Abortion, Holocaust and Genocide

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Nonetheless, laws need to change. We in the US and Canada have laws matching China and North Korea. We have funded Third World children being aborted. This is not right and people need to take that into account. No funding to abort in Haiti, in Africa, in Central America and so on.

Along with, really, the demographic bigotry at stake, Maybe up to half of all black unborn being aborted though they are 12-14% of the population. Inner cities will be troubled as long as life is treated as disposable.

One can check abortion laws, France, 12 weeks, in that vicinity but our laws? Right up until birth. US laws are barbaric.

And I will not vote for politicians that would have us abort the unborn in Kenya, in Honduras, in Haiti. This is actually pretty sinister but some politicians do have us aborting children from overseas. I will not vote for this and if you are voting for it and enabling it, you should know. One party does not want to change these things. Again, that’s sinister so it’s a whole lot more than saying “we need to change hearts”.
Inquisitor85 said:
How did the Prohibition of Alcohol work out? The same thing will happen with this, you’ll be allowing organised crime to have a new, incredibly lucrative market.
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How is it working out now? I’ve seen riots in the street and mainly affecting a minority where “Black Lives Matter” is shouted at protest, the principle starts early, not treating life as something to throw away. As long as life is treated this way, these communities will not get better. How about all of the deaths going on now on the street?

Per Lila Rose, activist:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1278072413499068416

So, this is is so much better? So organized crime will take this over?? Also ,that’s a misnomer, in the US, many of us wish to overturn Roe v. Wade, leave it up to the states as before. This does not mean abortion would become illegal over night. Each state would deal with it on their own. Not that Mississippi has laws like California or however. If a state wishes to outlaw it, it should be up to the state.

One could talk about changing laws but one party does not want to change laws at all but for them to be as lenient as possible.
 
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This is NOT what your church teaches. Your church teaches that we have a moral obligation to make abortion illegal.

Ireland is not the United States and I can cherry pick as many polls as you can showing the majority want it illegal. It also doesn’t matter what the people think. Just because people think it’s okay to murder doesn’t mean leaders shouldn’t make it illegal. And the United States doesn’t have nationwide referenda. That’s not how abortion became legal here, and it can’t stop abortion from being illegal.

 
What? Why? I was not attacking or abusing anyone.

Edit: I think I know why you think I was targeting you. I tagged you not because I was specifically targeting you but because it was meant to be a reply to your comment. When I accidentally reply to the thread and not a person’s comment I tag them at the end. You can look through my post history and see that. Sorry it seemed like I was saying you specifically were someone that didn’t care about abortion. I don’t know you and would never have made that judgment on you. Hopefully that clears it up
 
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If it’s the worst thing then why does God also take so many unborn lives?
 
HopingforGodtohelp said:
This is NOT what your church teaches. Your church teaches that we have a moral obligation to make abortion illegal.

Ireland is not the United States and I can cherry pick as many polls as you can showing the majority want it illegal. It also doesn’t matter what the people think. Just because people think it’s okay to murder doesn’t mean leaders shouldn’t make it illegal. And the United States doesn’t have nationwide referenda. That’s not how abortion became legal here, and it can’t stop abortion from being illegal.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/244709/pro-choice-pro-life-2018-demographic-tables.aspx
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I’m not a Catholic. And what the church teaches and what we do from a practical sense about abortion are two different things. As I said, making it illegal across the board is not going to be possible. I’m not ‘cherry picking’ polls. I’m showing you what people think of the subject (and the link you gave just confirms that).

You’d be better off spending your time and energy in reducing abortions.
 
You keep saying that making abortions illegal is impossible when it really isn’t. . . .
 
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Riman643 said:
You keep saying that making abortions illegal is impossible when it really isn’t. Peddle your abortions somewhere else. What do you gain from telling a bunch of Catholics they are wrong on a Catholic site?
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I’m not ‘peddling’ abortions and I strongly object to you using such terminology. I personally would prefer it there were zero abortions. But I live in the real world where I know that that will be literally impossible to attain.

If you want to spend your time trying to achieve that then that is your personal choice.
 
Inquisitor85 said:
How did the Prohibition of Alcohol work out? The same thing will happen with this, you’ll be allowing organised crime to have a new, incredibly lucrative market.
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That’s not a downside just a shift.
rosejmj said:
If it’s the worst thing then why does God also take so many unborn lives?
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You can say that about born people and that doesn’t justify anything.
 
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Riman643 said:
You live in a world where you are okay with the murder of children. Yeah peddle that somewhere else or at least don’t spread it here where you know no one agrees with you.
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There are a few people on this forum who take a position that trying to reduce abortions is somehow tacitly agreeing to all the ones that will take place. And because of that they will make reject any and all arguments put forward that attempt to reduce the numbers.

If that’s your position then so be it. But if it is your aim to reduce the numbers (short of making it illegal) then I will fully support you in that endeavour.
 
Riman643 said:
Save your support. Until you think children shouldn’t be murdered I don’t really care what you have to say tbh.
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Your posts in this thread and others are hyperbolic, rude towards other posters, and lack charity. I believe you either are perilously close to or already have breached the TOS. I’m not sure of your goal here on CAF, but insulting people and shutting down civil discourse won’t bring anyone over to your side. Try to understand from where people are coming and why they believe what they do. You don’t need to agree with it but any meaningful discussion is impossible when you double down and resort to black and white, ad hominem, simplistic reactions. Nearly everything resides in shades of grey and requires nuanced and thoughtful consideration.
 
Killing babies is one of the few things that actually does not exist in shades of gray.

What you are preaching is “tolerance.” The modern idea that everything should be “tolerated.” What the Christian religion is about is not tolerance, but love. And love requires truth. It’s not “lacking charity” to tell people saying that it shouldn’t be illegal to murder babies that they are gravely wrong. It’s telling them the truth. It’s far more loving than acting like everyone else is.
 
None of what I said was an ad hominem, hyperbolic, rude, or uncharitable. He said his stance and I said I don’t care for what someone who believes such things has to say. We discussed and learned each other’s perspective. I want the murders of babies illegal he doesn’t. We will just have to leave it at that. No hard feelings or I’ll-will and I am sure @Freddy would agree.
 
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I’m not preaching tolerance or anything else. I agree, abortion is wrong. What I’m saying is that how we discuss solutions requires intelligence, clarity, empathy, and above all else, charity. There are ways to reduce abortion and I don’t understand why Catholics and others against abortion cannot be civil and work the solutions towards a society that fosters life from conception to grave. What people are doing isn’t working. I suggest trying a different way. But I’m not going to further argue with anyone who chooses not to rationally problem solve to attain the goal of stopping abortion. I agree that abortion is wrong and the lack of intelligent and charitable discourse runs me off–people who are prolife or pro abortion won’t even stick around.

It is easy, but ineffective, to tell people they are wrong and brow beat your point.

It is difficult, but effective and influential, to intelligently engage and address the other position’s beliefs.

It is better to influence and teach, with a higher probability of achieving your goals than it is to talk at people, thus driving them away from considering your point of view. Telling someone they need to change is ineffective; whereas showing, guiding, and influencing can lead someone to repentance.
 
Riman643 said:
None of what I said was an ad hominem, hyperbolic, rude, or uncharitable. He said his stance and I said I don’t care for what someone who believes such things has to say. We discussed and learned each other’s perspective. I want the murders of babies illegal he doesn’t. We will just have to leave it at that. No hard feelings or I’ll-will and I am sure @Freddy would agree.
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I don’t think he said or suggested that. As far as I can tell his point is that the chances of getting abortion made illegal again is pretty remote but while it is still legal finding ways to reduce the number of abortions would be more appropriate.
 
I had explained to him many times that it is not that difficult for it to be made illegal again, but he refuses to acknowledge that. Even so his methods of reducing those abortions usually involve things that are morally repugnant.

@Freddy, imagine you have ultimate authority to outlaw abortion, do you do it?
 
Riman643 said:
I had explained to him many times that it is not that difficult for it to be made illegal again, but he refuses to acknowledge that.
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You mean, he has his own opinion on the subject, as you have yours. Despite you accusing him of “peddling abortions” and “thinking children should be murdered” when he’s done no such thing.

Generally speaking, false accusations don’t encourage people to change their minds. I guess YMMV, but I’ve never seen it work.
 
Riman643 said:
I had explained to him many times that it is not that difficult for it to be made illegal again
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Actually it is difficult because politicians generally don’t want it done as it is a vote loser.
Look at the Republicans who allegedly are against abortion. They had control of the house of representatives, the senate and the white house. Why didn’t they make abortion illegal?
 
Freddy said:
The people who vote. They decide. As they did in Ireland. The majority want it legal. And you need to know that the proportion of people who want it legal has always and is always rising.
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Says who?

It doesn’t take a genius to spot that if there is one part of the population who thinks it should be legal to kill babies, and then go and kill their own babies, and there is a part of the population that says, it should not be legal to kill your babies, and who refrain from killing their babies even if they have the legal right …

do the math, what do the demographics tell you?
 
Montrose said:
I don’t think he said or suggested that. As far as I can tell his point is that the chances of getting abortion made illegal again is pretty remote but while it is still legal finding ways to reduce the number of abortions would be more appropriate.
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Never give up hope.

How many people in Nazi Germany believed there would never be a time that killing Jews would be made illegal again?

Some people on this forum, had they been around back then, would be telling us a Jew is just a clump of human cells with a pointy nose and a hat.

How quickly things can change, ay?
 
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