Adultery?

  • Thread starter Thread starter ajecphotos
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I suppose to understand it you would have to understand the circumstances.

I was, to put it bluntly, sleeping around and got pregnant accidentally due to a conflict between the Pill and a medication I was on. I didn’t know my ex very well and what I did know I didn’t like, but I didn’t need to like him to sleep with him. It was supposed to be a casual no strings thing. Once I had my daughter I felt like I should marry her father to legitimize her, for appearances, and because I wanted her to feel secure in her formative years. I’d read that 80% of a child’s development happens before age 5, so I figured 5-6 years and I’d get a divorce and move on. Plus, my mom was in poor health and I knew it would make her feel better if I appeared married and settled. She wouldn’t have to worry about me and her first grandbaby in her last days. (She died a little over a year later)

The marriage ceremony was meant as a legal and social convention. Nothing more. I didn’t think being legally married should change my life at all. Why not keep dating? I was still looking for a permanent mate, so why risk passing up the right man just because I was technically married to my daughters father? Why not continue having emotional and physical relationships with other men when I had no emotional attachment to my legal husband? I didn’t feel I owed him anything.

My ex and I pulled on some clothes, drove to Toledo, Ohio because they have no waiting period, got a marriage license, had a courthouse ceremony immediately, drove back to MI, and then I dropped him off so I could go to work. No muss, no fuss, social convention complete.

My ex and I lived separate lives, but sometimes would end up at the same party. The first such party thrown by mutual friends was about 2 weeks after the marriage ceremony. I was there with my then boyfriend J and his friend P. When I realized my legal husband was going to be there I and I’d probably be expected to introduce him to people he didn’t know and explain the situation I thought I’d make it fun. So, at that party and every party he attended that I happened to be at, I’d introduce him as “My first husband, S.” Then I’d be asked who my second husband is and I’d say “I don’t know. Haven’t met him yet.”

When I told the guy I was dating at the time of the marriage that I was marrying S he asked me if that meant we could no longer see each other. I blinked and asked why he thought me getting married would mean we’d have to end our relationship…

I introduced my boyfriend as my boyfriend when we were out together even if my legal husband was there. That’s what he was and he was who I spent my evening with. No reason to try to pretend otherwise when anyone who saw us together would immediately see what we were to each other. Who the boyfriend was changed over the years, but I was rarely without male companionship. I spent most of my weekends sleeping over at the home of whoever I was dating. Some weekdays here and there, too. My ex knew, sometimes he’d drop me and the baby off so he could use the car to go do whatever he was into at the time.

My ex also had his women. Some of them I met and some I didn’t. No skin off my nose.

The whole concept of marriage as taught by the Church was foreign to me then. I wasn’t Christian. To me, if you were legally married you were in whatever you wanted to make of the marriage and if you were divorced you were no longer married. Period. divorce dissolved marriage, end of story. There was not even a vague idea of marriage being for life or requiring fidelity or of the idea that children are a natural part of marriage.

The Church says that a couple has to freely consent to marriage as taught by the Church for the marriage to be valid. One cannot freely consent to something they don’t understand and/or do not believe to be true. What we consented to during that ceremony was not a marriage. I know I had no idea what a marriage was back when I was 19 and I am pretty sure my ex didn’t, either.

I left S in December 1999, 5 years and 3 months after the marriage ceremony, and never looked back. I started dating the man I wanted to be my permanent mate shortly after. A year and a half later I moved in with him and we began saving to pay for my divorce. I filed for divorce July 2002 and the divorce was final in October 2002. I was remarried to my DH 6.5 weeks later. 10 years after that my DH decided to return to the Church and I began to research his faith. The more I learned the more I liked. I went to Mass with him to watch him sing with the choir and just knew I was meant to be there and that I would convert. The Holy Spirit truly entered my heart that day and I became Christian for the first time in my adult life. The rest, as they say, is history.
Thanks for explaining what happened but from what i have read what you done was just so wrong. Plainly wrong! I would never have the nerve to ask for an annulment if i had done what you did. Sorry to sound harsh but that is just my view. How do you think God would view it?
 
Thanks for explaining what happened but from what i have read what you done was just so wrong. Plainly wrong! I would never have the nerve to ask for an annulment if i had done what you did. Sorry to sound harsh but that is just my view. How do you think God would view it?
Why not? I’m not being snarky, I am genuinely curious. An annulment says that a true marital bond was never formed and that a marriage did not exist other than civilly/legally. That is exactly what happened in my case.So, why shouldn’t I have asked for annulment? Yes, I sinned. My only defense is that I didn’t think I was doing anything wrong at the time. I wasn’t Christian. I was a practicing Pagan. I never intended to enter into a Christian marriage. I intended to enter into a civil contract and to sever that legal relationship when my child was older. Which is exactly what I did.

My ex and I didn’t fall in love, get married pretending it would be for life, and then suddenly fall in love with others and leave. We didn’t love each other, we married civilly to fulfill obligations we felt owed to our child, and we parted ways. It was, at least, honest.

I find it interesting that your sister has been in what is presumed to be an actual marriage (by which I mean she knew marriage meant permanence, fidelity, and openness to children) and because she fell in love (with another womans husband, no less!) is entitled to her hidden affair, a divorce years down the road, possibly an annulment, and a remarriage because God loves us, wants us to be happy, and understands. Yet you think I have nerve to apply for annulment after my divorce?
 
Why not? I’m not being snarky, I am genuinely curious. An annulment says that a true marital bond was never formed and that a marriage did not exist other than civilly/legally. That is exactly what happened in my case.So, why shouldn’t I have asked for annulment? Yes, I sinned. My only defense is that I didn’t think I was doing anything wrong at the time. I wasn’t Christian. I was a practicing Pagan. I never intended to enter into a Christian marriage. I intended to enter into a civil contract and to sever that legal relationship when my child was older. Which is exactly what I did.

My ex and I didn’t fall in love, get married pretending it would be for life, and then suddenly fall in love with others and leave. We didn’t love each other, we married civilly to fulfill obligations we felt owed to our child, and we parted ways. It was, at least, honest.

I find it interesting that your sister has been in what is presumed to be an actual marriage (by which I mean she knew marriage meant permanence, fidelity, and openness to children) and because she fell in love (with another womans husband, no less!) is entitled to her hidden affair, a divorce years down the road, possibly an annulment, and a remarriage because God loves us, wants us to be happy, and understands. Yet you think I have nerve to apply for annulment after a divorce freeing me from what everyone knew was a sham marriage that made all of us (me, the ex, and our offspring) absolutely miserable.
I am curious if you believe that the annulment process is ever abused or used inappropriately or if you think any annulments have ever been given that should not have?

Just curious…
 
I am curious if you believe that the annulment process is ever abused or used inappropriately or if you think any annulments have ever been given that should not have?

Just curious…
People are what we are. We’re far from perfect. We have fallen sinful natures. So, yes, I do think there have been cases where a Tribunal has dropped the ball and where a person/couple seeking annulment have lied like rugs to get one.

I do believe that the majority of annulment cases are honest. It’s a long, hard, invasive process. The process can and sometimes does include psych eval and in person extended interviews. Not a lot of people are going to subject themselves to that without a darn good reason.

Personally, I couldn’t do that. I couldn’t lie or embellish to get an annulment. Other than my distaste for dishonesty, I believe very strongly you don’t lie to God or anyone who works directly for Him. Even as a Pagan, then Agnostic, and then Atheist I had deep respect for holy people of all religions and simply couldn’t imagine lying to or disrespecting say a priest or nun or even shaman. My mom may have never taught me marriage was for life, she may have only taken me to church a handful of times as a kid, but she did make sure I knew that the divine was not to be fooled with!
 
People are what we are. We’re far from perfect. We have fallen sinful natures. So, yes, I do think there have been cases where a Tribunal has dropped the ball and where a person/couple seeking annulment have lied like rugs to get one.

I do believe that the majority of annulment cases are honest. It’s a long, hard, invasive process. The process can and sometimes does include psych eval and in person extended interviews. Not a lot of people are going to subject themselves to that without a darn good reason.

Personally, I couldn’t do that. I couldn’t lie or embellish to get an annulment. Other than my distaste for dishonesty, I believe very strongly you don’t lie to God or anyone who works directly for Him. Even as a Pagan, then Agnostic, and then Atheist I had deep respect for holy people of all religions and simply couldn’t imagine lying to or disrespecting say a priest or nun or even shaman. My mom may have never taught me marriage was for life, she may have only taken me to church a handful of times as a kid, but she did make sure I knew that the divine was not to be fooled with!
Thank you for answering these questions on a highly personal topic for you. You have been very honest and insightful
 
Thank you for answering these questions on a highly personal topic for you. You have been very honest and insightful
You are very welcome. If my experiences can help someone to understand something they didn’t before or help them avoid my mistakes then I am happy.

After the deeply personal and invasive annulment questionnaire I became depressed. I was looking at my past through the eyes of a new convert and it hurt. Bad. At the time I was living a completely secular life I didn’t believe in sin and that lead me to commit many sins which damaged me in ways I am just learning to recognize. I was also deeply ashamed. After some prayer, I decided not to be ashamed of what I had done, but accept that which cannot be changed and repent with intention to never commit those sins again. I think part of my repentance is to publicly, on the interwebs and in life, admit to my wrongdoings in hope that I can help another soul avoid the road I went down or give someone already there hope that they can truly change and know God.
 
ajecphotos…

At the end of the day, after hearing everything you put forth in this thread…

Do you doubt in the infallibility of the Church pertaining to its dogmas?

Are you believing in a God that has not been taught by the Church? If so, you are not a Christian but someone who believes in a god of your own creation. An unrighteous god who allows sinners to wreak existing marital homes outside of their own.

Are you telling me that your sister should be allowed by this god to remain married to someone she does not love and yet ruin another family? To which she should not have to bear any responsibility?

Imagine what would happen if the entire world does the same as your sister. Righteous still? I see many going through similar situation. So now tell me this, what’s so special about her circumstances?

Does your warped logic carry any weight, in comparison to the Church? Or do the doctrines of the Holy Catholic Church which has existed for 2015 years, carry more weight than your warped reasoning?

I am not trying to be mean, but truthfully your so-called ‘wisdom’ is hardly a tiny fraction of Church.
 
ajecphotos…

At the end of the day, after hearing everything you put forth in this thread…

Do you doubt in the infallibility of the Church pertaining to its dogmas?

Are you believing in a God that has not been taught by the Church? If so, you are not a Christian but someone who believes in a god of your own creation. An unrighteous god who allows sinners to wreak existing marital homes outside of their own.

Are you telling me that your sister should be allowed by this god to remain married to someone she does not love and yet ruin another family? To which she should not have to bear any responsibility?

Imagine what would happen if the entire world does the same as your sister. Righteous still? I see many going through similar situation. So now tell me this, what’s so special about her circumstances?

Does your warped logic carry any weight, in comparison to the Church? Or do the doctrines of the Holy Catholic Church which has existed for 2015 years, carry more weight than your warped reasoning?

I am not trying to be mean, but truthfully your so-called ‘wisdom’ is hardly a tiny fraction of Church.
I have stated quite a few times that what my sister has done is very very wrong!! She has sinned massively. I dont condone what has happened.

All i have been saying is that i am sure that God is an all forgiving God. He understands us more than we know. I am sure he understand our individual situations and helps in his own way.

Yes, the church has rules and these must be adhered to.

My sister is not seeking annulment etc etc. She knows what has happened was gravely wrong, has sought confession, is no longer in a physical relationship with this guy. They are still close, but only as close as is possible without grave sin. They dont kiss or hold hands etc. They are there for each other emotionally while they try to think things through.

As i said, divorce is now on the cards and after that they will then pick up where they left off and also get married.

My sister knows how i feel. I have told her many times. She went into it knowing full well how she would be sinning against God. This she regrets the most.

Having said that, she cant ‘ditch’ this guy as she has fallen in love with him. So, she is trying to now live a pure life as is most humanly possible. Her husband now knows what has gone on and is not bothered as he knew the marriage was doomed. They are still living together and just waiting for the divorce to go through.

This is where i pray that God, in his mercy, will understand my sister. Forgive her and bless her new marriage when it happens. Who can say for certainty that God treats everyone who divorces and remarries the same? I trust in God and believe in him. He knows my sisters situation. Only God knows what will be done.
 
Why not? I’m not being snarky, I am genuinely curious. An annulment says that a true marital bond was never formed and that a marriage did not exist other than civilly/legally. That is exactly what happened in my case.So, why shouldn’t I have asked for annulment? Yes, I sinned. My only defense is that I didn’t think I was doing anything wrong at the time. I wasn’t Christian. I was a practicing Pagan. I never intended to enter into a Christian marriage. I intended to enter into a civil contract and to sever that legal relationship when my child was older. Which is exactly what I did.

My ex and I didn’t fall in love, get married pretending it would be for life, and then suddenly fall in love with others and leave. We didn’t love each other, we married civilly to fulfill obligations we felt owed to our child, and we parted ways. It was, at least, honest.

I find it interesting that your sister has been in what is presumed to be an actual marriage (by which I mean she knew marriage meant permanence, fidelity, and openness to children) and because she fell in love (with another womans husband, no less!) is entitled to her hidden affair, a divorce years down the road, possibly an annulment, and a remarriage because God loves us, wants us to be happy, and understands. Yet you think I have nerve to apply for annulment after my divorce?
I hope that everything goes well for you anyway. God bless you 👍
 
I have stated quite a few times that what my sister has done is very very wrong!! She has sinned massively. I dont condone what has happened.

All i have been saying is that i am sure that God is an all forgiving God. He understands us more than we know. I am sure he understand our individual situations and helps in his own way.

Yes, the church has rules and these must be adhered to.

My sister is not seeking annulment etc etc. She knows what has happened was gravely wrong, has sought confession, is no longer in a physical relationship with this guy. They are still close, but only as close as is possible without grave sin. They dont kiss or hold hands etc. They are there for each other emotionally while they try to think things through.

As i said, divorce is now on the cards and after that they will then pick up where they left off and also get married.

My sister knows how i feel. I have told her many times. She went into it knowing full well how she would be sinning against God. This she regrets the most.

Having said that, she cant ‘ditch’ this guy as she has fallen in love with him. So, she is trying to now live a pure life as is most humanly possible. Her husband now knows what has gone on and is not bothered as he knew the marriage was doomed. They are still living together and just waiting for the divorce to go through.

This is where i pray that God, in his mercy, will understand my sister. Forgive her and bless her new marriage when it happens. Who can say for certainty that God treats everyone who divorces and remarries the same? I trust in God and believe in him. He knows my sisters situation. Only God knows what will be done.
She has filed for divorce? That’s what “waiting for the divorce to go through” means. Just checking.

Has her paramour filed?

Has she truly thought through what remarrying without annulment will mean? She’ll be permanently cut off from the Sacraments. Is this new guy worth that to her?
 
She has filed for divorce? That’s what “waiting for the divorce to go through” means. Just checking.

Has her paramour filed?

Has she truly thought through what remarrying without annulment will mean? She’ll be permanently cut off from the Sacraments. Is this new guy worth that to her?
They have both filed for divorce. Not sure on procedure but i know she told me it has all started.

Yes, remarrying is going to cause big issues but she knows she will not get annulment and as we all know, love is blind! She is deeply in love with this guy! Guess she will have to lose out on the sacraments. She understands this. Sad state of affairs indeed
 
Having said that, she cant ‘ditch’ this guy as she has fallen in love with him.
Actually, yes, she could ditch him. She just doesn’t want to. Apparently she has decided that this guy is more important to her than God, than the Church, than honor, than morality. That’s her decision to make, but that doesn’t make it right.
 
They have both filed for divorce. Not sure on procedure but i know she told me it has all started.

Yes, remarrying is going to cause big issues but she knows she will not get annulment and as we all know, love is blind! She is deeply in love with this guy! Guess she will have to lose out on the sacraments. She understands this. Sad state of affairs indeed
Well, to validly marry, they’d both need annulments. If they have grounds the cases could take years. Even if she is not aware of grounds she might want to meet with a canon lawyer to have a consultation and see if there is a reason to file for annulment. She’d also have to have her paramour do the same. I think it’s worth investigating the possibility. If they both check into annulment and are told they have no grounds at least they won’t wonder later if there was something they could have done.

As for the divorces, I hope they will both be fair with their respective spouses when it comes to custody and division of assets. Mediation with an open mind and willingness to negotiate is quicker and much less costly than dragging things through the courts unless someone is being unreasonable and mediation fails.

My divorce was final 3 months after I filed. If her divorce goes fast she may have a moment when the marriage being over and all of the changes in her life hits her all a once. She may feel lost, adrift, scared, etc. She will need emotional support.
 
Actually, yes, she could ditch him. She just doesn’t want to. Apparently she has decided that this guy is more important to her than God, than the Church, than honor, than morality. That’s her decision to make, but that doesn’t make it right.
I agree 100%
 
Well, to validly marry, they’d both need annulments. If they have grounds the cases could take years. Even if she is not aware of grounds she might want to meet with a canon lawyer to have a consultation and see if there is a reason to file for annulment. She’d also have to have her paramour do the same. I think it’s worth investigating the possibility. If they both check into annulment and are told they have no grounds at least they won’t wonder later if there was something they could have done.

As for the divorces, I hope they will both be fair with their respective spouses when it comes to custody and division of assets. Mediation with an open mind and willingness to negotiate is quicker and much less costly than dragging things through the courts unless someone is being unreasonable and mediation fails.

My divorce was final 3 months after I filed. If her divorce goes fast she may have a moment when the marriage being over and all of the changes in her life hits her all a once. She may feel lost, adrift, scared, etc. She will need emotional support.
I think it will go quick as i believe all parties are of the same mind.

As for annulment my sister has said that she is 100% guilty and doesnt deserve to even try for it. Sad what life can throw at you. Its easy to say that i would never ever do what she has done but nobody knows what one would do in different circumstances. There but for the grace of God go i.

I pray that all goes ok and that God will show his mercy upon the adulterers.
 
I think it will go quick as i believe all parties are of the same mind.

As for annulment my sister has said that she is 100% guilty and doesnt deserve to even try for it. Sad what life can throw at you. Its easy to say that i would never ever do what she has done but nobody knows what one would do in different circumstances. There but for the grace of God go i.

I pray that all goes ok and that God will show his mercy upon the adulterers.
Annulment has absolutely nothing to do with establishing guilt. Annulment establishes weather or not a valid marriage was contracted at the time of the ceremony. If there was some defect in understanding or consent or mental ability on either side she would qualify.

If she won’t give up her new man and she plans to marry him she is cutting herself off from the Sacraments. If there is even a .01% chance she could make it right she should be encouraged to try.

Besides, the questionnaire is very helpful in identifying what went wrong and why. If she really wants to remarry just doing that much may help her avoid a repeat performance.
 
Annulment has absolutely nothing to do with establishing guilt. Annulment establishes weather or not a valid marriage was contracted at the time of the ceremony. If there was some defect in understanding or consent or mental ability on either side she would qualify.

If she won’t give up her new man and she plans to marry him she is cutting herself off from the Sacraments. If there is even a .01% chance she could make it right she should be encouraged to try.

Besides, the questionnaire is very helpful in identifying what went wrong and why. If she really wants to remarry just doing that much may help her avoid a repeat performance.
I don’t like the terms ‘annulment’ or having a marriage ‘annuled’ as they imply an action taken by the Church to undo the marriage.

I did not receive an annulment of my marriage. I petitioned for a declaration of nullity and received a positive decision. My marriage wasn’t annulled, it was investigated and determined to be null ‘ab initio’, from the beginning. The marriage was not undone, it never was a marriage in anything other than the legal sense.
 
Near occasions of sin.
The claim of the spouses lacking something is the standard excuse for this.
And then, later, it’s “Oh! we never intended it to go that far.”

News Flash: It ALWAYS goes that far.
 
I don’t like the terms ‘annulment’ or having a marriage ‘annuled’ as they imply an action taken by the Church to undo the marriage.

I did not receive an annulment of my marriage. I petitioned for a declaration of nullity and received a positive decision. My marriage wasn’t annulled, it was investigated and determined to be null ‘ab initio’, from the beginning. The marriage was not undone, it never was a marriage in anything other than the legal sense.
Definition of ANNULMENT

1
: the act of annulling : the state of being annulled
2
: a judicial or ecclesiastical pronouncement declaring a marriage invalid
 
Definition of ANNULMENT

1
: the act of annulling : the state of being annulled
2
: a judicial or ecclesiastical pronouncement declaring a marriage invalid
I believe it is definition 1. that leads the prior poster to the dislike of the term. It is also the meaning that leads non-Catholics to claim that it is Catholic divorce. In other words, the first meaning implies a positive action that changes a valid marriage into an invalid one. That is not the case, as a declaration of nulilty indicates that a marriage was never valid from the beginning.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top