A question for all Protestants being lead by the Holy Spirit

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Bill_Pick

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If the meaning of the Bible is so clear-----so easliy interpreteted==and the Holy Spirit leads every Christian to interpret it for themselves,then why are there over 36,000 non-catholic church and millions protestants ,all interpreting the Bible differently
 
Protestants get annoyed with this 30-36,000 claim because many denominations fall under groups that are doctrinally related, making the number inaccurate. The best they can reduce it to is about 4000 denominations, and I would cut that in half just to give them the benefit of the doubt, and call it 2000 denominations. The way I see it, 2000 is just as scandalous as 36,000, so it’s better to just use the term “thousands” of denominations, and not give any number to it.

You risk becoming arrogant because the spirit filled Protestant feels as though his religious experience is being negated with this challenge. What you are negating is the principle of private judgement, not a persons personal religious convictions. Protestants have the Holy Spirit, but their communion with the Church is incomplete.

The answer to the OP question for Catholics should be obvious. “clearness of scripture” is not in scripture, private interpretation of scripture is against scripture, and scripture tells us the Magisterium and Tradition cannot be separated from Scripture.

I think that sola scriptura has greatly contributed to the fragmentation of Protestantism right from its inception. So what has been the basis for Catholic unity for 1500 years before the revolt and after? Is it because we don’t need to think on what the scriptures mean, and we “agree” by default of the Magisterium? No. Catholic unity is based on the Eucharist. That is what keeps us as One Body.

IMO, sola scriptura is the secondary cause of disunity among Protestants.

The first cause is they have no Eucharist.
 
Many major protestant denominations celebrate the Eucharist, you make really large assumptions by saying that’s why there is fragmentation but clearly it is not the Eucharist.
 
Bill,

Why are you obsessed with protestants and their beliefs? Not that I care, but wow, whats up with you? Lonely with nothing to do and no one to do it with?
 
It is certainly an assumption that the lack of the Eucharist is the primary factor for Protestant splintering, but not because Protestant communities have it, but because we simply do not know if it is the primary factor. It is true, however, that there are some denominations that are in schism that do have the Eucharist. And there are many others that think they do.

Their deciding that they have the Eucharist is fundamentally no different than their deciding that the Holy Spirit has provided them with the fullness of the truth.
 
Jon_Hus said:
Bill,

Why are you obsessed with protestants and their beliefs? Not that I care, but wow, whats up with you? Lonely with nothing to do and no one to do it with?
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Jon,what do you not understans,do you need some help…I do not have any obessed with the protestants it what they believe,it like SS it is wrong
 
Where in scriptures does it tell each individual that they will be led by the Holy Spirit, in reference to understanding scriptures?
 
Gene_Church said:
It is certainly an assumption that the lack of the Eucharist is the primary factor for Protestant splintering, but not because Protestant communities have it, but because we simply do not know if it is the primary factor. It is true, however, that there are some denominations that are in schism that do have the Eucharist. And there are many others that think they do.

Their deciding that they have the Eucharist is fundamentally no different than their deciding that the Holy Spirit has provided them with the fullness of the truth.
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Well said, Gene. I would hope to focus on what works and why, rather than what others may or may not have. What is it about Holy Communion that makes us one body? Since the Eucharist flows from the Incarnation and Crucifixion, what happens when you insert substitutional atonement? You end up with limitations on the incarnation principle. You have bread made from stones. So what is it about the Real Substantial Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist that brings us closer together as a family here on earth?
 
kepha1 said:
Well said, Gene. I would hope to focus on what works and why, rather than what others may or may not have. What is it about Holy Communion that makes us one body? Since the Eucharist flows from the Incarnation and Crucifixion, what happens when you insert substitutional atonement? You end up with limitations on the incarnation principle. You have bread made from stones. So what is it about the Real Substantial Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist that brings us closer together as a family here on earth?
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The challenge of threads like this is that you are trying to throw all protestants in together. There is no single rule for this kind of stuff amongst all denominations. Not to generalize completely but I have observed this as a recurring event among Catholic members of this forum.
 
It may be a question of degree it appears. Those who adhere to Tradition and Scripture also disagree. I can be said that it does not occur as MUCH. However, Tradition and Scripture does not equal consensus.:cool:
 
Bill_Pick said:
Jon,what do you not understans,do you need some help…I do not have any obessed with the protestants it what they believe,it like SS it is wrong
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Bill, I guess this is not one of your “good” days. Or perhaps I don’t understands? I just don’t get its.
 
it doesn’t matter if there are 5, or 30,000 or 1million protestant denominations

if all are guided by the Holy Spirit, there should be just one and the same interpretation of Scripture
 
choy said:
it doesn’t matter if there are 5, or 30,000 or 1million protestant denominations

if all are guided by the Holy Spirit, there should be just one and the same interpretation of Scripture
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I would never say that all groups are led by the Holy Spirit. But this works both ways, there are groups that rely on Tradition and Sacred Scripture. IF this is applicable to people who adhere to SS, it is also applicable to other groups as well.
In other words, this is not a good argument to use against Sola Scriptura (which I do not agree with anyway) because it is also applicable against groups that do not. Do groups that do not adhere to Sola Scriptura have complete agreement? 🤷
So someone will say they get along better than people who adhere to SS. So then, all that might prove is that Tradition and Scripture do not lead to AS MUCH division.
If there is a reason to not be consistent, please show me. Otherwise it might sound good but it really is not logical.
 
choy said:
it doesn’t matter if there are 5, or 30,000 or 1million protestant denominations

if all are guided by the Holy Spirit, there should be just one and the same interpretation of Scripture
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Just because you want things to be simple does not make it so. You trivialize things by trying to make them so black and white.
 
If more than one group invalidates SS, than more than one group also invalidates Tradition/Scripture:shrug:
If not, why?
I want this question answered if possible.
 
Jon_Hus said:
Bill, I guess this is not one of your “good” days. Or perhaps I don’t understands? I just don’t get its.
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Jon, All my days are good days,what is it you do not …What are you looking for,maybe we can help
 
BrianH said:
If more than one group invalidates SS, than more than one group also invalidates Tradition/Scripture:shrug:
If not, why?
I want this question answered if possible.
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We are talking about truth. Truth is not divided into more than one meaning and still remains truth.

The problem lies within those claiming sola scriptura and ignore scriptures that support tradition, whether by word or epistle.

I’ve asked the question, ‘Where in scriptures does it tell each individual that they will be led by the Holy Spirit, in reference to understanding scriptures?’ It receives no attention, because when reading in context, that Holy Spirit guidance was not told that every single individual would receive it. Those promises were made ONLY to the Apostles, chose and appointed by Christ.
 
The OP, in an moment of absolute sobriety asked a question: **A question for all Protestants being lead by the Holy Spirit **

Setting aside for a moment that by definition, a Holy God such as the one we have is not going to lead those of whom are not of the redeemed. Here is his amazingly thoughtful question:

*If the meaning of the Bible is so clear-----so easliy interpreteted==and the Holy Spirit leads every Christian to interpret it for themselves,then why are there over 36,000 non-catholic church and millions protestants ,all interpreting the Bible differently *

In what looks like a rhetorical question to the untrained eye: If the meaning of the Bible is so clear-----so easliy interpreteted with a tag-a-long qualifier ***and the Holy Spirit *** which is not in fact a repeat of the title of the work by the venerable Pick but rather a cleaver play-on-words to confuse and befuddle the spiritual adolescents on this board, we finally come to the unspoken “meat” of the essay, and that is this. Allow me restate a statement [of fact] posing as a question…

Since there are 36 million, no, make that 36 trillion protestant church, one for every 10 protestants on the planet, the Roman Catholic Church must be the one true Church. So there you have it. Simple.

But we are left with that one word in an otherwise masterful piece, a word that sticks out like a sore thumb…and that word is…why? Why all these protestant church? Why, Why, Why? Does anyone really know why? Why on earth are there so many, up to one gazillion protestant church out there? Think about it. A three letter word that raises so much concern to Mr. Pick. Why? And so Mr. Pick askes the question when he looks in the mirror, why me? Why must I carry the burden of answering one of lifes most pressing questions…why so many protestant chuch? And only 1 on the Roman side. Why?
 
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