5-year-old Kentucky boy fatally shoots 2-year-old sister

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If they were going to be prosecuted, which they are not, this would be a point the DA would have to weigh to see if it rose to the level of* criminal* negligence. The fact that gun instructors teach this does not make it criminal.
Noun 1. criminal negligence - (law) recklessly acting without reasonable caution and putting another person at risk of injury or death (or failing to do something with the same consequences)
Given that the definition of criminal negligence refers to not using reasonable caution, and almost everyone who has been around guns has been taught to consider them loaded until proven otherwise, they did not take reasonable caution, and they obviously put someone at risk of injury or death, this fits the definition of criminal negligence.
 
Given that the definition of criminal negligence refers to not using reasonable caution, and almost everyone who has been around guns has been taught to consider them loaded until proven otherwise, they did not take reasonable caution, and they obviously put someone at risk of injury or death, this fits the definition of criminal negligence.
You gave the definition of negligence. The specific definition of criminal negligence is as follows:
He ought to be aware of a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result will occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that the failure to perceive it constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that an ordinary person would exercise under all the circumstances as viewed from the actor’s standpoint.
statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.6.htm

So, if the mother was aware of the risk she was taking leaving the child with a loaded gun, or with any gun and she had proper training in firearm safety that this was unsafe and here actions did not just deviate but deviated to a large degree looking at this from her point of view.
 
You gave the definition of negligence. The specific definition of criminal negligence is as follows:

statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.6.htm

So, if the mother was aware of the risk she was taking leaving the child with a loaded gun, or with any gun and she had proper training in firearm safety that this was unsafe and here actions did not just deviate but deviated to a large degree looking at this from her point of view.
What I quoted was the definition of criminal negligence from a dictionary.

What you are quoting is how that is particularly translated in one states law. At a broader level it meets the definition.
 
I really would like to know why people seem to be acting like this child being killed is something that should just be shrugged off as an accident and no big deal.

Perhaps that is not what people mean, but it sure comes across that way.

I personally am outraged that this child died. I am outraged when any innocent child dies of a preventable cause!

:mad:
 
I really would like to know why people seem to be acting like this child being killed is something that should just be shrugged off as an accident and no big deal.
The operative word here is “seem”. No one is shrugging it off. No one thinks it is not a big deal. In fact, it is such a big deal that the suffering of the parents strike a chord of sympathy in people. I am sure they are in much more grief than you over this death.
 
The operative word here is “seem”. No one is shrugging it off. No one thinks it is not a big deal. In fact, it is such a big deal that the suffering of the parents strike a chord of sympathy in people. I am sure they are in much more grief than you over this death.
Exactly this. I also would add that nearly all accidental deaths ARE preventable. All of us are guilty of things that could care great harm. Even if it is something minor like not buckling a high chair or stroller strap. It could still result in accidental death.
 
Exactly this. I also would add that nearly all accidental deaths ARE preventable. All of us are guilty of things that could care great harm. Even if it is something minor like not buckling a high chair or stroller strap. It could still result in accidental death.
Not even close to the same thing. A child falling out of a high chair or stroller could die, but it is a very low percentage chance. A child being shot has a very high percentage chance of dying.

If a guy gets drunk and drives with his child in the car, gets in an accident, and she dies, I am sure he would feel great guilt as well, yet I do not think I would see the same level of sympathy around here for him… I think most people would be calling for the same thing that I am in this case, criminal charges.
 
Not even close to the same thing. A child falling out of a high chair or stroller could die, but it is a very low percentage chance. A child being shot has a very high percentage chance of dying.

If a guy gets drunk and drives with his child in the car, gets in an accident, and she dies, I am sure he would feel great guilt as well, yet I do not think I would see the same level of sympathy around here for him… I think most people would be calling for the same thing that I am in this case, criminal charges.
It happens MORE often than a child dying by a gun. And even more kids suffer life long brain injuries due to falls and other accidents. And drunk driving is a whole other thread. Not even related to accidental deaths at all. Drunk drivers make a decision to drink and drive, it’s not the same thing at all. As many kids raised in the rural parts of this country and as few times as this has happened…can’t even recall the last time it’s happened here. No, I don’t agree with leaving guns out and that’s why I monitor where my kids go because most families here DON’T lock their guns up. It is still unheard of for a child to be killed like that. We here about it happening in Nashville but under different circumstances, not accidental. We hear about a drunk guy shooting himself in the leg, but again that is different. But on any given day a child is hurt in other ways. My dad kept his service revolver loaded and in the kitchen cabnet. All the guys on the dept with dad did the same. All the guys that hunted kept their rifles in their truck, usually more than one and a bow as well. It is how it is. It’s not going to change anytime soon. I don’t have any guns in my house because I don’t trust myself keeping an eye out for my kids or other people’s kids when they come over, but I still don’t see what these parents did any different than what MOST other parents in rural KY do. Sad, gut wrenching and horrendous don’t even begin to describe a baby dying, no matter the circumstances. But I would never dream of telling you how it is best to live in your hometown. I can’t possibly know what is best. When we move to a new area I always ask people how things are done, because it is culture shock just moving from KY to AZ or TX or NY or NC. It takes time to acclimate. And some places I never could and was so glad to be leaving in all honesty! I’m not proud that the people in my home state are often the butts of jokes for the way we do things, but I am so glad that I know the truth about us. We are self sufficient, hard working, willing to do whatever it takes to take care of our own, and we sacrifice much more than most in order to take care if our children and our elderly. That is how I KNOW that this mom would not have purposely done anything to endanger her children. I realize it is probably different circumstances and I will not understand your life. Just like you can’t understand this family’s either.
 
I really would like to know why people seem to be acting like this child being killed is something that should just be shrugged off as an accident and no big deal.

Perhaps that is not what people mean, but it sure comes across that way.

I personally am outraged that this child died. I am outraged when any innocent child dies of a preventable cause!

:mad:
I am sure her parents think it is a big deal. I am outraged that so many people want to add to their grief
 
What about mowing the grass? Most parents give that chore to older kids and quite often it turns ugly. What about wondering into dad’s (or moms) work shop and encountering poisons or power tools? The amount of kids killed by cleaning supplies and over the counter medications outweighs the number killed by guns. As parents we can not possibly watch our kids 24 hours a day. We need to sleep, we have chores to do. In the amount of time it takes to go to the bathroom our kids can poison themselves. Are moms that leave a mop bucket out, probably unintentionally, when they go bathroom, guilty of neglect? Everyone knows that cleaning supplies are dangerous. I just can’t follow your logic here.
Mop buckets aren’t designed to kill people. Lawnmowers aren’t designed to kill people. Medications and cleaning supplies are not designed to kill people. Even poisons are not designed to kill people (bugs and critters yes). Only guns are specifically designed to kill PEOPLE. A five year old can barley tie his shoes. Yet you see nothing wrong with giving something designed to kill to a child like that.

I don’t what age is appropriate for a child to have a gun at, but I know it isn’t 5.
 
It happens MORE often than a child dying by a gun.
I don’t doubt that probably because nearly every parent who has a 2 year old has a high chair but not every parent of a 2 year old has a gun so naturally the potential is much higher.

Perhaps incarceration or removing the other child from the home isn’t necessary but certainly they should never be allowed to possess a gun again.
 
I don’t doubt that probably because nearly every parent who has a 2 year old has a high chair but not every parent of a 2 year old has a gun so naturally the potential is much higher.

Perhaps incarceration or removing the other child from the home isn’t necessary but certainly they should never be allowed to possess a gun again.
The law doesn’t work that way.

You can’t suspend arbitrary legal rights (especially ones constitutionally protected) as punishment.

People convicted of voter fraud do not lose the right to vote, legally.

No judge in the world would say “no jail time, but you are no longer allowed to posses guns.”

Again, I am surprised people on a message board believe their outrage deserves an outlet, and that somehow, the punsihments they can come up with will somehow be worse than them losing a child.

The pain and grief will be with them until the day they die. Nothing you propose will even register relative to that.
 
Mop buckets aren’t designed to kill people. Lawnmowers aren’t designed to kill people. Medications and cleaning supplies are not designed to kill people. Even poisons are not designed to kill people (bugs and critters yes). Only guns are specifically designed to kill PEOPLE. A five year old can barley tie his shoes. Yet you see nothing wrong with giving something designed to kill to a child like that.

I don’t what age is appropriate for a child to have a gun at, but I know it isn’t 5.
No, guns are not designed specifically to kill people any more than a butcher knife or ax is. I’m not talking about a military style semi automatic here. This is a small rifle made to teach how to shoot, hunting small game, target shooting. I have no real opinion on what age the parents decide is appropriate to teach their children how to shoot/hunt. My dad taught me at age 3, but I’ve never owned a gun. My kids don’t have any, but we start teaching them very early. Most first sons are given dad’s first gun between age 4 and 12, depending on their family tradition.
I don’t doubt that probably because nearly every parent who has a 2 year old has a high chair but not every parent of a 2 year old has a gun so naturally the potential is much higher.

Perhaps incarceration or removing the other child from the home isn’t necessary but certainly they should never be allowed to possess a gun again.
Here, nearly every family with a 2 yr old owns a gun, and still it happens many more kids here are hurt by falls. First time in recent memory that it was a gun that hurt a kid. Personally I don’t own a high chair. I have 8 kids and have never used a high chair. My parents never used one either. We sat on mom or dads lap until we could sit in our own chair. It has nothing to do with safety just that it seems so unnecessary to spend that much money on something I can do without. Plus it’s one less thing to move every few years. And I dont know how the law works in other states, but in KY a judge cannot just take guns away. The US Constitution doesn’t allow that, and the KY state constitution doesn’t either.
 
The law doesn’t work that way.

You can’t suspend arbitrary legal rights (especially ones constitutionally protected) as punishment.

People convicted of voter fraud do not lose the right to vote, legally.

No judge in the world would say “no jail time, but you are no longer allowed to posses guns.”

Again, I am surprised people on a message board believe their outrage deserves an outlet, and that somehow, the punsihments they can come up with will somehow be worse than them losing a child.

The pain and grief will be with them until the day they die. Nothing you propose will even register relative to that.
Actually if you are convicted of voter fraud, that is a felony, which means in most states you do lose the right to vote.

Additionally, if they were convicted of a felony, even without being sentenced to jail time, they would not be allowed to own a firearm in the future.
 
Actually if you are convicted of voter fraud, that is a felony, which means in most states you do lose the right to vote.

Additionally, if they were convicted of a felony, even without being sentenced to jail time, they would not be allowed to own a firearm in the future.
No one said anything about a felony charge. He is arbitrarily making up sentences to avoid punishing the parents any further. That isn’t how the law works. There are charges and accompanying sentences that are possible.

I’ve never seen a person who isn’t convicted of a fellonious crime had a right unilaterally removed.
 
No one said anything about a felony charge. He is arbitrarily making up sentences to avoid punishing the parents any further. That isn’t how the law works. There are charges and accompanying sentences that are possible.

I’ve never seen a person who isn’t convicted of a fellonious crime had a right unilaterally removed.
Apparently you’ve never heard of this law:

womenandpolicing.com/gunban.asp

No need for a felony conviction and retroactive to those that plead guilty to misdemeanors years before the law a was passed.
 
Here, nearly every family with a 2 yr old owns a gun, and still it happens many more kids here are hurt by falls. First time in recent memory that it was a gun that hurt a kid. Personally I don’t own a high chair. I have 8 kids and have never used a high chair. My parents never used one either. We sat on mom or dads lap until we could sit in our own chair. It has nothing to do with safety just that it seems so unnecessary to spend that much money on something I can do without. Plus it’s one less thing to move every few years. And I dont know how the law works in other states, but in KY a judge cannot just take guns away. The US Constitution doesn’t allow that, and the KY state constitution doesn’t either.
I have no doubt that families in your particular area have guns around but if you did a national analysis it might skew differently.
 
Does anyone know what the gun laws are in Kentucky regarding securing firearms from children? I was just wondering if the parents broke a particular gun law by giving their 5 yr old possession of a gun to begin with, or if it was just purely negligence on the mother’s part.

I believe in my state, a homeowner with a gun is required to keep it locked up unloaded in a separate safe from the ammo. And the ammo has to be locked too. Even if you don’t have children, just in case a child visits your house. I don’t know if there is a particular law about having to be a certain age to learn to shoot a gun though.
I disagree. I keep a firearm in my home for protection from criminals who may wish to enter my home to rob me or worse. (I am an adult who lives alone, with no children by the way)
Keeping a gun locked up and the ammo locked up separately totally defeats the purpose of having a gun for home protection. If a person is smashing my window in while I’m home, I have maybe 30 seconds to a minute to respond before the person reaches me. I don’t have 4-5 minutes to unlock my gun, my ammo, and then try to load it before being able to shoot.
 
Mop buckets aren’t designed to kill people. Lawnmowers aren’t designed to kill people. Medications and cleaning supplies are not designed to kill people. Even poisons are not designed to kill people (bugs and critters yes). Only guns are specifically designed to kill PEOPLE. A five year old can barley tie his shoes. Yet you see nothing wrong with giving something designed to kill to a child like that.

I don’t what age is appropriate for a child to have a gun at, but I know it isn’t 5.
Guns aren’t designed to specifically kill only people. They are also used for hunting. To kill animals for food.
 
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