Ag_nots Catholic Scriptural Challenge - just ONE proven example wins!!

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notsmart said:
So he just pulls my strings then? I don’t have to make any effort and suffer no toil, struggle nothing, nor be willing to lay my life down?
Sounds too good to be true.
You know, it is not good. Because its not true.
Why does Christ tell us to do things for others then if we decide we just dont want to because we are “saved” past, present and future sins included?
Why bother running at all?
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God knew we couldn’t obey as we should, so He sent His Son to pay the price. But His goal was not just forgiveness nor even justification. It was new life! If you are born again, His Spirit lives inside you to empower you to live on a whole different level. But His wrath was EMPTIED (as it pertains to the elect) on the cross. There truly remains NO condemnation for God’s precious ones. You have to see that.
 
Martin777 said:
God knew we couldn’t obey as we should, so He sent His Son to pay the price. But His goal was not just forgiveness nor even justification. It was new life! If you are born again, His Spirit lives inside you to empower you to live on a whole different level. But His wrath was EMPTIED (as it pertains to the elect) on the cross. There truly remains NO condemnation for God’s precious ones. You have to see that.
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No, I don’t see that.
I see that I can slip up anytime. I see no assurances of not slipping up in this life, and suddenly becoming purifyed here on earth (although some eastern orthodox think its possible)
but they go a bit deeper as to how that can happen.
And, its not because someone makes an altar call.
We can still sin. You don’t know anyone who is a “born again” who has not?
 
LutheranDK said:
Well, in theory.
It depends on what CONTENT you put into those words. Because yes, Mary WAS blessed, because she was the vesselby which Our Lord entered this world.

She was a great instrument of God. No more, no less. But that doesn’t mean that she should be put on the piedestal she has been.
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How about mother of God?

Even Luther had a higher opinion of Mary than THAT!!
 
steve_b said:
Your devaluing of the mother of God leaves me speechless.

Even Luther had a higher opinion of Mary than THAT!!
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Lutherans don’t believe they must follow all of Luther’s teachings. Some do more so, some much less so.
Its my understanding they will say they follow Christ, not Luther.
It is just a coincidence that he taught unique things they hold to.
 
Martin777 said:
Sorry, but that one was there too! Let that sink in. He will lose some reward in heaven for that, but not his sonship and eternal life.
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Unrepentant sinners are still golden?

Wow. No bother with running shoes then. No race to be had.
Was Paul crazy?
If you are talking about the crowns, those are laid down before Christ, so no man actually even gets any reward, for he lays whatever crown he gets at Christ’s feet, so it is never his.:cool:
 
notsmart said:
No, I don’t see that.
I see that I can slip up anytime. I see no assurances of not slipping up in this life, and suddenly becoming purifyed here on earth (although some eastern orthodox think its possible)
but they go a bit deeper as to how that can happen.
And, its not because someone makes an altar call.
We can still sin. You don’t know anyone who is a “born again” who has not?
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I would never say that. I am born again and I sin every day. I don’t want to, and I hate it when I do, but I know I am forgiven, and by God’s grace I am growing. But regardless of how far I progress, God assures me that He will never forsake me.
 
Martin777 said:
Matariel;4533426:
I will be glad to discuss each one. They will not contradict the doctrines of grace we have looked at.
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Judas never had grace from God?

Show me this in the bible. Jesus chose him. He had no grace, after being chosen? and Jesus picked a traitor to go to his flock and teach them?
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Martin777 said:
I would never say that. I am born again and I sin every day. I don’t want to, and I hate it when I do, but I know I am forgiven, and by God’s grace I am growing. But regardless of how far I progress, God assures me that He will never forsake me.
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But, if you don’t ask for forgiveness? Its still cool right?
 
Martin777 said:
Sorry, but that one was there too! Let that sink in. He will lose some reward in heaven for that, but not his sonship and eternal life.
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So, if one commits a mortal sin, knows it, does it anyway, and obstinately refuses to repent to God, he’ll go straight to Heaven when he dies? :eek:

OSAS has always never made sense to me.

“If anyone sees his brother sinning, if the sin is not deadly, he should pray to God and he will give him life. This is only for those whose sin is not deadly. There is such a thing as deadly sin * about which I do not say that you should pray.”

Deadly sin, or mortal sin, is just that-- if you commit it, you’re spiritual dead meat until you repent of your sin. :eek:*
 
notsmart said:
Unrepentant sinners are still golden?

Wow. No bother with running shoes then. No race to be had.
Was Paul crazy?
If you are talking about the crowns, those are laid down before Christ, so no man actually even gets any reward, for he lays whatever crown he gets at Christ’s feet, so it is never his.:cool:
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You might want to study the parables Jesus told about the rewards, the authority over cities, etc. We will lay our crowns at His feet, and the greatest thing about heaven will be simply being in the presence of the One who created everything and died for us…but I believe there will be eternal rewards as well. By the way, an ‘unrepentant sinner’ is not what scripture is talking about as a child of God.
 
Martin777 said:
Sorry, but that one was there too! Let that sink in. He will lose some reward in heaven for that, but not his sonship and eternal life.
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What do you mean by this statement? Do you mean that your reward in heaven is determined by how many unrepented sins you die without repenting for? Makes no sense to me.
 
Martin777 said:
You might want to study the parables Jesus told about the rewards, the authority over cities, etc. We will lay our crowns at His feet, and the greatest thing about heaven will be simply being in the presence of the One who created everything and died for us…but I believe there will be eternal rewards as well. By the way, an ‘unrepentant sinner’ is not what scripture is talking about as a child of God.
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Here we go again. If you don’t repent, you are okay. If you don’t repent, you never were one to begin with.:bighanky: :imsorry: :coolinoff:
 
Martin777 said:
You might want to study the parables Jesus told about the rewards, the authority over cities, etc. We will lay our crowns at His feet, and the greatest thing about heaven will be simply being in the presence of the One who created everything and died for us…but I believe there will be eternal rewards as well. By the way, an ‘unrepentant sinner’ is not what scripture is talking about as a child of God.
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Why do you assume I have not studied the parables?
Or the 5 crowns?🤷
 
Matariel said:
So, if one commits a mortal sin, knows it, does it anyway, and obstinately refuses to repent to God, he’ll go straight to Heaven when he dies? :eek:

OSAS has always never made sense to me.

“If anyone sees his brother sinning, if the sin is not deadly, he should pray to God and he will give him life. This is only for those whose sin is not deadly. There is such a thing as deadly sin * about which I do not say that you should pray.”

Deadly sin, or mortal sin, is just that-- if you commit it, you’re spiritual dead meat until you repent of your sin. :eek:*

I believe there is only one sin we can’t be saved from–What Jesus called the 'blasphemy of the Holy Spirit" I believe a ‘sin unto death’ is when one of God’s CHILDREN (saved) sins to the point that God takes him home–kills him, takes him off the street!
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notsmart said:
Why do you assume I have not studied the parables?
Or the 5 crowns?🤷
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I was assuming that with all you know, you might have had a moment of forgetfulness! What do you think about that parable where they are given levels of responsibility based on their performance? Could that be a foreshadow of something in heaven?
 
Martin777 said:
I believe there is only one sin we can’t be saved from–What Jesus called the 'blasphemy of the Holy Spirit" I believe a ‘sin unto death’ is when one of God’s CHILDREN (saved) sins to the point that God takes him home–kills him, takes him off the street!
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Wow! I think I have heard everything now!
 
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