Ah-men VS Ey-men

[japhy]

I pronounce it “ah-men”.

But Amen is actually Hebrew. Has never really been translated into English or Latin. (So are the words, Alleluia, Sabbaoth, and Hosanna, by the way.)

Well, technically, the word Alleluia is the Latinized (via the Greek, I suppose) version of the Hebrew phrase “Hallelu [all you, praise (imperative)] jah [the LORD]”. Every now and then, you’ll see it spelled the Hebrew way in some hymns or songs.

 

[ibkc]

Deep South convert here. I make it a point to say Ah-men always, mostly because I grew up hearing various holy-roller types yelling “AAAAYYYYYY-MEN BROTHER!” and I don’t want to sound anything like that.

 

[ljubim]

I grew up post Vatican 2, so it was Ay-men in my lingua franca.

Just for fun, this is how we sang the Great Ay-men in my parish in the 70s.
youtube.com/watch?v=aQpYwEGS3tU&feature=related

Are you pulling our leg grace?

ProVobis and Bpbasilphx, then I wonder why we don’t stick to the original? We didn’t really change any of the other words, besides spellings… maybe it would be wise for us to promote Ah-men / Ah-min.

 

[Phemie]

Are you pulling our leg grace?

Known by many as the “Lilies of the Field” Amen it’s the first one I can remember singing in Church way back when. It was very popular in the 70s – sometimes an Alleluia was added:

Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-men, ay-men, ay-men.

 

[SMHW]

The pronunciation ey-men, meanwhile, is a product of the Great Vowel Shift during the 15th century, “is associated with Irish Protestantism and conservative Evangelical Protestant denominations generally, and the pronunciation that is typically sung in gospel music.”

I’m curious about this.

Over the years I’ve asked this question of life-long Catholics of Irish ancestry. I know that Catholics of Irish and English ancestry have been using the ey-men pronunciation since they were children. Most looked at me kind of funny and said that ey-men was English and ah-men was Latin. I’ve asked a couple English Catholics and they told me they understood ey-men to be the Catholic version ah-men to be the protestant version of the English pronunciation of the word.

It would seem that even if ey-men started with Irish Protestants it at some point became associated with Irish and English Catholics (who brought that pronunciation to the United States.)

 

[Phemie]

I’m curious about this.

Over the years I’ve asked this question of life-long Catholics of Irish ancestry. I know that Catholics of Irish and English ancestry have been using the ey-men pronunciation since they were children. Most looked at me kind of funny and said that ey-men was English and ah-men was Latin. I’ve asked a couple English Catholics and they told me they understood ey-men to be the Catholic version ah-men to be the protestant version of the English pronunciation of the word.

It would seem that even if ey-men started with Irish Protestants it at some point became associated with Irish and English Catholics (who brought that pronunciation to the United States.)

Interestingly, if you check the pronunciation in the online dictionary they say ah-men even when ay-men is written as an option.

 

[ljubim]

Known by many as the “Lilies of the Field” Amen it’s the first one I can remember singing in Church way back when. It was very popular in the 70s – sometimes an Alleluia was added:

Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-men, ay-men, ay-men.

Oh, I didn’t mean the lyrics, I meant the way they were singing it.

 

[Jennifer_G]

Glad you asked. AH-MEN always.

AY-MEN seems too secular.

Or Pentacostal/Evangelical/Baptist.

But, personally, I’ve never had a preference. Although, everytime I hear “ah-men”, I think of Mother Angelica’s nuns praying the Rosary.

 

[zab]

“Amen. Amen, I say to you…” I have never heard these passages read as “Ah-men Ah-men, I say to you…”

 

[CappaMagna]

Known by many as the “Lilies of the Field” Amen it’s the first one I can remember singing in Church way back when. It was very popular in the 70s – sometimes an Alleluia was added:

Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-men, ay-men, ay-men.

Lilies of the Field is a GREAT little movie starring Sidney Portier. Highly recommended.

In the movie (as a construction worker with a Baptist background) he’s trying to teach some German nuns a spiritual song “Amen” by Jester Hairston. There is a scene where he says “AYE-men!” and the sisters reply “AH-men.” He says nein to that and teaches them to sing AYE-men for the song. They quickly catch on.

 

[zab]

Known by many as the “Lilies of the Field” Amen it’s the first one I can remember singing in Church way back when. It was very popular in the 70s – sometimes an Alleluia was added:

Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-ay-men, Alleluia
Ay-ay-men, ay-men, ay-men.

That is the only time that I recall ever singing the Great Amen in a non Latin version . By the way, do you say the great Ay- men or the Great Ah–men?

 

[Phemie]

That is the only time that I recall ever singing the Great Amen in a non Latin version . By the way, do you say the great Ay- men or the Great Ah–men?

We say the Great Ah-men but I have to admit that if I listen carefully I hear both Ah-men & Ay-men at Mass if it’s not sung.

 

[zab]

We say the Great Ah-men but I have to admit that if I listen carefully I hear both Ah-men & Ay-men at Mass if it’s not sung.

II was not referring to when we say, “Amen” during Mass but when speaking of the part of the Mass referred to as “The Great Amen”.

 

[Cristiano]

The pronunciation in Greek, Slavonic, and Arabic is Ah-MEEN, accent on the second syllable, which is closer to the Hebrew pronunciation.

When it comes to the Amen I am a Liturgical Fascist, and the above description is the only one that I use and tolerate.

 

[SMHW]

I say “Ay-men”, following spoken prayers like the Our Father and Hail Mary, etc., and when receiving the Body and the Blood of Christ

When we sing, it is usually “Ah-men”

I seem to recall that when I was in parochial school, we were taught to say Ah-men for Latin, and Ay-men in English.

This was how it was in my parochial school. We just took it for granted that you pronounced things differently depending on the language. That’s how the priests and sisters did things. I think most of us would have considered saying, “Ah-men,” when praying in English to be sort of snobby. I now believe it was more a matter of ethnicity.

(And when I started parochial school --prior to 1965-- Mass was still in Latin.)

 

[Phemie]

II was not referring to when we say, “Amen” during Mass but when speaking of the part of the Mass referred to as “The Great Amen”.

It’s usually referred to as the Great Ah-men. We sing it as ‘ah-men’ but if it’s spoken it’s a mixture of ah-men and ay-men.

 

[Jamie_Burns]

Amen is Hebrew for Credo: I believe. Whenever I have been to Temple with friends or around the table at the Shabbat meal it is pronounced: A-Meyn.

 

[EasterJoy]

Spoken as “ey”, but sung as “ah” in our parts. I always took this as the English version being spoken and the Latin version being sung because the “ah” makes a more pleasing melody sound, especially if held in a long note.

Having said that, this a poTAYto/poTAHto debate if I ever heard one. Say it the way that feels right, dictate one or the other be used by the choir, that makes sense, but reading any substantial theological meaning into the question would be over the top. You may as well say there is a Catholic and a Protestant way to hang toilet paper.

 

[malphono]

But Amen is actually Hebrew. Has never really been translated into English or Latin.

But it was translated into French. It’s interesting to note that the traditional French rendering is ainsi soit-il which captures the original meaning rather well. Strange, but the post-conciliar usage in French seems to have morphed into “amen” with some few “hold-outs” keeping to the older translation.

 

[malphono]

Amen is Hebrew for Credo: I believe. Whenever I have been to Temple with friends or around the table at the Shabbat meal it is pronounced: A-Meyn.

That would seem to be an Ashkenazic pronunciation. The Mizrahi (oriental) pronunciation is more like “a-meen” (without the diphthong), as noted earlier by bpbasilphx.