Admitting gay seminarians to a school full of men?

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Deacon’s function differently than priests though. Consecration…confession… etc… so They would either have to be deacons or they would have to be priests.
 
I think folks are misunderstanding me. They would be priests, but their selection criteria, material living arrangements and source of income would be modeled on what now exists for married permanent deacons.

But they would be ordained as, and function sacramentally and liturgically, as priests.
 
artimes121 said:
“There has been widespread speculation that homosexual
identity is linked to the sexual abuse of minors by
priests, largely because of the high number of male victims
identified in the Nature and Scope study.
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If I remember correctly, the reason there was a belief that homosexuality was a contributing factor was because, upon analysis of the ages of males abused, it was found that relatively few PRE-pubescent males (males prior to the changes of puberty which brings on the characteristics) were victims whereas the wide majority of male victims were under the age of consent (16? 18?) but were of an age that they physically resembled grown men.

Either way, I think there are serious problems with pointing to homosexuality as the main cause of sexual abuse within the Church…just wanted to point that out.
 
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catholic1seeks said:
This is the major implication from the dominant online Catholic world. Including posts like this on CAF.
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Wow. I’m so sorry that’s your experience; that’s not good. I’m a fairly traditional Catholic who believes in the teachings of Christ and I have not heard that within my “circle”, if you will or from any priest, either privately or from the pulpit.

I have heard the reasons why homosexuality is intrinsically disordered, but not that persons of homosexual orientation are more inclined to promiscuity or lack of control by virtue of their homosexuality. In fact, the general consensus seems to be that persons of homosexual orientation are, in general, not “more” anything than anyone else other than attracted to the same sex. Further, I think my experience with discussions of homosexuality are more dominated by people making assumptions about MY beliefs because I am in communion with the Roman Catholic Church, to be honest with you. 🤷‍♀️
 
catholic1seeks said:
I’m saying it’s been implied, especially with how certain sectors of the Catholic world are talking about the abuse scandals.
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Are you truly taking a representative sample? Again, I know a lot of people within the Church who do not feel the way you have stated and would strongly encourage you to join the Church, live a chaste lifestyle and attend Mass regularly…like all of us.
 
TheLittleLady said:
Denominations with married clergy do not have lower rates of sex abuse.
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You need to understand that compiling data for an organization that has not been publicly accused or sent to trial for abuse is not the same thing as the Church being investigated and having those results made public. Additionally, while the Catholic church is universal and there fore reporting is all or nothing, Protestant churches claim independent status and so, are not obligated to report in the same manner. In fairness, this needs to be addressed. However, this report from three of the largest insurance companies that cover many many Protestant churches shows that there is, indeed, consistent and on going reports of sexual abuse within Protestant churches. Again, if these men have access to regular sexual activity with wives, how is celibacy the “cause” of sexual abuse?

www.nytimes.com

Data Shed Light on Child Sexual Abuse by Protestant Clergy (Published 2007)

The companies that insure a majority of Protestant churches say they receive upward of 260 reports a year of children being sexually abused by church personnel.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

A simple google search of “catholic protestant abuse scandals” will give you, literally REAMS of hits detailing anecdotal evidence, individual reports of verified abuse and multiple warnings from religious organizations warning the Protestant church to “wake up” and “face this crisis”, eerily similar to the same calls directed at the Catholic church decades ago.
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I owe you a huge apology. I had read your answer to be that Denominations with married clergy DO have lower rates of sex abuse. Please, forgive my skipping the key word.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
I knew both parties so I’m privy to the attitude/opinion of the priest; he seemed to think that it was okay for celibate priests to have “someone” on the side.
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Seriously? My kids know that isn’t o.k. Was he absent the day they were taught that priests aren’t allowed to have a mistress? What the hell is wrong with this guy?
 
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Obedience to the Church is the important thing to do, so it would be best to follow the discipline regarding this.
 
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Anicette said:
Er… No>. False.
81% of assault by priests or deacons on minors, are performed on boys. According to the official statistics in the Us. (John Jay Report)
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While this is true, the correct term for what happened is ephebophilia, or sexual attraction to mid-to-late teens. Banning homosexuals from the priesthood may be oversimplifying the problem and may not produce the desired results on its own.

Quite apart from Church teaching on all extramarital sexual relations, the real issue is the exploitative behaviour that these priests engaged in. Engaging in same-sex relations with a parishioner over whom one has authority or is below the age of consent is not, legally at least, the same as a priest having an adult, mutually-consensual, same-sex or opposite-sex partner from outside his sphere of influence.

Both situations are sins of course, but one can be solved in the confessional alone, the other, in addition to being a sin, also happens to be a crime.
 
I was abused by a prominent Catholic man who apparently was gay so I am not the most objective person when it comes to homosexuality.

Certainly anyone who has same sex attraction can live a chaste life if they choose and not act out on evil tendencies just as the person addicted to porn or the person prone to adultery.

The problem I see is that we take two extremes in our society. We either say gay sex is ok so go ahead and do it or we take too much of a condemning tone. The truth of course is that we as a result of our fallen nature, all have evil tendencies. We can either live a lie and say they aren’t evil or take up our cross and become a better man by fighting the daily struggle of temptation.
 
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exnihilo said:
I’ve heard the altar server argument but I see mostly girls as alter servers.
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Now, yes, there are a lot of girls servingcat the altar. But back when most of these abuse cases took place? Very few, if any
 
My concern is it wasn’t just this guy. I don’t think people are getting what I’m saying. This priest is not the only one and talked like this was common attitude among certain priests. If there are seminaries with a “homosexual” culture why wouldn’t there be places in which other vices are encouraged or ignored.
 
Here is the book I mentioned earlier about the seminary scandals in America from about 1960-1990. It’s called Goodbye, Good Men, by Michael Rose. It’s about how a number of seminaries corrupted generations of priests by pushing a curriculum contrary to the teachings of the Church and also by passing homosexual candidates with flying colors while simultaneously eliminating heterosexual candidates who were loyal to the Pope and the precepts of the Church. This was often done with bogus psychological evaluations deeming those who were faithful to the teachings of the Church unsuitable for the priesthood. The agenda of these seminaries was to subvert the Church by changing the priesthood. Very disturbing and very sad, but certainly explains why we have so many problems among the clergy.

Here is a video of Mr. Rose giving a talk about the subject:
 
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Well I suppose those could exist but I haven’t heard of any reports as such. The book Goodbye, Good Men by Michael Rose is an investigation into some American seminaries from 1960-1990 that pushed a homosexual agenda and teachings contrary to the Church while simultaneously making sure other men who were not going to fall for that nonsense did not make it through their programs. As a result the Church lost many good candidates for the priesthood and got a lot of bad priests instead.
 
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