A Former Nun's Memoirs Rock India's Catholic Church

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dale_M
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
D

Dale_M

Guest
After 26 years as a nun, Jesme Raphael gave up her robes and walked out of the Congregation of the Mother of Carmel, the Catholic order in Kerala, India, that had been her home for three decades. Two years later, Raphael, now 53, has come out with her memoirs, Amen: An Autobiography of A Nun, cataloging lurid details of bullying, sexual abuse and homosexuality in the oldest Catholic women’s order in the idyllic coastal state in southern India. Shocking as it is, the book is only the latest in a long series of accusations and scandals afflicting the Catholic Church in the state with the largest population of Christians in India.
Click to expand...
A spokesperson for the Syro-Malabar order of the Catholic Church, Father Paul Thelakkat, adds that Raphael’s allegations stem from “some wounded feelings” which Raphael should have raised with the church instead of “maligning the life of religious nuns”. He goes on to add that Raphael’s allegations are “not especially serious”. “The church never claims there’s no sin within the church,” he says. “We’re not angels, we’re human beings of flesh and blood, so some omissions and failures can happen. But the church is perennially on a path of renewal and reformation; we’re trying to deal with these problems and such allegations.”
Click to expand...
In recent months, the church has been more forthcoming about the problems it faces. Sathyadeepam, Kerala’s Catholic weekly, released a report in January that said almost 20% of the region’s nuns — the church says there are about 45,000 — feel “insecure or unaccepted” in their convents. Cases of nuns speaking up like Raphael are still rare, but there may be an avalanche building up due to the changing social scene. Earlier, girls from disadvantaged families embraced the vows, finding that life in a convent, while hard, saved them from the worst of deprivation. But once in an order, they found it difficult to complain or leave. “They simply had nowhere to go,” says Pulikunnel, “If they quit the convent, they’d be thrown out penniless, and their families wouldn’t take them back.”
Click to expand...
The article goes on to say that times have changed and that women have more employment options now and there is less shame in leaving religious life.

time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1882176,00.html?xid=rss-topstories
 
I question this on its face. Its too easy to hide behind anonymity?
 
The Catholic church is in trouble already in India. Shrinking as a percentage of the population. Overall Chritians are steady as a percentage but that is from the growth of pentecostal Chritianity in India.
 
Dale_M said:
I don’t understand your objection. Who is being anonymous? The ex-nun is named, as is the author of the article.
Click to expand...
Exactly.

Remember all the defense of the LofC despite daunting evidence something was amiis.

The scandals are rampant and run the world.

At some point, as a few orthodox Catholic believers are starting to do, you need to investigate the history, the facts, the witness of the Catholic church. And be open, one has to die to self especially if brought up Catholic, that Catholicsm may not be true.
 
rien said:
Exactly.

Remember all the defense of the LofC despite daunting evidence something was amiis.

The scandals are rampant and run the world.

At some point, as a few orthodox Catholic believers are starting to do, you need to investigate the history, the facts, the witness of the Catholic church. And be open, one has to die to self especially if brought up Catholic, that Catholicsm may not be true.
Click to expand...
To point out that there are scandals in the Church is nothing new. As it turns out in fact, the Church is full of sinners. But to go from that point to saying that the Catholicism may not be true is illogical. Or perhaps you are going to point out to me the Church that has no sinners.
 
Goodness, Jesus didn’t give up Judaism because of sinful Jews. 😦
 
rien said:
Exactly.

Remember all the defense of the LofC despite daunting evidence something was amiis.

The scandals are rampant and run the world.

At some point, as a few orthodox Catholic believers are starting to do, you need to investigate the history, the facts, the witness of the Catholic church. And be open, one has to die to self especially if brought up Catholic,** that Catholicsm may not be true**.
Click to expand...
If Catholicism is not true, than Christianity as a whole is false. Where does that take us. All other Christian sects are spin offs of the one true Church. i.e., The Catholic Church founded by Jesus himself.
 
rien said:
Exactly.

Remember all the defense of the LofC despite daunting evidence something was amiis.

The scandals are rampant and run the world.

At some point, as a few orthodox Catholic believers are starting to do, you need to investigate the history, the facts, the witness of the Catholic church. And be open, one has to die to self especially if brought up Catholic, that Catholicsm may not be true.
Click to expand...
Bad behavior has nothing to do with Catholicism being true or untrue. The teachings of the Church and Sacraments are either true or untrue. One’s response to the teachings and Sacraments is their own responsibility.

Christ told us there would be rogues within His Church. Those who seek to justify being out of God’s Church because of the behaviors of some within the Church neither understand what God has created, nor witness to it.
 
MDK said:
Do you seek to justify being fallen away by others falling away?
Click to expand...
No, I am not trying to undermine anyone’s faith. I post news about the Church, both positive and negative, when I find it. Considering the article appeared in Time Magazine, its getting widespread attention. I think it a good thing that we discuss it here.
MDK said:
Where will you all be together when the judgment comes… smoking or non smoking?
Click to expand...
That really is up to God. He saw fit to remove my faith in the Church. If he wants me back in the Catholic Church, he will lead me back. If he wants me in a different church, he will lead me there. Right now, I have no place to go. Despite my lack of faith in it, and lack of trust in some if its teachings, I have a large reservoir of good feeling for the Catholic Church. This is only natural after 30 adult years as a Catholic.
 
Ah yes. The old “Judas proves Jesus was a fraud argument.”

Didn’t hold much water 2,000 years ago, doesn’t hold now.
 
Dale_M said:
No, I am not trying to undermine anyone’s faith. I post news about the Church, both positive and negative, when I find it. Considering the article appeared in Time Magazine, its getting widespread attention. I think it a good thing that we discuss it here.

That really is up to God. He saw fit to remove my faith in the Church. If he wants me back in the Catholic Church, he will lead me back. If he wants me in a different church, he will lead me there. Right now, I have no place to go. Despite my lack of faith in it, and lack of trust in some if its teachings, I have a large reservoir of good feeling for the Catholic Church. This is only natural after 30 adult years as a Catholic.
Click to expand...
That’s not what I asked.

God did not remove your faith in the Church! You have free will and did it yourself. Don’t blame God for your own choices or lack of faith!
 
MDK said:
God did not remove your faith in the Church! You have free will and did it yourself.
Click to expand...
Now, how would you know that?

My loss of faith in the Church was sudden, like a light switch being turned off. It wasn’t something I chose - it was a startling revelation that struck me while working on something completely unrelated. I immediately tried my old stand-by argument of why the Church would have been founded by Jesus and why it would overseen by the Holy Spirit. But it had no resonance, no conviction.

My faith in the Catholic Church was taken away from me. I can only assume that there is a reason for its removal.
 
Dale_M said:
My faith in the Catholic Church was taken away from me. I can only assume that there is a reason for its removal.
Click to expand...
Perhaps too much listening to the fallen angel on the wrong shoulder?? 😉

In all seriousness, God is a pretty consistent guy. 2,000 years ago He shocked and appalled His people by coming as a penniless carpenter’s son of no apparent import when they were expecting a king/conquerer. Today He continues to come to us via flawed and imperfect sinners and we continue to be appalled at God’s bad judgement.

But the reality is that it is all to the greater glory of God that He can do great works of strength THROUGH the weakness of mankind.
 
The article says that many poor young women would enter the convent to escape poverty.

Imagine an insitution full of people who joined only to escape poverty (without a real vocation) and where chasity is required and there is strict obedience required and it is closed off from the outside world. It’s not hard to imagine abuses becoming a problem.

People shouldn’t enter religious life unless they are called to it by God. I don’t see how this scandal reflects in any way on people who have a legitmate call to be a nun. It’s about the abuses of pretenders who joined to escape poverty.
 
Dale_M said:
That really is up to God. He saw fit to remove my faith in the Church. If he wants me back in the Catholic Church, he will lead me back. If he wants me in a different church, he will lead me there. Right now, I have no place to go. Despite my lack of faith in it, and lack of trust in some if its teachings, I have a large reservoir of good feeling for the Catholic Church. This is only natural after 30 adult years as a Catholic.
Click to expand...
Oh spare us this misguided criticism…as if you’re the only living human in this world without any factors to influence you, like the media, the people around you, your ignorance, etc…

Is it possible that you’re responsible for the lost of your faith ??

Quit playing the blame game and try to ‘disect’ yourself for once and see where you screw up.
 
rien said:
Exactly.

Remember all the defense of the LofC despite daunting evidence something was amiis.

The scandals are rampant and run the world.

At some point, as a few orthodox Catholic believers are starting to do, you need to investigate the history, the facts, the witness of the Catholic church. And be open, one has to die to self especially if brought up Catholic, that Catholicsm may not be true.
Click to expand...
How the heck did you come up with this outrageous conclusion !??

What is true then…you…your minuscule opinion ??

The Catholic Church is a divine hospital for sick souls, yeah, like you and me. Some just more sicko than others.
 
rien said:
The Catholic church is in trouble already in India. Shrinking as a percentage of the population. Overall Chritians are steady as a percentage but that is from the growth of pentecostal Chritianity in India.
Click to expand...
If the Catholic Church is shrinking, which, in fact it is not, it might be due to the wholesale slaughter of Christians there by Hindus.

If you want to make such assertions, back them up with citations and links to reliable demographic data.
 
cathgal said:
Oh spare us this misguided criticism…as if you’re the only living human in this world without any factors to influence you, like the media, the people around you, your ignorance, etc…
Click to expand...
I have offered no criticism. I am not sure why you say I have.
cathgal said:
Is it possible that you’re responsible for the lost of your faith ??

Quit playing the blame game and try to ‘disect’ yourself for once and see where you screw up.
Click to expand...
Its entirely possible that I am responsible for my missing faith. But I have been completely honest with the people here, and with God. And I pray daily that he make his will known to me. Its entirely possible this is just a very bad desert experience.

But this thread isn’t about me - we really are off-topic. Someone picked up that my profile describes myself as a “fallen away Catholic” and s/he decided to make an issue of it. I’m sorry that it has taken away from the discussion.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top