A personal relationship with Jesus

[ndeparis88]

I agree. I think that it’s used today to water down Christianity. Like someone can be a friend or a Father to you they really can’t be both in the literal retaliation sense. We are co-workers of God. We get to participate in his redemptive mission.

 

[JonNC]

It’s not that I’m not thankful for God’s love for me, and it’s not that I don’t want to follow Him. I do, even though the world drags me down.

But this phrase… ueeegh. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I know we are to be thankful for God’s goodness, and love His goodness by obeying Him. But is that really the same thing as a “personal relationship”? To me it comes off as being Christ’s “buddy”, and Christ is your “buddy”. (If you’ve ever seen the “Buddy Christ” statue from Dogma, maybe you understand why I grimace in disgust at the idea.)

I get seeing God as a father. Yes, you can enjoy your time with God. No, you don’t always have to be in abject fear and terror and solemnity. Or say the Rosary or the Liturgy of the Hours. I get that. At the same time… I don’t see my God or my father the way I’d see my friends. A father is a person you listen to, respect, and obey out of gratitude and a desire to serve. I would die for my father.

A “personal relationship” seems too informal to me. I need a guide. A director. A father. Not a “personal relationship”.

It seems to me that when you receive the Eucharist, that’s pretty personal. Yes? And Christ is truly our brother, and that’s pretty personal too. yes?
But in the larger sense, I feel that the personal relationship language sounds kind of isolating. Whereas, communion of saints seems to provide a strengthening in numbers.

One doesn’t hear the personal relationship approach much in Lutheranism, for whatever reason, so I’m rather unconfortable with it, too.

Jon

 

[Cat]

Our Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI, has often spoken of the importance of a “personal relationship with Jesus Christ.”

Good enough for him, good enough for me!

But if the phrase makes you feel uncomfortable, I wouldn’t stress about it. The phrase doesn’t appear in the Bible at all.

 

[TarkanAttila]

It seems to me that when you receive the Eucharist, that’s pretty personal. Yes? And Christ is truly our brother, and that’s pretty personal too. yes?

This is a good point. I have nothing against this kind of intimacy, and this kind of brotherhood.

But in the larger sense, I feel that the personal relationship language sounds kind of isolating. Whereas, communion of saints seems to provide a strengthening in numbers.

One doesn’t hear the personal relationship approach much in Lutheranism, for whatever reason, so I’m rather unconfortable with it, too.

Jon

Thinking about these words, I think the problem may be the source of said message. It seems to me the main people who peddle this message are non-denominational Christians. Not that I have anything personally wrong with non-denoms… but… I dunno. The “me and Jesus” attitude makes me wary.

It feels like the people who say it think I think I put my Church between me and Jesus. Like I’m hiding from the “real” Jesus who you can just reach out to and touch.

Some people do do that, but I really do believe Christ gave us the Catholic Church, and it is the path to Jesus and to Heaven. You can certainly talk directly to God. I do it now and then. But there are things He does want us to do, like go to Mass and receive Him. And if we love Him, and know He has our interests in mind, we’ll gladly listen to Him and obey Him.

And I do believe to get the fullness of Christ’s message, you must listen to the Catholic Church, and understand you must obey her. For she speaks for God, and has our best interest in mind. You don’t have to be a Catholic to ascend to Heaven. But everyone will be Catholic in Heaven. And God is the Pope of all Popes.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I see Awe with God, confounding, and profound with Jesus, then clarity through the Saints and they too are deeply respected. Its all Amazing.

 

[MrsFlapjack]

My parents are really into the,“All you need is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ”, belief. They quit going to church about 10 years ago, but since the “personal relationship” thing is all the matters to them, they see nothing wrong with it. As long as you pray and read your Bible regularly, it’s all you need. They despise Protestant denominations and it is the main reason they quit attending church. At the same time, they are serious Sola Scriptura folks and look at Catholics as slaves to the Pope.

Having a personal relationship with Christ is a good thing, but you are missing out on so much by sticking your head in the sand like that. Like someone mentioned, you are all alone. It’s just between you and God. The communion of saints is one of the things that I love so much about the Catholic Church!

 

[LowerCasec]

I have a personal relationship with my earthly father, why not with my Savior?

This term has become “Christianese” but don’t let it distract you from its significance. The intention is to demonstrate how all encompassing Jesus is upon our lives. I think it’s safe to say the disciples had a personal relationship with Jesus, and as one, you have one too.

 

[Nicea325]

It’s not that I’m not thankful for God’s love for me, and it’s not that I don’t want to follow Him. I do, even though the world drags me down.

But this phrase… ueeegh. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I know we are to be thankful for God’s goodness, and love His goodness by obeying Him. But is that really the same thing as a “personal relationship”? To me it comes off as being Christ’s “buddy”, and Christ is your “buddy”. (If you’ve ever seen the “Buddy Christ” statue from Dogma, maybe you understand why I grimace in disgust at the idea.)

I get seeing God as a father. Yes, you can enjoy your time with God. No, you don’t always have to be in abject fear and terror and solemnity. Or say the Rosary or the Liturgy of the Hours. I get that. At the same time… I don’t see my God or my father the way I’d see my friends. A father is a person you listen to, respect, and obey out of gratitude and a desire to serve. I would die for my father.

A “personal relationship” seems too informal to me. I need a guide. A director. A father. Not a “personal relationship”.

It reminds me of the many parents who tell me: I am my daughter’s best friend! Ah no! You are her mother and she needs a parent,not a friend. Where in the heck does such a belief come from?

 

[TimothyH]

I agree. I think that it’s used today to water down Christianity. Like someone can be a friend or a Father to you they really can’t be both in the literal retaliation sense. We are co-workers of God. We get to participate in his redemptive mission.

Jesus was both fully human and fully God. Some have a high Christology view of Jesus and tend to focus on his divinity. Others tend to have a low-Christology view of Jesus and thend to focus more on his humanity.

Our primary focus - hunanity or divinity - is a product of our personality, upbringing, and a whole host of other factors which influence the way we think. Niether view is wrong but what we have to be careful of is focusing on one aspect of Jesus - his humanity or his divinity - to the complete exclusion of the other. Focusing on Jesus’ divinity to the exclusion of his humanity can lead to scrupulosity and dispair. Focusing only on Jesus’ humanity can cause us to ignore God’s justice and that is simply foolishness.

I personally have a very high-Christology personality. To me, Jesus is a king. But we cannot fault people for having a low-Christology view of Jesus, as long as they don’t deny Jesus’ divinity and all if the implication which flow from it.

-Tim-

 

[Nicea325]

I have a personal relationship with my earthly father, why not with my Savior?

This term has become “Christianese” but don’t let it distract you from its significance. The intention is to demonstrate how all encompassing Jesus is upon our lives. I think it’s safe to say the disciples had a personal relationship with Jesus, and as one, you have one too.

I am sorry,but that seems to much like: Me & Jesus only! Our relationships should extend much further than just me & Jesus. Yes Jesus had a personal relationship with the 12,but he also had it with all of humanity.

 

[LowerCasec]

I didn’t claim that Jesus wasn’t in relationship with mankind.

The prodigal son was still in relationship with his Father even while he was out squandering his wealth.

 

[Nicea325]

I didn’t claim that Jesus wasn’t in relationship with mankind.

The prodigal son was still in relationship with his Father even while he was out squandering his wealth.

I understand what you are saying.

 

[TimothyH]

I have a personal relationship with my earthly father, why not with my Savior?

This term has become “Christianese” but don’t let it distract you from its significance. The intention is to demonstrate how all encompassing Jesus is upon our lives. I think it’s safe to say the disciples had a personal relationship with Jesus, and as one, you have one too.

Having a personal relationship with Christ is not un-Catholic.

Whoever has my commandments and observes them is the one who loves me. And whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and reveal myself to him.” Judas, not the Iscariot, said to him, “Master, [then] what happened that you will reveal yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus answered and said to him, “Whoever loves me will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our dwelling with him (John 14:21-23)*

A personal relationship with Christ is an abiding presence of Christ in your life. It is the presence of God in your body, your heart and and in your day to day life which you can feel. It is visceral.

Many of the saints speak of an abiding presence in their life, a feeling that God is abiding within them, directing them, and operating in a very powerful way in their day to day life. It takes docility to the Holy Spirit to feel this way but I have felt it myself for extended periods of time.

It feels like a state of constant prayer, where you can’t get God out of your mind. One is in a constant state of converation with God, even in the middle of business meetings and sometimes even when sleeping. It is a wonderful place to be.

Some non-Catholics claim that Catholics don’t have a “Personal relationsiship” with Jesus and they often use the idea of a personal relationship with Jesus in some pretty absurd ways. I point to the book "The Practice of the Presence of God by Brother Lawrence, written in the late 1600’s and the writings of Diadochus of Photikë from the fifth century. These and many other works speak to the idea of an abiding presence of Jesus in our lives, what many non-Catholics call “A personal relationship” with Christ.

Heck, that was the whole point of the Desert Fathers - the guys second, third and fourth centuries who wandered off into the desert in order to free themselves from the world and grow closer to God. A personal relationship to Christ is the whole point of monasticism and contemplative prayer. Catholics invented the idea. We just call it different names.

-Tim-

 

[snarflemike]

I have a personal relationship with my earthly father, why not with my Savior?

I think the unease is that we would never say to our father “Dad, I’m so glad I have a personal relationship with you.” I find it strangely dry and somehow IMpersonal. But maybe that’s just me.

 

[TimothyH]

I am sorry,but that seems to much like: Me & Jesus only! Our relationships should extend much further than just me & Jesus. Yes Jesus had a personal relationship with the 12,but he also had it with all of humanity.

And we should have a personal relationship with Him.

We should tell Jesus every day that we love him. We should tell him our problems, ask him for help, and thank him every morning for giving us life and breath. We should ask him to watch over us with our last thought of the day. And we should take time every day to listen for his voice.

Taking time to love each other and to speak with each other is what people in relationships do. We call it prayer. There is nothing un-Catholic about it.

-Tim-

 

[Edmundus1581]

Jesus was both fully human and fully God. Some have a high Christology view of Jesus and tend to focus on his divinity. Others tend to have a low-Christology view of Jesus and thend to focus more on his humanity.

**Our primary focus - hunanity or divinity - is a product of our personality, upbringing, and a whole host of other factors which influence the way we think. **Niether view is wrong but what we have to be careful of is focusing on one aspect of Jesus - his humanity or his divinity - to the complete exclusion of the other. Focusing on Jesus’ divinity to the exclusion of his humanity can lead to scrupulosity and dispair. Focusing only on Jesus’ humanity can cause us to ignore God’s justice and that is simply foolishness.

**I personally have a very high-Christology personality. **To me, Jesus is a king. But we cannot fault people for having a low-Christology view of Jesus, as long as they don’t deny Jesus’ divinity and all if the implication which flow from it.

-Tim-

I agree with all this. I personally find that a high-Christology or low-Christology emphasis can also change during the course of one’s life, as experiences lead us to new insights, or even correct, somewhat painfully, an imbalance. When I was a new convert I was very much “high-Christological”, then after a few years I was told, somewhat sternly, by a priest that I needed to find a “personal relationship” with Christ. He mentioned that he himself had only discovered a personal relationship after many years in the priesthood. That was a powerful second conversion for me, and became my emphasis for the next 20 years. These days I am heading back, somewhat, to a higher Christological emphasis, without discarding me previous experiences.

I also value your other post, where you point out that many saints over the centuries have sought a personal relationship, without using those words. This is the basis of contemplative prayer and many religious orders. The ascetics of the early Church stand out as people who were extreme (in a good way) in seeking the face of the living God.

 

[LowerCasec]

This phrase is probably an answer to non-believers who think church is just something you do. Where they may reply, “I can stand up and sit down multiple times at a sporting event why would I do it at church?” Perhaps pointing out the type of relationship helped communicate the error of this type of thinking.

By the way, I’m really feeling the love in this thread. Preach on!

 

[Janderich]

Henry Drummond once addressed this very topic. He speaks of making Christ our most constant companion, our Friend. Is this too simplistic? He starts by addressing the contrary opinion:

Then you reduce religion to a common Friendship? A common Friendship - who talks of a common Friendship? There is no such thing in the world. On earth no word is more sublime. Friendship is the nearest thing we know to what religion is. God is love. And to make religion akin to Friendship is simply to give it the highest expression conceivable by man. But if by demurring to “a common friendship” is meant a protest against the greatest and the holiest in religion being spoken of in intelligible terms, then I am afraid the objection is all too real. Men always look for a mystery when one talks of sanctification; some mystery apart from that which must ever be mysterious wherever Spirit works. …Thousands of persons go to church every Sunday hoping to solve this mystery. At meetings, at conferences, many a time they have reached what they thought was the very brink of it, but somehow no further revelation came. Pouring over religious books, how often were they not within a paragraph of it; the next page, the next sentence, would discover all, and they would be borne on a flowing tide forever. But nothing happened. …Why did it elude them? Because there was no “it.” When shall we learn that the pursuit of holiness is simply the pursuit of Christ? When shall we substitute for the “it” of a fictitious aspiration, the approach to a Living Friend? (The Changed Live p27)

Christ when speaking to his disciples even tells them they are his friends. “Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. Henceforth I call you not servants: for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth; but I have called you freinds; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.” (John 15:13-15) Christ applies the term to his followers, I feel safe in approaching him the same way.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Spiritual Tips from Father John Hardon

As a catechist, and therefore teacher of the Faith to others, you should have a deep understanding of the Faith yourself. There is no better way of growing in your grasp of the Faith than by meditating on the Apostles’ Creed.

Focus on one article of the Creed for each month of the year, from January through December. Repeat the process the each year. During the month of January, for example, prayerfully meditate on the meaning of the First Article. Ask Our Lord daily for the grace to better appreciate what it means to declare, “I believe in God the Father Almighty, Creator of Heaven and earth.”

Each day, if only for a few minutes, read a passage or two from the Bible which tells about God’s power in creating the world and keeping it in existence (e…g., Job 38, 39), or about the majesty of God revealed in the works of Creation (e.g., Psalm 8). Memorize short verses from Sacred Scripture which address God as Creator and Lord. The Psalms are filled with such acts of adoration.

Form the habit of frequently thanking God, if only in a word, for His countless gifts and blessings.

Make acts of humility during the day, recalling and reflecting on the fact that, except for God, we would not exist. For example, simply pray, “My Lord, You are everything, and I am nothing.”

Several times a day, slowly and prayerfully recite the Glory Be to the Father…

When you make the Sign of the Cross, think of what you are saying – that you are making an act of faith in the Holy Trinity.

Daily recite a short prayer to your Guardian Angel.

Daily recite the prayer to St. Michael the Archangel.

Cultivate the habit of often using the name Jesus in silent prayer. When you get up in the morning and retire at night, invoke His Holy Name. And during the day, learn to associate whatever you are doing with a moment’s prayerful aspiration, pronouncing the word, Jesus. If you do this, you will not only grow in your belief that Jesus is indeed God Who become Man; you will experience the spiritual power that is available to those who call upon Him in faith.

Peace

 

[Kristin234]

I pray to Him every time I get a chance. I seek comfort in Him. I rejoice in Him. He is my guidance. I love Him. My life revolves around Him. I worship Him.

I most definitely have a personal relationship with my God and I am not ashamed or disturbed with that saying. The amazing thing about our God is that He is the one who made it possible for us to have that kind of relationship through His Son.

If you feel uncomfortable then don’t say it, but I am left in awe everyday knowing that God loves us so much not only does He want us to worship Him but He wants us to love Him and get to know Him. That is a relationship.