"All spirit is matter" - Joseph Smith

[Jim_Dandy]

1Voice,

No. When Jesus was resurrected, He was not resurrected with “earthly material”–He was resurrected with “a heavenly body of flesh and bones” that will live forever in a perfectly perfect physical, magnificently radiant state. The same is true of the “heavenly body of flesh and bones” of Heavenly Father. We don’t know the chemical composition, other than knowing there is visible “flesh” and bone structure, but there must be a difference given how our bodies age and so forth. We know that Jesus could and did eat, so that is something that a “heavenly body” can do.

From my post #127

We have no idea what a resurrected, glorified body looks like, or if it can be seen with normal human eyes – w/o supernatural intervention – at all. Christ was demonstrating to His Apostles that His resurrection was real, thus His manifestation to them “as flesh and bones.” This does not mean that His Glorified Body occupies space.

Nor does it mean that a resurrected, glorified body eats, digests food, and defecates. Jesus was manifesting himself to His Apostles and appeared to be eating.to convince them of the reality of His Resurrection.

In John 20:19-29, the resurrected Jesus passed through locked doors to “stand in their [the Apostles’] midst.” This is the same event recounted in Luke 24. “… he showed them his hands and his feet.” Flesh and bones, being material, do not pass through locked doors. So He could not have been “eating” in the human sense of the word.

Jim Dandy

 

[Nicea325]

If God and man’s bodies are different as you describe …
What did God mean in Genesis where it states that Adam was formed in the image and likeness of God?

God is a spirit and those that worship him must worship in spirit and in truth (John 4:24).

Spirits do not have parts (matter) nor do they occupy space (location)

Angels are spiritual beings.

 

[ParkerD]

If God and man’s bodies are different as you describe …
What did God mean in Genesis where it states that Adam was formed in the image and likeness of God?

1Voice,

To me the words “image” and “likeness”, when used together successively like that, represent the Hebrew form of expression used often in Biblical expressions where two words or phrases mean the same thing but are placed poetically together to reinforce the meaning. To me those words mean “outward appearance” (without the glory).

 

[GEddie]

We have no idea what a resurrected, glorified body looks like, or if it can be seen with normal human eyes – w/o supernatural intervention – at all. Christ was demonstrating to His Apostles that His resurrection was real, thus His manifestation to them “as flesh and bones.” This does not mean that His Glorified Body occupies space.

Actually it does; filling “space” of some kind is intrinsic to being a body. Your nose, feet, limbs and shoulders sticking out every which way is not accidental, it is basic to your being.

The resurrectional body is most definitely a human BODY. In our LORD’s case, his BODY was the same body HE had before, and during death. So yes, the Resurrectional Body of a human being can be seen with human eyes. However, it is a refined form and can appear somewhat different; see the description of our LORD in Revelation 1.

ICXC NIKA.

 

[roselily]

Actually it does; filling “space” of some kind is intrinsic to being a body. Your nose, feet, limbs and shoulders sticking out every which way is not accidental, it is basic to your being.

The resurrectional body is most definitely a human BODY. In our LORD’s case, his BODY was the same body HE had before, and during death. So yes, the Resurrectional Body of a human being can be seen with human eyes. However, it is a refined form and can appear somewhat different; see the description of our LORD in Revelation 1.

ICXC NIKA.

:angel1:
"and his face was like the sun shining with full force."–Revelation 1

We will be looks like our Redeemer?
And forever?:heaven:

There is God spirit in us, is there not?
We have mind, body and spirit-soul,

**Deuteronomy 6
5You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might.
**
:angel1:

 

[GEddie]

:angel1:
"and his face was like the sun shining with full force."–Revelation 1

We will be looks like our Redeemer?
And forever?:heaven:

Amen, I will need every bit of HIS radiance to keep the darkness of death off of me!

ICXC NIKA

 

[roselily]

Amen, I will need every bit of HIS radiance to keep the darkness of death off of me!

ICXC NIKA

God remove death from all christian!

We will have eternal happiness inexhaustible.

We shall, we shall; God is so good !

 

[roselily]

:angel1:Oh! let us hold our Faith! Let us hold our Faith truly strong!

I mean that if you do not hold truly strong,

even you try to be strong, it has flaw, if a force comes, that strong will be broke.

When mind and body separate,

what will happened to the soul?

 

[GEddie]

:angel1:Oh! let us hold our Faith! Let us hold our Faith truly strong!

I mean that if you do not hold truly strong,

even you try to be strong, it has flaw, if a force comes, that strong will be broke.

When mind and body separate,

what will happened to the soul?

???

Mind and body do not separate.

Soul and body do.

When that happens, the mind stays with the soul, which it is a dimension of.

 

[roselily]

???

Mind and body do not separate.

Soul and body do.

When that happens, the mind stays with the soul, which it is a dimension of.

Why should there is a saying that -you lost your mind?

Soul and body can separate, body is container of the mind. I do not know where is our soul in us?

Your mind is not part of your soul. We have mind(heart), body and soul.
I mean that since you can see two side of it: Religion and Science, then you can consider it, that soul is something else, chemicals can affect your mind; but it can not change your soul.

 

[zaffiroborant]

Where/how did your “god the father” get cells?

I would like to know also.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

According to this, spirit children weren’t made out of flesh and bones, unless you can explain this to me differently:
mormonwiki.com/Pre-Mortal_Life

"Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was **not **created or made, neither indeed can be (see D&C 93:29).

At some point, Heavenly Father called a council in heaven, which all of his **spirit children **attended, and presented a plan of salvation. There was a limit to man’s progression in the pre-mortal world. The goal was to become like Father Himself, who is a glorious, resurrected being, with an incorruptible body of flesh and bone. In order to progress, God’s children had to be tested, found worthy, and resurrected. Mortal life would provide each spirit being with a physical body. Through the physical body, mankind could be tested. The loss of memory of the pre-existence and the separation from God would force men to live by faith. The plan allows man to gain wisdom through experience, guaranteed by his free agency. The Plan of Salvation was devised by a loving God before the foundation of the world. It is the plan through which He can lead His children to the same exaltation He enjoys.

How can there be spirit children, not made of flesh and bones, and resurrected people made of flesh and bones, who in turn create spirit children?

 

[ParkerD]

According to this, spirit children weren’t made out of flesh and bones, unless you can explain this to me differently:
mormonwiki.com/Pre-Mortal_Life

"Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was **not **created or made, neither indeed can be (see D&C 93:29).

At some point, Heavenly Father called a council in heaven, which all of his **spirit children **attended, and presented a plan of salvation. There was a limit to man’s progression in the pre-mortal world. The goal was to become like Father Himself, who is a glorious, resurrected being, with an incorruptible body of flesh and bone. In order to progress, God’s children had to be tested, found worthy, and resurrected. Mortal life would provide each spirit being with a physical body. Through the physical body, mankind could be tested. The loss of memory of the pre-existence and the separation from God would force men to live by faith. The plan allows man to gain wisdom through experience, guaranteed by his free agency. The Plan of Salvation was devised by a loving God before the foundation of the world. It is the plan through which He can lead His children to the same exaltation He enjoys.

How can there be spirit children, not made of flesh and bones, and resurrected people made of flesh and bones, who in turn create spirit children?

Christine,

Good question, but as you are aware, God knows things that we don’t know.

Perhaps a start to figuring out an answer to your question is to re-read Genesis 2:24 and think also of Christ’s Intercessory prayer about being one (which clearly means being spiritually one such as “of one accord”), and to think also of the word “atonement” which can be thought of as “at one ment”. Again, that is not physical, but spiritual.

So Heavenly Father entrusts having “spirit children” to those who showed by becoming “at one” in a spiritual sense in an eternal marriage covenant, that they could be entrusted to nurture spirit children and to exemplify what they should seek to emulate. So it is not physical, and they are not physical spirit children–they are spirits, in a pre-mortal world for them where they are nurtured and prepared to enter mortal life and make mortal life kinds of choices that lead to greater happiness than they otherwise could have, through learning by mortal experience.

 

[windynight]

Yes, it is very hard to describe things completely outside our context of knowledge and language vocabulary. To oversimply the point, the english language of 500 yrs ago could not effectively describe the science nor the workings of a modern computer.

No LDS has claimed every teaching is revelation, nor is the word choice always perfect.

Why are you being hypercritical of a teaching that is not doctrine?

Is not becoming a god taught as doctrine? It certainly was when I went through the investigations.

 

[catholic-rcia]

ONE

Take the earth as a very tiny (tiny) example of the Holy Trinity. This came from a fairly new Catholic last night as we discussed the Holy trinity. Looking at the earth from afar it is a complete planet seen as one planet. Yet it is not a solid mass. It has the sky which reaches out into all of space. One can think about how important the sky is, the air to us humans. It has the earth in which we walk and live. If it were all ocean we could not exists. It has the vast seas, the waters that sustain us, all living things. So from afar we see one earth. But it is much more as we know. As Christians we can think of God as One God, yet He is much more. The Godhead is a relationship of love. This love in human words is called the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. It is our destiny. To become One within it. And know it. No matter how smart we may think we are, the simplicity is breathtaking. But which one of us can remain still enough to understand this? To then go out from there?

We can also think of our Sun, how far it is yet so close as to give us life. The Sun could represent the Father, the light to us the Son, the warmth, the Holy Spirit.

How can we know Gods love if we do not know Jesus personally? God created us to share in His love for His Son. If we are in Jesus we are therefore also in the Father. Apart from Jesus there can be no experience of love. The love the Son has for His Father. We get caught up in the middle, this is our gift. We learn to love in family units, to prepare us for the larger picture. To be loved by God as one, one Holy family. Saved in community, to become one community. Children of the Most high.

 

[catholic-rcia]

Christine,

Good question, but as you are aware, God knows things that we don’t know.

./quote]

Would you be willing to call this a Mystery?

 

[1voice]

ONE

Take the earth as a very tiny (tiny) example of the Holy Trinity. This came from a fairly new Catholic last night as we discussed the Holy trinity. Looking at the earth from afar it is a complete planet seen as one planet. Yet it is not a solid mass. It has the sky which reaches out into all of space. One can think about how important the sky is, the air to us humans. It has the earth in which we walk and live. If it were all ocean we could not exists. It has the vast seas, the waters that sustain us, all living things. So from afar we see one earth. But it is much more as we know. As Christians we can think of God as One God, yet He is much more. The Godhead is a relationship of love. This love in human words is called the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. It is our destiny. To become One within it. And know it. No matter how smart we may think we are, the simplicity is breathtaking. But which one of us can remain still enough to understand this? To then go out from there?

We can also think of our Sun, how far it is yet so close as to give us life. The Sun could represent the Father, the light to us the Son, the warmth, the Holy Spirit.

How can we know Gods love if we do not know Jesus personally? God created us to share in His love for His Son. If we are in Jesus we are therefore also in the Father. Apart from Jesus there can be no experience of love. The love the Son has for His Father. We get caught up in the middle, this is our gift. We learn to love in family units, to prepare us for the larger picture. To be loved by God as one, one Holy family. Saved in community, to become one community. Children of the Most high.

My goal is that they may be encouraged in heart and united in love, so that they may have the full riches of complete understanding, in order that they may know the mystery of God, namely, Christ, 3 in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. 4 I tell you this so that no one may deceive you by fine-sounding arguments. 5 For though I am absent from you in body, I am present with you in spirit and delight to see how disciplined you are and how firm your faith in Christ is.

… 9 For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, 10 and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority.
… Paul the Apostle
Col 2

 

[1voice]

Christine,

Good question, but as you are aware, God knows things that we don’t know.

Perhaps a start to figuring out an answer to your question is to re-read Genesis 2:24 and think also of Christ’s Intercessory prayer about being one (which clearly means being spiritually one such as “of one accord”), and to think also of the word “atonement” which can be thought of as “at one ment”. Again, that is not physical, but spiritual.

So Heavenly Father entrusts having “spirit children” to those who showed by becoming “at one” in a spiritual sense in an eternal marriage covenant, that they could be entrusted to nurture spirit children and to exemplify what they should seek to emulate. So it is not physical, and they are not physical spirit children–they are spirits, in a pre-mortal world for them where they are nurtured and prepared to enter mortal life and make mortal life kinds of choices that lead to greater happiness than they otherwise could have, through learning by mortal experience.

But … All that you say in your explanation of the scripture that you reference is complete conjecture.

 

[catholic-rcia]

My goal is that they may be encouraged in heart and united in love, so that they may have the full riches of complete understanding, in order that they may know the mystery of God, namely, Christ, 3 in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. 4 I tell you this so that no one may deceive you by fine-sounding arguments. 5 For though I am absent from you in body, I am present with you in spirit and delight to see how disciplined you are and how firm your faith in Christ is.

… 9 For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, 10 and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority.
… Paul the Apostle
Col 2

 

[ParkerD]

But … All that you say in your explanation of the scripture that you reference is complete conjecture.

1Voice,

Certainly so for you, but not so for me.

I have discussed religion with total non-believers, and they have used the same approach, so I became used to that long ago.

Revealed religion means that those who become familiar with it will be scoffed at by those who aren’t.