All graces flow through Mary

[cjforJesus]

My previous posts apply.

Understanding certain words will help: grace; office; saving office; role; motherhood; Advocate; Mediatrix etc…

Then read these words as one unified whole to give the sense, the true meaning.

Also, look up what it means in grammar when a title is given a capital letter i.e:- I could say: “I am applying for the position of Nurse”. I cannot say “I am Nurse”. I could say “I am A nurse”. Or in a specific department somewhere, if I was the only one, I could say: “I am the Nurse”. Or “I am Nurse here”.

This document uses these title with capitals in the wider perspective of ALL THINGS. Our Lady’s ‘saving office’, ‘Grace’, ‘Role’, ‘Motherhood’; as ‘Advocate’, ‘Mediatrix’, ‘Benefactress’.

here is a list of some of the titles of Mary,notice that all of them are capitalized.

roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html

roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html

 

[friardchips]

here is a list of some of the titles of Mary,notice that all of them are capitalized.
roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html
roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html

I’m talking about that document. As you know well know.

 

[friardchips]

No. “Order of grace” means the ranking of all created beings according to how much grace they have merited and possess in their being. Mary is the first ranked creature in how much grace she has. She ranks before all beings except the Divine Trinity.

Sorry, Hunho. I’m not sure how I read your post incorrectly earlier.

You explained far more eloquantly than me.

 

[friardchips]

here is a list of some of the titles of Mary,notice that all of them are capitalized.

roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html

roman-catholic-saints.com/titles-of-mary.html

Actually, this is a really special gem of a site. I love this!

A great post, IMO!

I don’t know how you found this site with all these titles but it is really amazing!

Nice one!

 

[friardchips]

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4.htm

So presumably, going by these references then, Our Lady of ALL graces is infallible knowledge?

 

[cjforJesus]

Actually, this is a really special gem of a site. I love this!

A great post, IMO!

I don’t know how you found this site with all these titles but it is really amazing!

Nice one!

Thank you! As you can see though all of Mary’s titles are capitalized. I am not sure but I do not think the title “dispensatrix” is there.

 

[JM3]

The question here concerns a specific dogma where it is to be declared that Mary is the only Mediatrix of all grace.

I believe Benedict XVI said that a dogmatic statement wasn’t needed, as the teaching is protected by the authority of the Popes and, therefore, infallible.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

1. Leo XIII, Encyclical, Octobri mense adventante, Sept 22, 1891, *** 24, 1891, 196.

… it is right to say, that nothing at all of that very great treasury of all grace which the Lord brought us–for ‘grace and truth came through Jesus Christ’ [Jn 1.17]–nothing is imparted to us except through Mary, since God so wills, so that just as no one can come to the Father except through the Son, so in general, no one can come to Christ except through His Mother.

1. St. Pius X, Encyclical, Ad diem illum, Feb. 2, 1904, AAS 36, 1904. 453-54.

Hence that never dissociated manner of life and labors of the Mother and the Son… . there stood by the Cross of Jesus His Mother, not merely occupied in looking at the dreadful sight, but even rejoicing that ‘her only Son was being offered for the salvation of the human race; and so did she suffer, with Him, that if it had been possible, she would have much more gladly suffered herself all the torments that her Son underwent’ [St. Bonaventure I. Sent. d, 48, ad Litt. dub. 4]. Now from this common sharing of will and suffering between Christ and Mary, she ‘merited to become most worthily the Reparatrix of the lost world’ [Eadmer, De Excellentia Virginis Mariae, 9] and therefore Dispensatrix of all the gifts which Jesus gained for us by His Death and by His Blood… But Mary as St. Bernard fittingly remarks [De Aquaeductu 4] is the ‘channel’ or, even, the neck, through which the body is joined to the head, and likewise through which the head exerts its power and strength on the body. ‘For she is the neck of our Head, by which all spiritual gifts are communicated to His Mystical Body.’ [St. Bernardine of Siena, Quadrag. De Evangelio aeterno, Sermo X, a. 3. c. 3.]

1. Benedict XV, Litterae Apostolicae, Inter Sodalicia, March 22, 1918, AAS 10, 1918, 182.

… the fact that she was with Him crucified and dying, was in accord with the divine plan. For with her suffering and dying Son, Mary endured suffering and almost death. She gave up her Mother’s rights over her Son to procure the salvation of mankind, and to appease the divine justice, she, as much as she could, immolated her Son, so that one can truly affirm that together with Christ she has redeemed the human race. But if for this reason, every kind of grace we receive from the treasury of the redemption is ministered as it were through the hands of the same Sorrowful Virgin, everyone can see that a holy death should be expected from her, since it is precisely by this gift that the work of the Redemption is effectively and permanently completed in each one … further, there is a most constant belief among the faithful, proved by long experience, that as many as employ the same Virgin as Patron, will not at all perish forever.

 

[cjforJesus]

I believe Benedict XVI said that a dogmatic statement wasn’t needed, as the teaching is protected by the authority of the Popes and, therefore, infallible.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

No,I believe POpe Benedict XVI said the wording is too ambiguous. St John Paul 2 also had a commission study the issue and they came to the same conclusion.Someone posted the results earlier and if you scroll back you can see why.

The teaching is not that Mary is Dispensatrix as Pope Leo 13 claimed but Mediatrix.They are two very different titles. A Mediatrix is a female intercessor.

 

[JM3]

No,I believe POpe Benedict XVI said the wording is too ambiguous. St John Paul 2 also had a commission study the issue and they came to the same conclusion.Someone posted the results earlier and if you scroll back you can see why.

The teaching is not that Mary is Dispensatrix as Pope Leo 13 claimed but Mediatrix.They are two very different titles. A Mediatrix is a female intercessor.

Perhaps, you didn’t look at the link I gave. So, here it is again.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

1. Leo XIII, Encyclical, Diuturni temporis spatium, Sept 5, 1898, *** 31, 1898, 147.

‘God wills her to be the principle of all good things.’ [Citing St. John Damascene, Series I De nativitate Virginis.]

1. Leo XIII, Parta humano generi, Apostolic Letter, Sept 8, 1901, *** 34, 1901, 195.

So may the most powerful Virgin Mother, who once ‘cooperated in love that the faithful might be born in the Church’, be even now the means and mediatrix of our salvation. [Citing St. Augustine, De sancta Virginitate 6.]

 

[cjforJesus]

I believe Benedict XVI said that a dogmatic statement wasn’t needed, as the teaching is protected by the authority of the Popes and, therefore, infallible.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

campus.udayton.edu/mary/resources/internationalmarianacademy.htm

I am trying to locate the statement also of Pope Benedict XVI regarding the dogma.I have scoured the net using various words but cannot locate it.The gist was that it was very confusing and it is better expressed by other more clear titles.

It is also very clear that the intense desire for this dogma is based on The Lady of All Nations who promised once the pope declares the dogma she will bring peace to the world.

 

[cjforJesus]

Perhaps, you didn’t look at the link I gave. So, here it is again.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

I think you should examine the document released by the vatican commission requested by St John Paul 2.It clearly supercedes a prior popes belief.

campus.udayton.edu/mary/resources/internationalmarianacademy.htm

I believe the Pope John Paul 2 wished to declare the dogma by the year 2000 but was advised it is too ambiguous even for some Catholics.

 

[JM3]

w2.vatican.va/content/john-paul-ii/en/audiences/1997/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_01101997.html

1. With regard to the objections made by some of the Council Fathers concerning the term “Mediatrix”, the Council itself provided an answer by saying that Mary is “a mother to us in the order of grace” (Lumen gentium, n. 61). We recall that Mary’s mediation is essentially defined by her divine motherhood. Recognition of her role as mediatrix is moreover implicit in the expression “our Mother”, which presents the doctrine of Marian mediation by putting the accent on her motherhood. Lastly, the title “Mother in the order of grace” explains that the Blessed Virgin co-operates with Christ in humanity’s spiritual rebirth.

1. In truth, what is Mary’s maternal mediation if not the Father’s gift to humanity? This is why the Council concludes: “The Church does not hesitate to profess this subordinate role of Mary, which it constantly experiences and recommends to the heartfelt attention of the faithful” (ibid.).

 

[cjforJesus]

w2.vatican.va/content/john-paul-ii/en/audiences/1997/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_01101997.html

Exactly! Her role is Mediatrix or intercessor.

It is possible to participate in Christ’s mediation in various areas of the work of salvation. After stressing that “no creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer” (n. 62), Lumen gentium describes how it is possible for creatures to exercise certain forms of mediation which are dependent on Christ. In fact, “just as the priesthood of Christ is shared in various ways both by his ministers and the faithful, and as the one goodness of God is radiated in different ways among his creatures, so also the unique mediation of the Redeemer does not exclude but rather gives rise to a manifold co-operation which is but a sharing in this one source” (Lumen gentium, n. 62).

 

[godisgood77]

Read the Vatican document and follow the sound sense of it.

I have and do… I’m just trying to help you get there as well.

 

[friardchips]

I have and do… I’m just trying to help you get there as well.

So far I haven’t really read anything that counts as a sufficient counter-argument, only more points raised that do not attempt to answer me directly, or answers that are not answers, which makes me think this blogging really is a waste of time.

 

[godisgood77]

So far I haven’t really read anything that counts as a sufficient counter-argument, only more points raised that do not attempt to answer me directly, or answers that are not answers, which makes me think this blogging really is a waste of time.

Have you commented on the pretty explicit and direct statement by SJPII’s commission? That’s a pretty credible and authoritative reference point, no? Also, what do you say about the three commissions set up to study the topic earlier in the 20th century… Both decided against it. These are official bodies set up by Popes…

You have indeed references a number of statements… All of which can be read any number of ways… These official commissions seem to leave no room for interpretation.

 

[friardchips]

Have you commented on the pretty explicit and direct statement by SJPII’s commission? That’s a pretty credible and authoritative reference point, no? Also, what do you say about the three commissions set up to study the topic earlier in the 20th century… Both decided against it. These are official bodies set up by Popes…

You have indeed references a number of statements… All of which can be read any number of ways… These official commissions seem to leave no room for interpretation.

Now, my posts can be *chosen *to be read a number of ways. Actually, they are very to-the-point.

And, as I said ages ago to one of you, St. JPII seemed to be pretty much on the same wavelength, if you read the link provided at the time, which you obviously didn’t.

And again, this is just another post, scape-goating (in effect) around the points raised.

 

[JM3]

It clearly supercedes a prior popes belief.

campus.udayton.edu/mary/resources/internationalmarianacademy.htm

I don’t see where this document says this. Perhaps, you can point it out. Also, I was not talking about ‘prior popes’ beliefs, but their teachings.

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/hlthwork/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_11021984_salvifici-doloris_en.html

And again, after the events of her Son’s hidden and public life, events which she must have shared with acute sensitivity, it was on Calvary that Mary’s suffering, beside the suffering of Jesus, reached an intensity which can hardly be imagined from a human point of view but which was mysterious and supernaturally fruitful for the redemption of the world. Her ascent of Calvary and her standing at the foot of the Cross together with the Beloved Disciple were a special sort of sharing in the redeeming death of her Son. And the words which she heard from his lips were a kind of solemn handing-over of this Gospel of suffering so that it could be prclaimed to the whole community of believers.

 

[cjforJesus]

I don’t see where this document says this. Perhaps, you can point it out. Also, I was not talking about ‘prior popes’ beliefs, but their teachings.

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/hlthwork/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_11021984_salvifici-doloris_en.html

Among the titles attributed to Mary in the Church’s devotion, chapter eight of Lumen gentium recalls that of “Mediatrix”. Although some Council Fathers did not fully agree with this choice of title (cf. Acta Synodalia III, 8, 163-164), it was nevertheless inserted into the Dogmatic Constitution on the Church as confirmation of the value of the truth it expresses. Care was therefore taken not to associate it with any PARTICULAR THEOLOGY of mediation, but merely to list it among Mary’s other recognized titles.

This seems pretty clear yet millions still are petitioning Rome as they have for decades in hopes that Mary will bring peace. At Fatima It is well know that the message was that when Russia is consecrated a period of peace will be granted.The Netherland apparition said that when the 5th marian dogma is declared another period of peace will occur.

 

[godisgood77]

Among the titles attributed to Mary in the Church’s devotion, chapter eight of Lumen gentium recalls that of “Mediatrix”. Although some Council Fathers did not fully agree with this choice of title (cf. Acta Synodalia III, 8, 163-164), it was nevertheless inserted into the Dogmatic Constitution on the Church as confirmation of the value of the truth it expresses. Care was therefore taken not to associate it with any PARTICULAR THEOLOGY of mediation, but merely to list it among Mary’s other recognized titles.

This seems pretty clear yet millions still are petitioning Rome as they have for decades in hopes that Mary will bring peace. At Fatima It is well know that the message was that when Russia is consecrated a period of peace will be granted.The Netherland apparition said that when the 5th marian dogma is declared another period of peace will occur.

Thanks for this… it is quite clear.

To add… not too long ago I was reading up on JPII’s thoughts on Montfortian spirituality. He had much to say… this letter from JPII to the Montfortian Religious Family from December 8th, 2003, Solemnity of the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary

w2.vatican.va/content/john-paul-ii/en/letters/2004/documents/hf_jp-ii_let_20040113_famiglie-monfortane.html

I call out this particular passage where the Pope Saint John Paul II reinforces your point about the decries and intent of the Second Vatican Council relative to Marian devotion. More specifically, how VII sharpened, deepened and refined Montfortian Marian Devotion:

*Since she came into being, and especially in her most difficult moments, the Church has contemplated with special intensity an event of the Passion of Jesus Christ that St John mentions: "Standing by the Cross of Jesus were his mother, and his mother’s sister, Mary, the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene. When Jesus saw his mother, and the disciple whom he loved standing near, he said to his mother, "Woman, behold, your son!’. Then he said to the disciple, “Behold, your mother!’. And from that hour the disciple took her to his own home” (Jn 19: 25-27). Throughout its history, the People of God has experienced this gift of the crucified Jesus: the gift of his Mother. Mary Most Holy is truly our Mother who accompanies us on our pilgrimage of faith, hope and charity towards an ever more intense union with Christ, the one Saviour and Mediator of salvation (cf. Constitution Lumen Gentium, nn. 60, 62).

As is well known, my episcopal coat of arms symbolically illustrates the Gospel text quoted above; the motto Totus tuus is inspired by the teaching of St Louis Marie Grignion de Montfort (cf. Gift and Mystery, pp. 42-43; Rosarium Virginis Mariae, n. 15). These two words express total belonging to Jesus through Mary: “Tuus totus ego sum, et omnia mea tua sunt”, St Louis Marie wrote, and he translates his words: “I am all yours, and all that I have is yours, O most loving Jesus, through Mary, your most holy Mother” (Treatise on True Devotion, n. 233). This Saint’s teaching has had a profound influence on the Marian devotion of many of the faithful and on my own life. It is a lived teaching of outstanding ascetic and mystical depth, expressed in a lively and passionate style that makes frequent use of images and symbols. However, the considerable development of Marian theology since St Louis Marie’s time is largely due to the crucial contribution made by the Second Vatican Council. The Montfort teaching, therefore, which has retained its essential validity should be reread and reinterpreted today in the light of the Council.*

Pope St John Paull II, a man of great Marian devotion, has shown of the way on this matter.