Altar Crucifixes not allowed?

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Imperial_Guard

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Hey everybody,
Code:
 I was told that if a church has a large crucifix behind the altar than there cannot be one on the altar.  My home parish has a Risen lord behind the altar and an altar crucifix (I always thought that the altar crucifix looks right).  Anyway, is this true?  Is it a preference rather than a rule?
Thanks,
Imperial Guard
 
Hey everybody,

I was told that if a church has a large crucifix behind the altar than there cannot be one on the altar. My home parish has a Risen lord behind the altar and an altar crucifix (I always thought that the altar crucifix looks right). Anyway, is this true? Is it a preference rather than a rule?

Thanks,
Imperial Guard
Whoever told you that is mistaken, I believe. As I recall, the General Instructions of the Roman Missal states that there must be a crucifix on or near the altar. The one on the wall fulfils the requirement but the G.I.R.M. does not say that if you have a large crucifix on the wall that there cannot be one on the altar. Our pastor , like other pastors, have followed the example of Pope Benedict by using the altar crucifix.
 
Hey everybody,
Code:
 I was told that if a church has a large crucifix behind the altar than there cannot be one on the altar.  My home parish has a Risen lord behind the altar and an altar crucifix (I always thought that the altar crucifix looks right).  Anyway, is this true?  Is it a preference rather than a rule?
Thanks,
Imperial Guard
There is to be only one crucifix in the sanctuary. This is the reason why the crucfix carried in procession does not remain in the area of the sanctuary. The risen Lord doesn’t count
 
There is to be only one crucifix in the sanctuary. This is the reason why the crucfix carried in procession does not remain in the area of the sanctuary. The risen Lord doesn’t count
It would be great if you could provide the reference to support this. My connection is not all that good.
 
From the GIRM:
  1. When they reach the altar, the Priest and ministers make a profound bow.
The cross adorned with a figure of Christ crucified, and carried in procession, may be placed next to the altar to serve as the altar cross, in which case it must be the only cross used; otherwise it is put away in a dignified place. As for the candlesticks, these are placed on the altar or near it. It is a praiseworthy practice for the Book of the Gospels to be placed on the altar.
 
It would be great if you could provide the reference to support this. My connection is not all that good.
I would like to see such a source as well, since I am only aware that the GIRM requires A crucifix, but does not specifically limit the number of crucifixes that can be present…
 
From the GIRM:
  1. When they reach the altar, the Priest and ministers make a profound bow.
The cross adorned with a figure of Christ crucified, and carried in procession, may be placed next to the altar to serve as the altar cross, in which case it must be the only cross used; otherwise it is put away in a dignified place. As for the candlesticks, these are placed on the altar or near it. It is a praiseworthy practice for the Book of the Gospels to be placed on the altar.
So the processional cross may be placed near the altar to serve as an altar cross as long as it is the only (altar cross) used. Is it really saying that the processional cross may be used to serve as an altar cross as long as no other crucifix is in the sanctuary :confused:
 
By itself, that doesn’t say anything about how many crosses/crucifixes can be in the sanctuary. It only says that if the processional crucifix is used as the altar crucifix, then it must be the only cross. (i.e. you can’t use the processional crucifix as the altar crucifix if you already have at least one other crucifix in the sanctuary).
 
People seem to have different opinions on the importance of only one cross. Sometimes this appears in the liturgical books.

For example, in the earlier edition of the Roman Missal for the U.S.A. it has for the Good Friday ceremony:

"19. Only one cross should be used for the veneration. If the number of people makes it impossible for everyone to venerate the cross individually, the priest may take the cross, after some of the faithful have venerated it, and stand in the center in front of the altar. In a few words he invites the people to venerate the cross and then holds it up briefly for them to worship in silence.

In the United States, if pastoral reasons suggest that there be individual veneration even though the number of people is very large, a second or third cross may be used."

(Roman Missal, Catholic Book Publishing Co., New York, 1985, page 158.)

I don’t know what the current Roman Missal for the USA has. But the example shows that one group of people thought it was important to say “only one cross” and another group that it was important to reverse this, in the USA.

Here are some arguments for only one crucifix being allowed in the sanctuary.

A. 2002 GIRM: “122. … The cross adorned with a figure of Christ crucified and perhaps carried in procession may be placed next to the altar to serve as the altar cross, in which case it ought to be the only cross used; otherwise it is put away in a dignified place.”

B. 2002 GIRM: “308. There is also to be a cross, with the figure of Christ crucified upon it, either on the altar or near it, where it is clearly visible to the assembled congregation.” (My bold text.)

C. Some statistics:
“cross” appears 52 times in the GIRM,
“crosses” is never used in the GIRM
“the cross” is used 35 times in the GIRM.

D. 1968 Instruction Pontificalis ritus: “20. Only a single cross is to be carried in a procession, to increase the dignity of the cross and its veneration. If an archbishop is present, the cross will be the archiepiscopal cross, to be carried at the head of the procession, with the image of Christ crucified facing forward. The recommended practice is to stand the processional cross near the altar so that it serves as the altar cross. If this is not done, the processional cross is put away.” (From Documents on the Liturgy 1963-1979, Liturgical Press, Minnesota, 1982, ISBN 0-8146-1281-4, page 1394).

E. The 1977 liturgical book “Dedication of a Church and Altar” has in chapter 2 (The Rites Volume Two, Liturgical Press, 1991, ISBN: 0-8146-6037-1, page 366):

"REQUISITES FOR THE DEDICATION OF A CHURCH

B. In the sacristy or in the sanctuary or in the body of the church to be dedicated, as each situation requires: …

-- altar cross, unless there is already a cross in the sanctuary or the cross that is carried in the entrance procession is to be placed near the altar;"

I am not aware of an official document explicitly permitting an altar cross and a large central cross. But arguments permitting two sanctuary crucifixes could be based on the following parts of the liturgical books.

A. Book of Blessings: “1238 The order presented in this chapter is meant for only two situations:
1 the solemn blessing of a cross erected in a public place, separate from a church;
2 the blessing of the principal cross that occupies a central place in the body of the church where the worshiping community assembles.”
(Book of Blessings, Liturgical Press, Minnesota, 1989, ISBN 0-8146-1875-8, page 455).

Why does it refer to a “principal cross” rather than use the term the “altar cross”? In Latin, it has:
“b) cum benedicenda est Crux principalis quae emineat in aula ecclesiae, ubi communitas fidelium congregatur.” (De Benedictionibus, Liberia Editrice Vaticana, 1993, ISBN 880118994, page 365.) In the Roman Missal it refers to “crux altaris” in GIRM 122.

B. The GIRM has in 277: “The cross, if situated on or near the altar, is incensed by the priest before he incenses the altar; otherwise, he incenses it when he passes in front of it.” Sometimes “the cross” is incensed before the altar. Sometimes it is incensed when passing in front of it. There seems to be two instructions, for more than one cross.

The GIRM has in 117: “… Also on or close to the altar, there is to be a cross with a figure of Christ crucified. …”. So if there is one cross on or close to the altar there should only be one instruction for incensing it, before he incenses the altar. But there is a second instruction, suggesting there is a second crucifix.

My interpretation is that there should only be one crucifix in the sanctuary, on or near the altar.

Other threads discussing this issue include these five:
  1. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=197435
  2. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=333545
  3. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=506602
  4. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=236270
  5. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=243994
 
The Holy Father says the OF Mass. Look at the Altar that he celebrates at.

We use an Altar Crucifix at our TLM. It is celebrated at an OF parish that has a large Crucifix above the Tabernacle.

In fact several Bishops have recommended that the Altar Crucifix be brought back, particularily at the OF Mass where the priest is facing the people. That way both priest and people concentrate on the Crucified Christ.
 
To get back to the original question, IF a processional cross is used (one on a staff which is carried into the church during the entrance procession and then placed near the altar) THEN there cannot be another.

If, on the other hand, there is some other arrangement, such as a crucifix permanently attached to a wall behind the altar, then a second crucifix ON the altar itself would be fine.

In the OP’s case, there is a figure of the Risen Lord. Now this is not even a crucifix, a crucifix is a cross with the body of Our Lord upon it. So an altar crucifix would be fine assuming that there isn’t also a processional cross near it.
 
What defines the sanctuary in a configuration where there is no altar rail, there is no straight architectural line delineating the area and there is seating around 270 degrees of the altar? I assume it is the area bounded by the lowest altar step.

Is it legal to simply place the crucifix carried in the processional at the foot of and in one corner the altar steps?
 
To get back to the original question, IF a processional cross is used (one on a staff which is carried into the church during the entrance procession and then placed near the altar) THEN there cannot be another.

If, on the other hand, there is some other arrangement, such as a crucifix permanently attached to a wall behind the altar, then a second crucifix ON the altar itself would be fine.

In the OP’s case, there is a figure of the Risen Lord. Now this is not even a crucifix, a crucifix is a cross with the body of Our Lord upon it. So an altar crucifix would be fine assuming that there isn’t also a processional cross near it.
Yes, if a processional cross is used and also doubles as the sanctuary cross during mass. But if it is put outside the sanctuary near it somewhere, or in the sacristy (for those churches where it is near), then two crosses in the sanctuary can be used, correct? That is how I interpret it. Maybe that isn’t their intention, but that is how I interpret it.
What defines the sanctuary in a configuration where there is no altar rail, there is no straight architectural line delineating the area and there is seating around 270 degrees of the altar? I assume it is the area bounded by the lowest altar step.

Is it legal to simply place the crucifix carried in the processional at the foot of and in one corner the altar steps?
Yes, I would imagine most people would consider those sanctuaries without altar rails or rood screens or something else to that effect marked off by the altar steps. So if you place it on the floor before the first step, I think you can get away with more than one cross in the sanctuary.

OP: I think we have demonstrated absolutes here. A ressurectifix (as I call it) is not a crucifix, no matter how much someone wants it to be. On a crucifix, Christ is represented as being attached to the cross (obviously by nails, but it might not be that detailed), and dead or dying. Christ can’t be portrayed as crucified if he’s risen, can he? It’s a nice sentiment, the risen Lord, but it is the sacrificial aspect that the mass solemnly re-creates. It is supposed to be a crucifix for a reason, to remind of the propitiatory sacrifice, and it is required. I really don’t see how anyone can put up a risen Lord instead of a crucifix and still have a clean conscience.
 
One thing for certain is that the Risen Lord cross is not a “crucifix,” and cannot be used to replace it.

In many cases the use of those reflects a very poor theological understanding of the crucifixion and the mass.
 
The only time our parish has not had the altar crucifix is when there was a visting priest who, for some reason, put it away. He also really liked to hug people and give sappy sermons.

Anyhoo, it seems that the issue of multiple crucifixes (from the information provided) is a tad unclear, as long as it is not the processional cross. Thanks for all the answers!

Has the pope ever said Mass with both a wall and an altar cross?

Imperial Guard
 
Pope Benedict has one facing him during the consecration that is distinct from the one in the Sanctuary

For example

At the Papal Mass in Wash DC ( my family was able to get tickets for that 👍)

You can see both the crucifix in the back, and the one on the altar.


A close up of the one on the altar

http://0.tqn.com/d/catholicism/1/7/M/-/-/-/Consecration_at_DC_Mass.jpg

Pope Benedict encourages the practice for all Masses that are not said ad orientum. The reason given is to remind that priest that he is not facign the people, but facing Christ.

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/damianthompson/100021782/pope-wants-crucifix-at-the-centre-of-all-westward-facing-altars-during-mass-says-papal-mc-so-why-do-our-bishops-ignore-him/
 
Pope Benedict has one facing him during the consecration that is distinct from the one in the Sanctuary

For example

At the Papal Mass in Wash DC ( my family was able to get tickets for that 👍)

You can see both the crucifix in the back, and the one on the altar.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3192/2420852781_92a36cb977_z.jpg

A close up of the one on the altar

http://0.tqn.com/d/catholicism/1/7/M/-/-/-/Consecration_at_DC_Mass.jpg

Pope Benedict encourages the practice for all Masses that are not said ad orientum. The reason given is to remind that priest that he is not facign the people, but facing Christ.

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/damianthompson/100021782/pope-wants-crucifix-at-the-centre-of-all-westward-facing-altars-during-mass-says-papal-mc-so-why-do-our-bishops-ignore-him/
Most of the older churches have a high altar with a large crucifix on the back wall.
If one uses a freestanding altar, positioned in front of the high altar a smaller crucifix is on the altar. A processional cross should be removed from sight but us often left to the side.
That is my understanding as a sacrastin.
The Pope also lamented the non use of the larger cross by the priests,he was told it blocks the view of the celebrant.
Note the size of the crucifix in the picture you provided.
 
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