Age difference and Dating

[roselily]

I’m looking for some Catholic perspectives on issues of differences in ages in dating. I am a 25 year old male (practicing Catholic) and have been praying earnestly for my future wife. My heart’s desire for the longest time has been to find and fall in love with a beautiful Catholic woman with the same/similar “vision” or dreams as I have in wanting to have and raise a Catholic family. A little over a year ago, I met a nice woman on a church retreat. Other than a few occasional “bump-ins” I have not seen or spoken much with her until God crossed our paths on another church retreat just recently. We were able to talk more and eventually tumbled upon the topic of what we were both looking for in future spouses and visions for our futures. It turns out that everything i’ve been looking and praying for is found in this woman. Our morals, beliefs, values, dreams, and desires match so well together that it almost seems too good to be true. And it probably is, I guess…since she is only 17. We are not dating but have talked a little about it. I am anticipating that it won’t happen since her parents told her that they think I am too old.

Being 25, I have a pretty good idea of what I’m looking for in a wife, where I am going in life, and that God has a plan for me (as He does for everyone). I am anticipating some responses regarding or questioning the maturity level of the girl and how it is probably common for “younger” aged girls to dream of marrying and raising a family and such. Though she might have yet to grow to full maturity, if her dreams of getting married to a man of my characteristics/values, and raising a good Catholic family never change, then is there any particular age/time in which it would be more “appropriate” or better to date each other? If two people match up so well, should age be the determining factor in preventing them from the chance of falling in love and realizing/living their dreams together? Do you think her parents would ever have a metanoia (change of heart) on the age issue? Any thoughts appreciated: ) Thank you and God Bless.

I saw an old BBC TV series before: Lillie-the mistress of Edward VII, in the Beginning, a young man met a woman at the beach , and that he loved the woman , and they met again…and later the young man went to the woman’s home , and asked her dad if he can marry her, and her dad feel quiet glad, but he said that his daughter just 14 years old, she just looks and behaves like a woman. but she still a child…, and the young man went away…and I felt sorry for what happened the fate of that girl later ,
…
…and I think 17 is already a woman.

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

…and I think 17 is already a woman.

No offense, but there is such a thing called statutory rape in this country.

 

[pia]

No offense, but there is such a thing called statutory rape in this country.

I think that is a terrible thing to say, i’m sure the op will be devastated when he sees this there was no call for it.all seventeen year olds are not the same, some are more mature than others fact.my daughters are 17 and 19 and i know my eldest one was more mature on her outlook on life at 17 than my youngest daughter is now. my advice to you rocco23 is give her parents time, just be friends with her and don’t rush things you sound like a lovely person, i’m sure given time things will turn out right if they are mean’t to be. sadly there are not enough young people like you about these days that hold the belief,morals and values that you hold. God bless

 

[The_Catechumen]

No offense, but there is such a thing called statutory rape in this country.

This was certainly uncalled for. It’s not exactly going out on a limb to give posters in this forum the benefit of the doubt by supposing that they’re not engaged in unwed sex with minors.

A chaste courtship does not violate the law, civil or moral. Nor does consensual sex within a legal, sacramental marriage.

Hope this helps.

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

No, I think it absolutely needed to be said. A 17-year-old girl is NOT a woman, at least not in the eyes of the law. If this weren’t a Catholic forum, what the OP is suggesting would be against the law, and the administrators - I hope - would have an obligation to close this thread or even report it to the authorities.

 

[lovemysix]

I do believe age of consent varies from state to state, but in many states it is 16. So actually it very well might be perfectly legal in the OP’s state.

But it’s beside the point, because the OP is not suggesting he wants to have SEX with this girl, for heaven’s sake! He is genuinely interested in the possibility of pursuing a relationship and asked for a Catholic perspective on it.

I was 18 when I met my husband, 19 when I started dating, and 21 when I married him. He is six years older than I am. My mother was totally against it. Not listening to her on the subject was the best decision I ever made in my life. Seventeen years later, I am still grateful on a daily basis for the gift of my husband.

She is only 17 and still living with her parents. If they are against it, you need to respect that. But in a year she will be legally an adult and perfectly capable of making her own decisions with regard to you. My advice would be to remain friends for now, and see what develops a year or two down the road. God bless!

 

[pia]

No, I think it absolutely needed to be said. A 17-year-old girl is NOT a woman, at least not in the eyes of the law. If this weren’t a Catholic forum, what the OP is suggesting would be against the law, and the administrators - I hope - would have an obligation to close this thread or even report it to the authorities.

Have i missed something, just what is the op suggesting in your opinion.

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

I do believe age of consent varies from state to state, but in many states it is 16. So actually it very well might be perfectly legal in the OP’s state.

That is beside the point. Massachusetts allows same-sex marriage; does that make it OK? You’re also making excuses for him, because the majority of states have it at 18.

But it’s beside the point, because the OP is not suggesting he wants to have SEX with this girl, for heaven’s sake! He is genuinely interested in the possibility of pursuing a relationship and asked for a Catholic perspective on it.

I’m quite surprised by your statement. There is a reason why these laws exist - they are meant to protect the minors in our society. If you will kindly note, the OP never stated whether he is or isn’t having sex with the said girl, nor did he state his intentions. Now let’s talk about near occasions of sin. This just makes for a very bad situation, regardless whether they’re having/planning to have sex or not. I really thought that the adults of this forum would’ve known better.

I also do not buy the statement that this may be God’s will. No one knows for sure what His will is, but that is NOT a reason or an excuse to engage in immoral behavior. For all we know, the Devil may be behind this. The bottom line is that if this is illegal or have the potential of breaking the law, it’s best to steer clear.

 

[roselily]

No offense, but there is such a thing called statutory rape in this country.

No, I think it absolutely needed to be said. A 17-year-old girl is NOT a woman, at least not in the eyes of the law. If this weren’t a Catholic forum, what the OP is suggesting would be against the law, and the administrators - I hope - would have an obligation to close this thread or even report it to the authorities.

Terrified by that thought, I felt guilty, but not to that degree. I do not know what about others call them, but I know that they are both Catholic Christians, so I believe they know what is the law, and can respect each other, and why they can not keep pure good friendship now until they are ready to go on. I think now that boy just want friendship with that girl.

 

[lovemysix]

You brought up the legality issue, SomeCatholicGuy, not I. And at least according to this website, 18 is NOT the norm for the states in the US:

livestrong.com/article/12483-age-consensual-sex/

As far as the morality of it is goes, I don’t believe I have ever read anywhere that having a friendship with a person of the age of 17, with the idea that perhaps this will blossom into a romantic love in a year or two, is immoral.

While I understand the need to protect minors, I also think it is important to realize that just because a girl is 17 does not necessarily mean she is not ready for a real relationship. Note: I gave a caveat to OP in that her parents are against her dating him, she lives under their roof, and therefore he should respect her parents wishes until she is 18.

Church tradition teaches us that Mary was very young when she bore Jesus (13 is what I always heard). Are you really saying that you believe our Lord would have been born to a 13 year old (btw, wasn’t Joseph like 33 according to tradition?) girl if participating in a relationship is totally immoral for anybody who is not 18!!! Please! These things are not so set in stone. Societal norms change, yes…I’m not saying I want my 13 yr old running off with a 33 yr old; today that just wouldn’t fly. But to say that any relationship situation in which a girl is not 18 is immoral is not something I believe the Church has ever taught.

 

[ack]

That is beside the point. Massachusetts allows same-sex marriage; does that make it OK? You’re also making excuses for him, because the majority of states have it at 18.

I also do not buy the statement that this may be God’s will. No one knows for sure what His will is, but that is NOT a reason or an excuse to engage in immoral behavior. For all we know, the Devil may be behind this. The bottom line is that if this is illegal or have the potential of breaking the law, it’s best to steer clear.

The church teaches that a woman can marry starting at 14 years old, if the civil society also permits it. So how do you come to the conclusion that the church would find dating a 17-year-old to be “immoral”?

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

I never said friendship isn’t fine, but that’s not what the OP was asking about. Seriously people, a girl who’s 13 or 14??? No offense, but that’s what’s called pedophilia!!! And you are condoning this? It’s frigging mind-boggling and sick what people are suggesting here! Argh!!!

 

[ack]

The church teaches that a woman can marry starting at 14 years old, if the civil society also permits it. So how do you come to the conclusion that the church would find dating a 17-year-old to be “immoral”?

FYI, here is some information on marriage prep from the US Bishops Conference:

usccb.org/laity/marriage/mpanalysis.shtml

Age
Age usually refers to young couples where at least one partner is a teenager. State laws vary as to the legal age for marriage, but for the Church’s purposes most policies simply refer to teens.iii Maturity varies with the individual and many couples past their teens are not ready to take on the commitment and responsibilities of marriage and would benefit from similar extra attention. In addition to professional assessment, discussion facilitated by a premarital inventory can help such couples to recognize their need for more time. Many policies include parents in this discernment process. The policies of St. Petersburg and Wisconsin have extensive resources for meeting with parents.

Age, however, can also apply to older couples. Despite the tendency to believe they need less preparation because of their presumed maturity, many policies note the special issues that are unique to older couples that merit discussion, i.e., previous relationships (especially for divorced or widowed men and women), finances, transition from a single lifestyle to a marriage partnership, and obligations to family members. (Cincinnati)

Although the USCCB does have the authority to set a minimum marriage age, it doesn’t look like they have done so, other than requiring that the parties can marry legally in their state.

 

[whatevergirl]

***There’s no reasonable and valid reason any of us should suggest that rocco forces the issue, with this 17 yr old girl. I have a soon to be 13 yr old girl, and a 16 yr old son…no way does my son need to be thinking about getting serious with a 25 yr old woman right now in his life…there is no reason to rush dating along, when a teenager hasn’t even graduated high school. I’m confused by some of the sentiments here, as if this young girl should rush to date this man…there is no rush, and most of us who have teenagers, would not want them dating someone who is out of college, let alone highschool.

I married a man 10 yrs older than me, but I wasn’t a teenager. I was well equipped to think for myself, I was living on my own, and going to college. I think that a girl in highschool needs to grow a bit on her own…before getting involved with someone in his 20’s. The age difference is smaller than between my dh and me, yes–but again, a teen in highschool should be permitted to be a teen, while she still is one.

Rocco–you sound like a nice man. Just be patient, if you and she are meant to be together in the longterm, God will arrange it all to happen. Just don’t rush it now.

God bless you!***

 

[Pro-Life_Teen]

I never said friendship isn’t fine, but that’s not what the OP was asking about. Seriously people, a girl who’s 13 or 14??? No offense, but that’s what’s called pedophilia!!! And you are condoning this? It’s frigging mind-boggling and sick what people are suggesting here! Argh!!!

Technically, it isn’t paedophilia, 13 and 14 are post-pubescent. And until recent times, 14 year olds were adult enough to marry and have children, in many cultures they are married still at that age, or younger, though the consumation might be later on. Some states here allow marriage at 14 with the consent of a judge or the parents, even.

He also wasn’t saying sex. He was saying date/court. I presume, like a good deal of the rest here, that it would be chaste. And at 17, it is the legal age for sex in many states. My grandmothers were both married at 17 for that matter.

That her parents have a problem is something that should be resolved. Either talk to them, show them you’re a good man with good intentions, or wait until she’s older. As some have said, if she’s the one you’ll marry, then wait for her.

Tolkien met his future wife at 16 and was told not to contact her until he was 21. Depending on the source, Tolkien either listened or did not but the accounts I’ve read have said that he did listen, more or less… But the day he turned 21 he contacted her again and asked to marry her. And as I said future wife at the beginning of this, it seems to have worked.

 

[The_Catechumen]

I never said friendship isn’t fine, but that’s not what the OP was asking about. Seriously people, a girl who’s 13 or 14??? No offense, but that’s what’s called pedophilia!!! And you are condoning this? It’s frigging mind-boggling and sick what people are suggesting here! Argh!!!

Why do you insist on projecting this notion onto people that they’re advocating pedophilia or immoral sex acts? I suggest you go back and re-read what’s been stated; it’s clearly not the case at all.

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

Why do you insist on projecting this notion onto people that they’re advocating pedophilia or immoral sex acts? I suggest you go back and re-read what’s been stated; it’s clearly not the case at all.

I’m projecting? Give me a break! I’m not the one suggesting having sex with 13-year-old year girl is fine and dandy. What the heck else would you call that, if not sickening and immoral??? I think people who think otherwise need to really re-examine what they’re saying. Doesn’t take a genius to figure out that it is wrong!

I simply cannot believe what some people are saying here. Am I in a parallel universe or something? And this is a Catholic forum, for Heaven’s sake! Even on a secular forum, something like this would be condemned. Seriously, people!

 

[Nevarlander]

I’m 22 and at seventeen I would have loved this, but now that I have five more years of experience (including an older creeper - no reflection intended on OP, this guy was Chris Hansen material), I can safely say that most girls that age aren’t ready for this. Even if her parents don’t object, an adult spending time with someone not an adult in hopes that she’ll later be attracted to him (or he to her, however you want to do it) sets up the potential for an unhealthy power differential, where she defers to him because he’s older, especially as an older guy. That’s not something most people want, and if OP does want this I have nothing more to say to him except .

If not, to OP: Hold off for a few years, then try to get to know her better, when you can meet her on equal terms. It’ll be better for the both of you.

 

[The_Catechumen]

I’m projecting? Give me a break! I’m not the one suggesting having sex with 13-year-old year girl is fine and dandy. What the heck else would you call that, if not sickening and immoral??? I think people who think otherwise need to really re-examine what they’re saying. Doesn’t take a genius to figure out that it is wrong!

I simply cannot believe what some people are saying here. Am I in a parallel universe or something? And this is a Catholic forum, for Heaven’s sake! Even on a secular forum, something like this would be condemned. Seriously, people!

Let’s review.

A man came asking how best to go about approaching a 17 year old woman. Replies were in the spectrum between “wait till she’s older and more mature” to “get familial consent for a chaste courtship.” Nobody mentions anything about anyone having sex with her until you reply to an opinion about maturity by suggesting that it constitutes rape. Posts are made clarifying that jurisdictions do in fact vary greatly with their statutory definitions. Historical context is added about marriage customs. Then you make unfounded accusations of sexual immorality and promoting pedophilia.

While most everyone else in this thread is giving rocco the benefit of the doubt regarding his judgment and morality, you’re instead quick to cast the first stone in all the most heinous terms. You have been projecting the mark of shame and sin where there is no basis for it whatsoever.

Knock it off, please.

 

[SomeCatholicGuy]

Let’s review.

A man came asking how best to go about approaching a 17 year old woman. Replies were in the spectrum between “wait till she’s older and more mature” to “get familial consent for a chaste courtship.” Nobody mentions anything about anyone having sex with her until you reply to an opinion about maturity by suggesting that it constitutes rape. Posts are made clarifying that jurisdictions do in fact vary greatly with their statutory definitions. Historical context is added about marriage customs. Then you make unfounded accusations of sexual immorality and promoting pedophilia.

While most everyone else in this thread is giving rocco the benefit of the doubt regarding his judgment and morality, you’re instead quick to cast the first stone in all the most heinous terms. You have been projecting the mark of shame and sin where there is no basis for it whatsoever.

Knock it off, please.

Yes, let’s review. You’re absolutely right that I said that having sex with a minor constitutes statutory rape. It’s a fact, and it’s the law. What don’t you understand about that? Did I say the OP was committing statutory rape? No. I was replying to the comment about a 17-year-old girl being a woman. Way to go on taking it out of context!

Yes, statutes do vary depending on the state, but how in the world do you know that the state the OP lives in does not classify having sex with a 17-year-old girl as statutory rape? Furthermore, it may be legal to marry someone under 17 in some states, but it is NOT legal to have sex with someone who’s 17 outside of marriage. There’s a big difference!!!

The accusations I made about sexual immorality and pedophilia were not directed at the OP; I was merely responding to those who implied that having sex with 13-year-olds was once OK, so it must be OK now, too. Sorry, bro/sis, but that doesn’t fly with me, no matter how you put it! It is sickening and immoral, period. Shame on those who think otherwise!