes go to [http://www.sbc.net/aboutus/positionstatements.asp](http://www.sbc.net/aboutus/positionstatements.asp)
I know that there are a great number of conventions. However, some people said that the beliefs of Protestants isn’t written down. This is true to an extent There isn’t a belief that all protestants(Non-Catholic Chirstians) adhere to other than the Catholic Church is wrong.However, there is a list of the beliefs of different denominations/churches.
 
Hmm…should we move this to a seperate thread…?

I’m going to start a new thread in the Non-Catholic Religions Forum…

We’ll only list items of disagreement between Protestants.
 
Well…the results are in (at least as far as I want to go with it!).

After stopping the list at 19 major points of disagreement (I’m sure we could find hundreds), we have a total of 12.65 quadrillion denominations! Now we know that this is an extreme number…so 36,000 is starting to look pretty reasonable.

I defined a ‘denomination’ as a group of churches (organized or not, whether or not they even know each other exist) that officially teaches the same theology.

Following this definition, any number of non-denominational churches can be defined as a ‘denomination’ by their belief in the same theology. I think that this is fair.

It only takes 8 possible options for there to be more than 40,000 different combinations…only 8. I think that maybe 40,000 denominations (my definition) might actually be a conservative number…

Of course, pinning a non-denom Christian down long enough to find out what his Church teaches (if he even knows!) is a pain in the but…
 
If a denomination is defined as a “group of churches” of like belief and in relation to one another, then to be honest and fair, all genuinely “non-denominational” churches, must be excluded from the definition and NOT treated as separate denominations - they are not a “group”. These simply need to be excluded from the survey or categorized separately as not willing to associate with anyone other than themselves.

The plain and simple fact is once we exclude the non-denominationals, there are only a few thousand legitimate denominations in the world. Check your phone book. Have you ever been in a major city and found more than a few hundred churches even listed? Realizing many are parishes of the same denomination (like the few dozen Catholic Churches that are listed there). There are some major statistical problems with Barrett’s approach. But without getting into that, it shouldn’t even be a point of argument. It has nothing to do with the issue of Christ’s true Church.

There are 2 basic competing thoughts out there . . . (1) the denominations that believe they are the only true church and (2) the denominations that accept that all faithful disciples of Christ within each of the denominations represent the mystical Body of Christ even if they are in separate political structures on earth, they are one in Christ.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of Christians fall into category 1, each believing they are the “true” church and everyone else is apostate.

The Roman Catholic Church and Orthodox Churches both have historical links to the apostles and thus have always claimed to be the “true” church . . . so which “one” is 🙂 Of course, you believe one thing and they just as adamantly believe the opposite and guess what . . . the vast majority of the rest of Christianity is so convinced that both of the ancient pillars have so long abandoned the true faith in Christ that neither are even Christian anymore . . . it’s really sad.

Here’s a truth that most here will likely reject, yet it’s the truth never-the-less. God’s grace and favor can be witnessed operating in members of nearly every denomination out there. Try as hard as you’d like to deny it, God actually performs miracles (healings and signs/wonders) among non-Catholic Christians around the world and transforms lives from darkness into light. This is proof positive that God has honored their committment to Him as disciples and is actively working in their lives as the indwelling Holy Spirit testifies.
I would love it if all of us would simply embrace the work that Christ has done in each of Jesus’s brothers and sisters without pride and judgmentalism getting in the way and causing us to reject and condemn each other. Until we can die to pride, we’ll never be One as Jesus prayed.

David
 
Did you know that, on average, 27000 Protestant denominations mean they’ve been splitting at the rate of one a week since the Deformation? (sorry, finger slipped, that should be an R).
 
36,000 you say?!?! LOL!! That’s ridiculous!

I was looking through the phone book last week looking for a place to call and I came across “Churches” and stopped to look at the churches around the metro area. To my shock, there were MORE Protestant/non-denominational churches than there were Catholic churches! I literally shook my head in disgust! :banghead:

I tell ya, there was like 1 1/2 page full of Catholic churches and the rest of them contained the non-Catholic churches (and there were like 10-15 pages of the other! How sad!)
 
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