(Alberta) Abolish Catholic school districts, former education minister urges

[Peter_Plato]

No, it is entirely equitable. Everyone has access to the fully funded public system.

You haven’t explained why there must be only one fully funded public system, except that that is the way you dogmatically say it MUST be.

Why can’t there be two or three fully funded systems provided they are no more costly to run than the one?

After all, the system runs on per pupil grants, so why can’t sufficiently large groups take their portion based upon the per pupil allowance and set up their own schools if they have the numbers in certain locales?

In fact that is what is already in place in Alberta and is no less equitable – in fact it is decidedly more so – than your proposal.

There is no reason that the state should monopolize education in any jurisdiction and no reason why it should penalize parents for choosing not to have their children indoctrinated by social propaganda. Let’s not kid ourselves. This is precisely why this new government is flexing its muscles right now. And you would be an NDP supporter, correct?

The government should only concern itself with the quality of education and not the indoctrination of children into trending social ideologies.

Again, out of interest…

Are you a supporter of same sex marriage and the “rights” of transgendered individuals to washrooms of their choice? Full disclosure.

 

[Peter_Plato]

Compare this to the way I think it works in the US, …

To make the claim that the situation is the U.S. is “comparable” is to assume that the education system there actually works and works well. You would have to ignore a great deal of data to make the claim that the U.S. system is one to be emulated. We have no reason to want to “compare this to the way” you think “it works in the US.” Alberta has quite consistently ranked in the top nations and actually -]has/-]… well, had… a system to be emulated until politician-types and ideologues got their murky little fingers into the pie, ostensibly trying to make it “better.”

It has seemed that a little competititon from dual or several parallel systems cannot be bad for education and it makes the indoctrination of children by the State a tad more difficult. Both good reasons to keep things as they are. That is if you are at all interested in the education of children and not mere social engineering or mind-molding.

 

[cycleman]

A few final words, this could go on forever.

There is no question that the Alberta system as it exists today is inequitable. Catholics enjoy full funding denied to other faiths.

My solution is to have a single publicly funded system, and to fund all religious schools at something less than full funding. This is because one strong publicly funded system is, in my view, preferable to a smorgasbord of small boards all over the place.

You appear to favor full funding of any group with sufficient numbers. I think that will lead to a fracturing of the education system. You don’t. Fair enough.

I’m not sure whether you are an Albertan, or whether you just have an opinion of how things should run in the province. I am a long term Albertan, I will continue to lobby my MLA for abolition of the separate school system as I have done for years. (By the way, the individual calling for the abolition of the Catholic system that was the original subject of this thread is a former Conservative education minister, not an NDPer

If you are an Albertan, you are free to advocate as you see fit.

 

[Brendan]

It sounds like Quebec has got a fair system whereby the public purse does partially support private schools, but the single public system is funded preferentially.

I fail to see how the Alberta ( or Ontario) system is unfair. Each taxpayer chooses which board collects their taxes.

If there is unfairness, it would not be that the separate school system not exist, but rather, that the taxpayers have more options to choose from in whom their tax money goes to. A Jewish school board that is fully funded by those who choose to direct their tax dollars there. Or a Muslim one.

In that way, the taxpayer has the greatest choice on which system to support. It is their money after all.

 

[cycleman]

I fail to see how the Alberta ( or Ontario) system is unfair. Each taxpayer chooses which board collects their taxes.

If there is unfairness, it would not be that the separate school system not exist, but rather, that the taxpayers have more options to choose from in whom their tax money goes to. A Jewish school board that is fully funded by those who choose to direct their tax dollars there. Or a Muslim one.

In that way, the taxpayer has the greatest choice on which system to support. It is their money after all.

It’s actually a fallacy that taxpayers have freedom of choice of school support in Alberta. If you are Catholic, you must direct your taxes to the Catholic Board and your children must go (with limited exceptions) to the Catholic school. Non Catholic, taxes/kids to public board.

The school support form is actually a declaration of religion form. It is not ’ I elect to support’, it is 1) I am Roman Catholic, or 2) I am not Roman Catholic.

Only way to direct your taxes to the ‘other board’ is to lie on the declaration.

Regarding you comments on having many faith boards, see my post 23 above. It’s not my preferred solution, but yes it is an option.

 

[abucs]

You haven’t explained why there must be only one fully funded public system, except that that is the way you dogmatically say it MUST be.

Yes, and the bigger question that needs to be explained is why the government education sector supports only godless non religious education.

Why do the godless have government schools that support their cultural outlook and yet the Catholic doesn’t have any government Catholic schools supporting their cultural outlook?

This is quite inequitable and undefendable.

Separating education into two camps; secular and faith based and supporting one over the other with public money is just as inequitable as me separating education into the two camps of Catholic and non Catholic and using public money to support one over the other.

 

[Peter_Plato]

It’s actually a fallacy that taxpayers have freedom of choice of school support in Alberta. If you are Catholic, you must direct your taxes to the Catholic Board and your children must go (with limited exceptions) to the Catholic school. Non Catholic, taxes/kids to public board.

The school support form is actually a declaration of religion form. It is not ’ I elect to support’, it is 1) I am Roman Catholic, or 2) I am not Roman Catholic.

Only way to direct your taxes to the ‘other board’ is to lie on the declaration.

Regarding you comments on having many faith boards, see my post 23 above. It’s not my preferred solution, but yes it is an option.

Well, now you are perilously close to telling a falsehood and making stuff up at the same time.

The form does not obligate you to anything. In fact, if you leave all the check boxes blank, the default is the public board. You have the option of sending your children to either of the school divisions in your area and designate precisely where your tax dollars go. Furthermore, where a couple has one RC spouse and the other not, the option to split the taxes is available.

 

[Peter_Plato]

(By the way, the individual calling for the abolition of the Catholic system that was the original subject of this thread is a former Conservative education minister, not an NDPer

Well, the most recent Wiki information on him is that he is a member of the Green Party and lives in Victoria, B.C. So further left on the spectrum than even the NDP are.

He also penned a rather glowing article in the Calgary Herald about how the NDP government is much more representative of the people in Alberta than the Conservatives were. So I wouldn’t take his former Conservative life as indicative of anything at the moment.
calgaryherald.com/opinion/columnists/king-dont-be-too-quick-to-dismiss-new-ndp-cabinets-ability

 

[Peter_Plato]

A few final words, this could go on forever.

There is no question that the Alberta system as it exists today is inequitable. Catholics enjoy full funding denied to other faiths.

My solution is to have a single publicly funded system, and to fund all religious schools at something less than full funding.

You need to look up the definition of just and equitable, then, because clearly your view is unbalanced, prejudiced against religious believers and jaundiced.