About the Priest scandals

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Is it a priest scandal or a bishops scandal? 98% of priests have never been accused of a crime. However, this has been a public issue for twenty years and many bishops have attempted to obstruct and coverup.
 
When people say “I am losing my faith.” Are they saying that their copy of the Catechism is slowly shrinking?

Can we have a complete understanding?

I ask, with empathy, because it seems that it’s easy to make comparisons between ourselves and others and see ourselves as better than they.
Peace.
 
Zynxensar said:
Hello all,

I may be an anomaly but I don’t get why the priestly scandals have so much impact on some Catholics.
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Because some of us knew and trusted priests who are listed in the report.
It’s a gut punch when you find out the priest who presided over your wedding and later baptized your child is one of them.
 
Because it was a systemic issue that was at best ignored, but in many cases covered up, allowing abusive priests to continue to prey on parishioners for years. It’s a big deal. Making light of it only appears as if we are making excuses.
 
These guys have been here for decades and have been pulling out the kneelers and announcing that we won’t have kneeling in this diocese. They’ve pulled out the statues, taken down the stations of the cross. Removed the tabernacle. Tossed out the altar and put a wood table. Crucifixes have gone missing.

I have friends in their 80’s who remember when priests used to hear confessions every Saturday morning. Today, it’s by appointment only, and I’ve seen even before Christmas and Easter, they try to pick an evening and have 3 priests come for confessions, and it’s cancelled because they couldn’t find priests who would come.

The Catholic church has taught that homosexual tendencies were disordered. What we have seen in the last 50 years is homosexual men coming in, getting ordained, and tearing the place apart. The faithful have been grieved for years with these guys.

And it went on and on.

Men who attended daily mass, prayed the rosary, helped at a soup kitchen, likeable, got along with people, were deemed unsatisfactory by the bishop. They created the ‘priest shortage’.

No one has heard the cry of the faithful by the bishops for decades. But God knows and may those who have gone ahead, who remember confessions on Saturdays, pray for us to remain strong.

How do we evangelize now? We have become a laughing stock and our enemies smile. They have been smiling for a very long time now.

Now we hear a demand for married clergy. How about women priests?
More smiling by the enemy.
 
Rob2 said:
It puts the brakes on any attempts at evangelization .

Contrast the visit of Pope Francis to Ireland last month with that of Pope John Paul II in 1979 and you will see the scandal’s impact on the Church .
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For me, this is the 2nd biggest issue. Sex abuse is disgusting in itself and perhaps the 2nd worst crime after murdering one’s own child and/or spouse.

But when the clergy does it, it’s worse – ESP WITH TODAY’S MEDIA. When they get caught, everyone worldwide knows and it kills evangelization efforts.

The sex scandals of 2002 really hurt the Church and many people left the church after it. I personally know a few people who blame the scandals for why they left the church. The progress we made putting this behind us was really killed by the McCarrick situation. The PA Grand Jury was bad enough, but the McCarrick situation is far worse.

God Bless
 
I guess I am more forgiving, so it doesn’t bother me too much.
(Looks like I’m virtue signaling myself. 😒🍹)
 
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Seagull said:
300 Priest involved with over 1,000 victims -
that’s a lot of wolves among the flock - in one area.
They were ravenous too -
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First let me preface my remarks with the following: any priest who has committed sexual crimes deserves to burn in hell.

Now, let me address the number of priests in the PA Grand Jury report.

Jesus gave us the template of the clergy and warned us by picking Judas. If we assume 1 out of every 12 members of the clergy are actually wolves in sheep’s clothing (like Judas was) then that means that 8% of all seminarians, priests, and bishops are easily wolves in sheep’s clothing.

Let’s look at the number of priests in PA* in 1970 alone. In the all the PA dioceses which were part of the latest grand jury, there were 2640 priests in the year 1970. (* doesn’t include the Archdiocese of Philadelphia and the Diocese of Altoona-Johnstown because they were part of two earlier Grand Juries).

If we use the 1/12 wolves theory, then you have 211 priests those select PA dioceses in the year 1970 who were wolves. The fact that there were only 300 total across all the years of the study is not as bad as it could be.

Point is this: sex abuse is horrific and these clergy deserve to burn in hell. But the numbers of wolves in sheep’s clothing is actually in line with the 12 Apostles.

I think this is the real reason Jesus picked Judas. He didn’t need Judas for the Chief Priest to have Him killed. But He did need Judas to illustrate to us that there will always be wolves among the clergy in the Catholic Clergy. The devil always finds a way to sneak in some evil people to the priesthood.

So after all these years, after hearing so many people as “why did Jesus pick Judas?”, I think we finally have our answer. He picked Judas so we don’t leave the Catholic Church during scandals like the ones we have today.

God bless.
 
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Zynxensar said:
I may be an anomaly but I don’t get why the priestly scandals have so much impact on some Catholics. Jesus did say there will be some wolves among the flock so this shouldn’t come as a surprise. We just have to accept that there will be bad Priests and we’ll just need to pray and sacrifice for such to be dealt with. I don’t mean to offend anyone, just sharing my thoughts.
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So, I think there’s a lot of reasons. Among them, could be:
  1. People don’t realize that the truth of the Church is in her TEACHINGS, which are Christ’s teachings, not in the behavior of individual Popes, Bishops, Priests, Deacons, etc. Or they don’t have faith that the Sacraments are unique to the Church and have no equal anywhere. If we had faith in the people of the Church, this current scandal is the last in a long list of reasons to leave the Church. If Christ instituted the sacraments and placed them in HIS Church with all other copies being mere imitations, then you CAN’T leave the Church and not leave Christ. This is a hard, hard reality. And we know what happens when people come face to face with a hard reality.
  2. People are concerned that other people will think badly of them, make fun of them, talk about them if they stay within the “family” of the Church. That hurts, embarrasses, etc and they don’t want to feel that way.
  3. Remember the parable of the sower? “Some fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil. They sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow.But when the sun rose, the seedlings were scorched, and they withered because they had no root.” Some people’s faith couldn’t handle the “heat” from neighbors, friends, co-workers, etc. This is NOT TO SAY that what happened was acceptable in any way or that the culpability of those who leave is full…not at all. It’s just that to stick with anything (a friend, a job, a partner), you have to be either very firm in your faith in that friend/job/partner, etc, when bad things happen or VERY stubborn that you don’t allow the actions of people with bad decision making skills to determine your own actions.
And, honestly, our congregations are a group of humans…there is more than “just” the sex scandals that can drive people to feel they want a “better experience” in a different place. I get that…if truth be told, I think we ALL would like to distance ourselves from this scandal. Leaving the Church, however, is a cut nose/spite face thing.

In the end, I hope people don’t leave…for the sake of their soul. And I would counsel them that way, if they ask. But many people are indoctrinated in the idea that we leave when things are rough. We throw out and replace. We get the %$^& out of Dodge. That’s a pretty entrenched cultural norm, esp in America.
 
Speaking for myself, I do not get as upset as most because I have enough situations that are real to me (as in, I know the people) that are just as bad. I know stuff like this happens. I also know that punishing crime is the job of law enforcement. We now have mandatory reporting laws, good ones, that can be enforced when those that know of child abuse fail to report it. I am different than most though as I believe victims (based on their age and maturity) and the family of victims also have an obligation to report abuse, as they have the most direct knowledge.

I think there is also something in our nature that feels good about getting mad. That is why some programming targets that emotion in their like-minded viewers. That is why news is mostly bad on television and in the press. It sells. It is also why we, like a dog returning to its vomit, keep circling back to our outrage on this topic, and others in their time.
 
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having joined the Chucrh a couple of years ago I have detected an elitist attitude which I find very surprising and disappointing. I’ve seen it before but in organisations which are not founded on the highest ideals possible. (I understand that the elite will abide with God in heaven, but the members of that elite are chosen by God not us.)

I remember visiting a beauty spot once and it was a lovely place but there were a few people there also who spoiled it. Funnily enough when they were spoken to normally they settled down and it was obvious that they were just like everyone else. What a beautiful world it would be if we helped each other with the fundamental needs, we all want the same thing I think. Great institutions are built by great people from top to bottom.

I asked my priest once if when Jesus told us to love our neighbour did He mean agape, a charitable disposition wishing others only well, my priest smiled kindly and said “ no, He meant love.”
 
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I agree with those words, “organized attempt.” I believe that there are those who are hoping that the Church will have to spend a considerable amount of money over the scandal–maybe enough that they won’t be able to fund all of the Catholic schools. The Catholic schools put the govt.-run schools to shame, as we all know, and they do it on a much smaller budget. This has to be galling to many people. I think that raking all of this up after all of these years is just a way of bleeding the Church of some of its operating capital.
 
phil19034 said:
First let me preface my remarks with the following: any priest who has committed sexual crimes deserves to burn in hell.
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While I share your animus with priests who transgress their vow of chastity, I might suggest that priests who commit sexual crimes (with consenting adults) be chastised by their superior, defrocked if the offense is serious enough, and allowed confession to confess and repent of their sins. And not be put in a position to commit them again while wearing a Roman collar.
Abuse of minors is a different story. I think they need to be immediately defrocked and turned over to the proper civil authorities for punishment under the law of the land.
As to burning in hell, let’s leave that up to the mercy, or justice, of God.
 
I don’t get what you mean by sex crimes with consenting adults. If the adults are consenting, how is it a crime? And if it is a crime (like the two priests caught recently in Florida), then they should STILL be turned over to the police. Abuse of children is horrendous, but abuse of adults is as well.
 
Do you mean that no crime was committed, just sinful behavior? Then I can see not turning them over to the police. It is still breaking the vows and there still needs to be some sort of punishment from the Church though. I have an extended family member that was a priest who was excommunicated for a relationship with a woman. They later married and raised four children. Of course they aren’t in the US and it was during the 1980’s, but I’m struggling with understanding why he was excommunicated yet homosexual priests that break their vows (often repeatedly) don’t face the same punishment.
 
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