Ag_nots Catholic Scriptural Challenge - just ONE proven example wins!!

[twb1621]

To: Ag_Not, Cinnete, Twb, Fb19, Rinnie, Hisalone, Tqualey, Martin, AshleyBelle, TantumErgo, Angels_Unaware, Bett_ur_Kidding, Henning, Underdog, RealCatholik, notsmart, Matariel, ChurchMilitant, Luke65, Techno, RobHom, and anyone else I may have missed.

This is my last posting for the year or at least till after Christmas.

**Your posts have made my day. They have been entertaining, infuriating, hilarious and enlightening. You have made me laugh so much I am sure God will count that in your favour. You know like 10 points for getting others to roll out in laughter. **

I wish you all a most Blessed Christmas, truly aware of the Emmanuel.

Now we contemplate God entering human history.

Christ was born in Bethlehem, which means “House of Bread”
He was laid in a manger, a feeding trough.
His birth was already pointing to the Eucharist.

Like Mary, may we manifest Him by our lives.

May the Prince of Peace, grant you and all yours, His Peace.

Hey Ben, I look forward to your return and pray you and your family have a wonderfully blessed Christmas. Will miss you in the mean time.

 

[twb1621]

Did I sleep through the post where HisAlone explained her thoughts on Enoch and Elijah…

I also thought for sure Martin would be able to tell us why the devil temps a “saved” person… when his efforts would be pointless… that was a great question Techno:thumbsup:

I asked it to my Baptist friend yesterday and lead him into it, asking him what the devil’s ultimate goal was… he said to stray people from God and get them to hell… yep… Then asked are we all tempted by the devil and he said yep… I said if OSAS is true then why would he waste his efforts tempting those who are “saved” if he can never gain their souls? all I got was… “good question”. I have to admit though that he’s had trouble accepting this anyway so it only strengthened his negative feelings about OSAS… Thanks for the thought!!!

SD

No you didn’t sleep through it, She as of yet hasen’t gotten to the point of responding to any of the posts that prove her wrong. You can even go back to sleep because I doubt it will happen any time soon.

 

[rinnie]

No you didn’t sleep through it, She as of yet hasen’t gotten to the point of responding to any of the posts that prove her wrong. You can even go back to sleep because I doubt it will happen any time soon.

And you know what its a habit of his. Go all through everything he posts. Now when he think’s he has won! Now you cannot get rid of him.

WHERE’S MY PRIZE WHERE’S MY PRIZE. But when he has lost, well he will leave, and try to preach his false messages and try to confuse other’s again. But he isn’t having much fun lately.

But we still love him and pray for him. We all believe in Christ and that’s the big thing.

 

[Hisalone]

And you know what its a habit of his. Go all through everything he posts. Now when he think’s he has won! Now you cannot get rid of him.

WHERE’S MY PRIZE WHERE’S MY PRIZE. But when he has lost, well he will leave, and try to preach his false messages and try to confuse other’s again. But he isn’t having much fun lately.

But we still love him and pray for him. We all believe in Christ and that’s the big thing.

But I have pointed out many errors, but alas I have no prize.
I think it was a bait and switch scheme

 

[Hisalone]

No you didn’t sleep through it, She as of yet hasen’t gotten to the point of responding to any of the posts that prove her wrong. You can even go back to sleep because I doubt it will happen any time soon.

Did Enoch and Elijah suffer from original sin? How could they not have? If they did how could they enter heaven? This is your guys issue not mine. You believe in purgatory. They were just and they lived by faith and they were sanctified by their faith. Did Enoch and Elijah get translated to heaven? You guys have a lot of explaining to do. It really doesnt matter I guess cuss youll just make it up as you always do.

 

[twb1621]

But I have pointed out many errors, but alas I have no prize.
I think it was a bait and switch scheme

Name one you proved… I have many posts responding and refuting you that you NEVER defended or responded back to. You’re just silly :whackadoo:

 

[Hisalone]

In post 254 it is quoted from hisalone

Ro, 3:23 For all have sinned and are deprived of the glory of God.

How can that be? But the protestants said no, Once saved. Oh wait a minute its the Catholic’s that believe this verse? Its the Catholic’s that believe that they can be deprived of the glory of God. I am so glad that I am not afraid of heights, Pray for me Blessed Mother pray for me. I will take all the steps.

But its hisalone that quoted this and he is not Catholic. Oh my, I am so confused. What is a person to do?

And hisalone is gone I tell you gone! MIA.

All have fallen short of the glory of God
All have sinned
Even Mary
Even Enoch
Even Elijah

 

[twb1621]

Did Enoch and Elijah suffer from original sin? How could they not have? If they did how could they enter heaven? This is your guys issue not mine. You believe in purgatory. They were just and they lived by faith and they were sanctified by their faith. Did Enoch and Elijah get translated to heaven? You guys have a lot of explaining to do. It really doesnt matter I guess cuss youll just make it up as you always do.

I’ll tell you what, you start responding to the posts I have provided with proof and I will again start to answer your questions… That’s called mutual respect.

 

[onenow1]

HI, and a most blessed Christmas and New Year to all !

Peace,onenow1:christmastree1:

 

[guanophore]

But I have pointed out many errors, but alas I have no prize.
I think it was a bait and switch scheme

Yes, you have, but you have to provide something beyond your own opinion to substantiate your point.

Did Enoch and Elijah suffer from original sin? How could they not have?

Yes.

If they did how could they enter heaven?

Just like anyone else who gets there, by grace, through faith. By the way, do you think they are “dead”?

This is your guys issue not mine.

You were making an effort to prove Catholic faith “wrong” remember? It is obviously an “issue” for you, or you would just accept the teaching of the Church, would you not?

You believe in purgatory. They were just and they lived by faith and they were sanctified by their faith.

What has Purgatory got to do with this? Yes, they were just, and they lived by faith. I would say, though, that faith does not sanctify. Grace does this. Faith is the appropriate response to God’s grace, and it is faith that saves. Faith is the avenue through which we access the grace that saves and sanctifies.

Did Enoch and Elijah get translated to heaven? You guys have a lot of explaining to do.

I think you can call it that. We call it 'assumed". What would you like in th eway of an explanation? Are we not in agreement that God took them up?

It really doesnt matter I guess cuss youll just make it up as you always do.:D

We don’t cuss here, it is against the rules.

The deposit of faith was whole and entire when it was deliverd to the saints by the Apostles. Nothing can be added to it, and nothing can be “made up”.

All have fallen short of the glory of God
All have sinned
Even Mary
Even Enoch
Even Elijah

You are using an irrelevant verse to bolster your “point” if indeed you are making one. We find that these three persons were assumed into heaven, and reside there with God. It does not make them God. They are all humans, and as humans, they reflect the glory of God, and are not the source of that Glory. We are all made fit for heaven by his grace, not anything that we can do to merit heaven.

 

[twb1621]

All have fallen short of the glory of God
All have sinned
Even Mary
Even Enoch
Even Elijah

1. [In order to learn] that bodies did continue in existence for a lengthened period, as long as it was God’s good pleasure that they should flourish, let [these heretics] read the Scriptures, and they will find that our predecessors advanced beyond seven hundred, eight hundred, and nine hundred years of age; and that their bodies kept pace with the protracted length of their days, and participated in life as long as God willed that they should live. But why do I refer to these men? For Enoch, when he pleased God, was translated in the same body in which he did please Him, thus pointing out by anticipation the translation of the just. Elijah, too, was caught up [when he was yet] in the substance of the [natural] form; thus exhibiting in prophecy the assumption of those who are spiritual, and that nothing stood in the way of their body being translated and caught up. For by means of the very same hands through which they were moulded at the beginning, did they receive this translation and assumption. For in Adam the hands of God had become accustomed to set in order, to rule, and to sustain His own workmanship, and to bring it and place it where they pleased. Where, then, was the first man placed? In paradise certainly, as the Scripture declares And God planted a garden [paradisum] eastward in Eden, and there He placed the man whom He had formed. Genesis 2:8 And then afterwards when [man] proved disobedient, he was cast out thence into this world. Wherefore also the elders who were disciples of the apostles tell us that those who were translated were transferred to that place (for paradise has been prepared for righteous men, such as have the Spirit; in which place also Paul the apostle, when he was caught up, heard words which are unspeakable as regards us in our present condition 2 Corinthians 12:4), and that there shall they who have been translated remain until the consummation [of all things], as a prelude to immortality.
2. If, however, any one imagine it impossible that men should survive for such a length of time, and that Elias was not caught up in the flesh, but that his flesh was consumed in the fiery chariot, let him consider that Jonah, when he had been cast into the deep, and swallowed down into the whale’s belly, was by the command of God again thrown out safe upon the land. Jonah 2:11 And then, again, when Ananias, Azarias, and Misaël were cast into the furnace of fire sevenfold heated, they sustained no harm whatever, neither was the smell of fire perceived upon them. As, therefore, the hand of God was present with them, working out marvellous things in their case— [things] impossible [to be accomplished] by man’s nature— what wonder was it, if also in the case of those who were translated it performed something wonderful, working in obedience to the will of God, even the Father? Now this is the Son of God, as the Scripture represents Nebuchadnezzar the king as having said, Did not we cast three men bound into the furnace? And, lo, I do see four walking in the midst of the fire, and the fourth is like the Son of God. Daniel 3:19-25 Neither the nature of any created thing, therefore, nor the weakness of the flesh, can prevail against the will of God. For God is not subject to created things, but created things to God; and all things yield obedience to His will. Wherefore also the Lord declares, The things which are impossible with men, are possible with God. Luke 18:27 As, therefore, it might seem to the men of the present day, who are ignorant of God’s appointment, to be a thing incredible and impossible that any man could live for such a number of years, yet those who were before us did live [to such an age], and those who were translated do live as an earnest of the future length of days; and [as it might also appear impossible] that from the whale’s belly and from the fiery furnace men issued forth unhurt, yet they nevertheless did so, led forth as it were by the hand of God, for the purpose of declaring His power: so also now, although some, not knowing the power and promise of God, may oppose their own salvation, deeming it impossible for God, who raises up the dead; to have power to confer upon them eternal duration, yet the scepticism of men of this stamp shall not render the faithfulness of God of none effect.
   Against Heresies (Book V, Chapter 5)

 

[steve_b]

Did Enoch and Elijah suffer from original sin? How could they not have? If they did how could they enter heaven? This is your guys issue not mine. You believe in purgatory. They were just and they lived by faith and they were sanctified by their faith. Did Enoch and Elijah get translated to heaven? You guys have a lot of explaining to do. It really doesnt matter I guess cuss youll just make it up as you always do.

As you would I’m sure say, How could ANYONE enter heaven before Jesus made that possible?

 

[SD_Catholic]

As you would I’m sure say, How could ANYONE enter heaven before Jesus made that possible?

I think HisAlone is thinking that if he keeps saying you guys brought it up and you can’t answer…even though I’ve seen it answered about 10 times… that eventually the thread would hit it’s limit and he would be set free without having to answer for his own statement … But then there was… Ag_Not II:thumbsup:

SD

 

[Realcatholicgk]

Say whatever you like. Do I care if you want to talk to me NO. You have no charity.

**Hi Bett,

You my friend have no respect. That is a sign of Charity! Respect the Blessed Mother and most Catholics will be charitable towards you! Insult her and suffer righteous Indignation!**

Instead of winning the lost souls of this world, you disgust people with your pompous attitude.

**A little judgement there are we? You believe I do not become nauseous with your attitude? You are too precious! The only thing that is important is the truth. The Catholic church is the real church all others are counterfeit and worthless, as they are, for salvation., They are a cancer on the body of Christ! No more, and no less. Many good people, maybe even yourself, are devoted to Jesus but actually dishonor Him and His real teachings by following Satan! **

You might learn a little from Benedictus or Cinette.

**They are very nice people. Sigh, If I wasn’t married! We all learn from each other. I even learn from Protestants. What amazes me is that there is so much knowledge, mixed with so much …ignorance! **

True catholics.

**And who appointed you as a judge? You might learn from hisalone! A true example of a Protestant! He attacks our Faith not us personally which is a violation of the TOS. But I won’t tell! I am a real christian and have charity and forgiveness! **

You didn’t even thank me for directing you to the mini tutorials.

**Like I wanted your guidance? Look at your religious beliefs. Anyway, Thanks for your misguided effort, to correct me. I really appreciated it!

**This thread will close soon. Seriously, thanks for your (name removed by moderator)ut! Lets pray for one another!

God Bless ****

 

[Realcatholicgk]

1. [In order to learn] that bodies did continue in existence for a lengthened period, as long as it was God’s good pleasure that they should flourish, let [these heretics] read the Scriptures, and they will find that our predecessors advanced beyond seven hundred, eight hundred, and nine hundred years of age; and that their bodies kept pace with the protracted length of their days, and participated in life as long as God willed that they should live. But why do I refer to these men? For Enoch, when he pleased God, was translated in the same body in which he did please Him, thus pointing out by anticipation the translation of the just. Elijah, too, was caught up [when he was yet] in the substance of the [natural] form; thus exhibiting in prophecy the assumption of those who are spiritual, and that nothing stood in the way of their body being translated and caught up. For by means of the very same hands through which they were moulded at the beginning, did they receive this translation and assumption. For in Adam the hands of God had become accustomed to set in order, to rule, and to sustain His own workmanship, and to bring it and place it where they pleased. Where, then, was the first man placed? In paradise certainly, as the Scripture declares And God planted a garden [paradisum] eastward in Eden, and there He placed the man whom He had formed. Genesis 2:8 And then afterwards when [man] proved disobedient, he was cast out thence into this world. Wherefore also the elders who were disciples of the apostles tell us that those who were translated were transferred to that place (for paradise has been prepared for righteous men, such as have the Spirit; in which place also Paul the apostle, when he was caught up, heard words which are unspeakable as regards us in our present condition 2 Corinthians 12:4), and that there shall they who have been translated remain until the consummation [of all things], as a prelude to immortality.
2. If, however, any one imagine it impossible that men should survive for such a length of time, and that Elias was not caught up in the flesh, but that his flesh was consumed in the fiery chariot, let him consider that Jonah, when he had been cast into the deep, and swallowed down into the whale’s belly, was by the command of God again thrown out safe upon the land. Jonah 2:11 And then, again, when Ananias, Azarias, and Misaël were cast into the furnace of fire sevenfold heated, they sustained no harm whatever, neither was the smell of fire perceived upon them. As, therefore, the hand of God was present with them, working out marvellous things in their case— [things] impossible [to be accomplished] by man’s nature— what wonder was it, if also in the case of those who were translated it performed something wonderful, working in obedience to the will of God, even the Father? Now this is the Son of God, as the Scripture represents Nebuchadnezzar the king as having said, Did not we cast three men bound into the furnace? And, lo, I do see four walking in the midst of the fire, and the fourth is like the Son of God. Daniel 3:19-25 Neither the nature of any created thing, therefore, nor the weakness of the flesh, can prevail against the will of God. For God is not subject to created things, but created things to God; and all things yield obedience to His will. Wherefore also the Lord declares, The things which are impossible with men, are possible with God. Luke 18:27 As, therefore, it might seem to the men of the present day, who are ignorant of God’s appointment, to be a thing incredible and impossible that any man could live for such a number of years, yet those who were before us did live [to such an age], and those who were translated do live as an earnest of the future length of days; and [as it might also appear impossible] that from the whale’s belly and from the fiery furnace men issued forth unhurt, yet they nevertheless did so, led forth as it were by the hand of God, for the purpose of declaring His power: so also now, although some, not knowing the power and promise of God, may oppose their own salvation, deeming it impossible for God, who raises up the dead; to have power to confer upon them eternal duration, yet the scepticism of men of this stamp shall not render the faithfulness of God of none effect.
   Against Heresies (Book V, Chapter 5)

**
Hi twb,

Make sure to save this it might come in handy on another thread. This one should close soon!

God Bless**

 

[rinnie]

All have fallen short of the glory of God
All have sinned
Even Mary
Even Enoch
Even Elijah

All have sinned. But would that no be falling from grace. But then how can you say once saved always saved. Now, now now. we can’t have it both ways. Tell me my partner in crime, where does it say Mary has sinned. Where does it say Jesus has sinned? Where does it say John the Baptism sinned. Show me show me? Get back in the bible now. And show me scripture!

 

[Realcatholicgk]

All have sinned. But would that no be falling from grace. But then how can you say once saved always saved. Now, now now. we can’t have it both ways. Tell me my partner in crime, where does it say Mary has sinned. Where does it say Jesus has sinned? Where does it say John the Baptism sinned. Show me show me? Get back in the bible now. And show me scripture!

**
hi rinnie,

Quick someone get me a stick. I want to beat this dead horse too!

freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing024.gif**

God Bless

 

[Martin777]

I’ll take a cue from you then and be likewise. Consider me suitably chastened:imsorry: :nunchuk:

I think I finally found a verse that sums up the critical differemce in what we believe about grace–Paul says in Rom 8 that we “have not received a spirit of fear again, leading to bondage, but we have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we cry out, ‘Abba, Father!’”. What you proclaim carries with it a note of fear. And the assumption is that if you don’t instill some fear in people, they just won’t perform! That is LAW, my friend. And the truly born again person is out from under that system. Paul says it is no longer about fear and bondage! It is about unconditional acceptance from a Father who has the power, love, desire and promise to complete the work He has begun in me, and to be to me FOREVER the perfect Father. That’s a critical difference between the RCC and Evangelicals.

 

[rinnie]

Did Enoch and Elijah suffer from original sin? How could they not have? If they did how could they enter heaven? This is your guys issue not mine. You believe in purgatory. They were just and they lived by faith and they were sanctified by their faith. Did Enoch and Elijah get translated to heaven? You guys have a lot of explaining to do. It really doesnt matter I guess cuss youll just make it up as you always do.

Down Boy, Where does it say in the bible that if you suffer from original sin you will not get to heaven. Where does it say that if you have any kind of sin you cannot get into heaven.

Hisalone you do not listen. You read but you do not understand what we are saying to you. Now lets get back to the basic.

In the bible it say’s that Mary was full of grace, I said that means no room for sin. I said she was saved from Original sin at conception. Did I not? That is what the Imaculate Conception is and was.

Now question # l you said where does it say Mary was sinless? My answer Full of Grace.

Now where does it say full of sin. Your turn now you dirty dog? Show me your answer I showed you mine!

Now what does grace mean again NO SIN. your turn!

 

[rinnie]

Hail Mary full of Grace the Lord is with thee. Just think about that for a moment. Mary we all know who she is, She is full of grace, Okay grace is good. Now here is something that is priceless. Just Price less. THE LORD IS WITH THEE. Just think for a moment. The Lord is with her. Okay now if someone is with me, IT means they stay with me and we are together. Now IF Mary is full of Grace, and God is with her, but she is sinning to be the band. Then what the Lord is a sinner too?

This reminds me of the China man who]s wife had a baby. And the baby was pure white, pure white hair, and the most blue eyes you ever saw. The nurse said Mr wong what are you going to name your baby? Mr wong responded Sum sing wong!

That’s kinda what im seeing here. SUM SING WONG!