An upsetting experience at Mass

[englishredrose]

Ophelia23-
WOW! Just WOW!
I would drop a line to your pastor and relay this information to him,
even if you are unsure about “naming names”, I still think he should be alerted to the situation.
Unwelcoming attitudes like this really need to be addressed from the pulpit- IMHO.

Am glad you said this because this would be what I recommend. don’t gossip about it to other members of the congregation so he knows you are being serious. But just let him know the exact facts, naming the women if you know her name but keeping it plain. He won’t want to actually know her name in reality but may be if she has upset other people or has her own problem to deal with he may be addressing that with her via confession/spiritual guidence. Just be plain about it and have a chat with him because then he can choose how to take the situation forward if its something regularly happening he might address it loosely in the sermon though chances are the person concerned mayn’t hear properly depending on if she thinks she got a right to what she said.
I am not defending her but we all have bad days and may be shes at a real edge of life and you lucky that all she said and done, and not turned around at you and just had a storm of tears because she breaking down too or something. We need to be a little bit aware of each other. Yeh shes out of line for doing that but she may well be on the edge herself and a crying child behind her could well be literally finishing her off. You will never know but the pastor might and will know how to address it in the sermon if its an on going issue or its its just bad luck for you that day. Be thankful that all she did though may be hard for you to swallow that right now. The child will pick up how you feel about it so it be wise that if your rant really is now over, make light of it with the child so the child will move on too otherwise the child will grow wary of that lady because its amazing how children recognise others that we don’t because too much going off Peace be with you.

@ CF- yeah, me too!
Must be my Calabrian roots!!

 

[Allegra]

Every time I read about, or hear about, this type of behavior I am so grateful I was not there to witness it.

That is completely out of line.

That being said, I have a loud singing voice. I love to sing. Most of the time it doesn’t bother people because they are singing too. Twice in the past two weeks, older men have made it a point of telling me how loud I am. My Genovese Mom is next to me in the pew when this happens - and she has taken both of them out with a sweet smile and a, “Oh, what a CLEVER thing to say, young man” (she is 90 - they are probably in their 70’s or 80’s).

You don’t mess with Italians, even at Mass !

The other guy should be singing himself and then he wouldn’t be able to hear you as much. No one has ever given me this kind of attitude at church but I have had to deal with it at work. I’m a teacher and I always participate in 5th grade camp. We take the kids on a week long camping trip and one of the activities is singing camp songs. A few of the teachers from the other school that goes refuse to participate in the singing in anyway and during the songs, they demonstrate a body language that is more befitting of a thirteen year old school girl than a grown woman or man. They adopt an exagerrated attitude of “singing is stupid and embarrassing and you aren’t going to get ME to engage in anything so childish.” I have seen people adopt this same attitude at church (though no one’s actually said anything to me personally) and my humble opinion is that such individuals are spiritually broken. If a person is really so self-concious and negative about expressing what is inside themself as they cannot engage in a song of praise for the One who gave them life, that is a very sad thing indeed. However, they certainly have no right to use body language and verbal abuse in order to bully others into experiencing their own misery.

 

[bmagana]

That is why i dont shake anybody’s hand at mass, during the peace offering i just clench my hands, close my eyes, bow my head down and pray.

 

[Alexis546]

That is why i dont shake anybody’s hand at mass, during the peace offering i just clench my hands, close my eyes, bow my head down and pray.

I kind of do the same. I am there to be with God alone. Well, that and I usually sit away from other people mostly. No one to shake hands with in close range.

Not that I would ever refuse someone’s hand should it come at me…and I certainly would never call someone a “turd”.

I cannot believe that happened to you. I am so sorry.

 

[Cat]

First, make certain that the word she spoke was really “turd.” It’s just possible that she has an accent, and is using a term of endearment, but she’s not pronouncing it clearly.

There is a business owner in our city with an accent. Years ago, he advertised a “Penis Sale.” At least, that’s what it sounded like. The first time I ever heard the ad, I was totally shocked! Then I saw the print version of it and realized that he was saying “Peanuts Sale.” (Low prices.)

Well, apparently everyone else in the city heard “penis” sale, too, and within the next few days, ads with apologies were posted by the business.

And years later, the man is still doing “Penis Sale” ads, but he has very clever scripting that involves various celebrities in the city responding to him by saying, “WHAT kind of sale?” and other comments like that. Really funny.

So perhaps the old woman is merely mispronouncing a word.

But it doesn’t sound like that, based on your description of her demeanor.

If she was saying what you thought you heard, then do not minimize the occurrence. This was a violent act, and the pastor should be notified. The woman is a danger to children. This time it was words. Next time, what will she use to hurt a child?

Whether the violent act was caused by a physical condition (e.g., dementia, Tourettes, etc), or whether the woman has that much hatred and bitterness in her, it doesn’t matter. The point is, she should not be allowed to be in the same place where there are children for her to harm. The parish needs to take responsibility for this and make sure that children are protected from her.

Please tell the pastor exactly what happened so that he can take steps to have the woman monitored carefully and kept AWAY from children.

Think of how this would have played out if the woman had been in the restroom with another child. This could have frightened a child so much that they would never want to return to church again. Parents would be mystified as to why the child is so negative about church, but the child would not be able to explain other than to say that an old woman was mean to them. The parents would say, “Oh, big deal, just ignore her,” and they would try to force the child to go back to church, and things would escalate and eventually there would be all-out war between parents and child. All because an old woman with a “condition” that causes her to be violent is allowed to do as she pleases.

No, for her sake and for the sake of children and their families, take steps to see that the woman is kept away from children. Perhaps there is a treatment for her if she is suffering from a medical condition. At any rate, she needs to be monitored and kept away from little ones.

 

[houseofsaul]

I would have followed her out after mass and called her out on it. But that’s just the Sicilian in me.

I would have called her out then and there…u can get your point across without raising your voice, lol.

 

[houseofsaul]

Seriously, I have to wonder if that woman has a fully grasp on her faculties. That is not only outrageous, it is incredibly odd.

Not odd, self absorbed.

 

[houseofsaul]

I think the only proper response to something like that is to say:
“Awww, she LIKES you! We’ll have to sit here behind you more often!”

LOL…that would definitely be me. I don’t understand why when people are down right mean, others don’t want to call them on it. Instead we want to make excuses for them, ignore them, etc. All this does is enable that person to continue with their insensitive, self absorbed ways. I don’t care how old or how ill she is, there is NO EXCUSE for being mean.

 

[houseofsaul]

Every time I read about, or hear about, this type of behavior I am so grateful I was not there to witness it.

That is completely out of line.

That being said, I have a loud singing voice. I love to sing. Most of the time it doesn’t bother people because they are singing too. Twice in the past two weeks, older men have made it a point of telling me how loud I am. My Genovese Mom is next to me in the pew when this happens - and she has taken both of them out with a sweet smile and a, “Oh, what a CLEVER thing to say, young man” (she is 90 - they are probably in their 70’s or 80’s).

You don’t mess with Italians, even at Mass !

Awesome!!!

 

[Alexis546]

First, make certain that the word she spoke was really “turd.” It’s just possible that she has an accent, and is using a term of endearment, but she’s not pronouncing it clearly.

There is a business owner in our city with an accent. Years ago, he advertised a “Penis Sale.” At least, that’s what it sounded like. The first time I ever heard the ad, I was totally shocked! Then I saw the print version of it and realized that he was saying “Peanuts Sale.” (Low prices.)

Well, apparently everyone else in the city heard “penis” sale, too, and within the next few days, ads with apologies were posted by the business.

And years later, the man is still doing “Penis Sale” ads, but he has very clever scripting that involves various celebrities in the city responding to him by saying, “WHAT kind of sale?” and other comments like that. Really funny.

So perhaps the old woman is merely mispronouncing a word.

But it doesn’t sound like that, based on your description of her demeanor.

If she was saying what you thought you heard, then do not minimize the occurrence. This was a violent act, and the pastor should be notified. The woman is a danger to children. This time it was words. Next time, what will she use to hurt a child?

Whether the violent act was caused by a physical condition (e.g., dementia, Tourettes, etc), or whether the woman has that much hatred and bitterness in her, it doesn’t matter. The point is, she should not be allowed to be in the same place where there are children for her to harm. The parish needs to take responsibility for this and make sure that children are protected from her.

Please tell the pastor exactly what happened so that he can take steps to have the woman monitored carefully and kept AWAY from children.

Think of how this would have played out if the woman had been in the restroom with another child. This could have frightened a child so much that they would never want to return to church again. Parents would be mystified as to why the child is so negative about church, but the child would not be able to explain other than to say that an old woman was mean to them. The parents would say, “Oh, big deal, just ignore her,” and they would try to force the child to go back to church, and things would escalate and eventually there would be all-out war between parents and child. All because an old woman with a “condition” that causes her to be violent is allowed to do as she pleases.

No, for her sake and for the sake of children and their families, take steps to see that the woman is kept away from children. Perhaps there is a treatment for her if she is suffering from a medical condition. At any rate, she needs to be monitored and kept away from little ones.

Penis sale!! That gave me my first good laugh of the day, thank you!

And that’s true…since she was leaning down close to the baby perhaps she said something else that just sounding like she said turd? What rhymes with turd… hmmm…the only thing I can think of is "nerd’ and that is offensive too…i will think about it and see what else i can come up with…

 

[Ophelia23]

Penis sale!! That gave me my first good laugh of the day, thank you!

And that’s true…since she was leaning down close to the baby perhaps she said something else that just sounding like she said turd? What rhymes with turd… hmmm…the only thing I can think of is "nerd’ and that is offensive too…i will think about it and see what else i can come up with…

Oh, I heard this very loud and clear. She had no accent, and she didn’t whisper it at all. It was quite loud and enunciated very distinctly. The people behind us were startled by it as well.

 

[MissRose73]

Its hard to say if the woman said it because she was irritated being close to a child or because she doesn’t have all of her mental faculties. The best thing is the next time you go to this Mass, is to sit in a different spot if you see her if you feel you cannot be charitable in any way. Its best to offer it up your uncharitable thoughts to God about her no matter if her words were intentional or a slip of the tongue. If it happens again, its best to address it privately with the priest after Mass.

I do praise parents who are able to take youngsters to Mass and are able to keep them reasonably quiet based on their age & maturity levels, and remove them if they cannot be kept quiet.

 

[Alexis546]

Oh, I heard this very loud and clear. She had no accent, and she didn’t whisper it at all. It was quite loud and enunciated very distinctly. The people behind us were startled by it as well.

Unbelievable…that is just so wrong.

Did you say anything at all to her after this, or were you too shocked? I probably would have been shocked into silence myself…

 

[mt_gooseberry]

We had a similiar experience the other day at a restaurant. My son is at the age where he likes dropping things from a high chair over and over. I automatically reach down and pick it up over and over. We were at a casual, kid-friendly pizza place with light carpeting (which means there was no noisy clattering). At one point I was busy and just left the spoon on the floor. Then a middle-aged woman sitting in a booth across from us stomped over, picked up the spoon, slammed it on my son’s high chair, and muttered, “Little sh*%!”

What is it with people?! He wasn’t being noisy (he was preoccupied at that point by a stalk of celery), and I can’t think of any other reason why he should have gotten such an aggravated reaction.

I’m glad in our case it was while eating out and not at Mass. Right or wrong, I tend to hold mass-goers to a higher standard (especially while actually IN Mass) and I might have proven myself a hypocrite.

 

[houseofsaul]

I know for sure I would have said something then…people like these two continue in this bad behavior because they are bullies that are never called out. Yep, I would have had to ask for God’s forgiveness but I would have called her out. I had a nervous breakdown at 32 because I allowed my family adults to bully me…it took 5 years to finally start healing.

 

[Bklynguy]

At Mass this morning, my 2 year old was being relatively well behaved. We had to step out with her once because she started throwing a fit about something, but otherwise it was a good Mass. She had her soft puppy toy to play with. She quietly was playing by herself. And then THIS happened.

At the peace offering, the woman in front of us turned around. She took my little girl’s hand (fine) she got close to my daughter’s face (awkward) and said in gruff voice “Peace, you little turd. Now be quiet.”



NOTHING about this seemed like a joke or like she was trying to be playful. It took me a second to even register what had just happened! My daughter was stunned by it, too. After the woman turned around, my daughter sat startled and then started crying. I was SO upset. I wanted to tell that woman how entirely out of line she was for being so aggressive with my child. I wouldn’t and couldn’t cause a scene at Mass. But the mama bear in me RAGED with this.

I feel so strongly that we should raise our children to see the Mass as a time for worship. If she is acting up, I will step out with her. I calm her down, we go back in. Wash, rinse, repeat. But I am not going to take her out with every little noise she makes, or every time she wiggles or accidentally drops something. I feel like we are One Body in this Church, and that includes children.

Rant over. Thanks.

I read an article once and can’t seem to find it, but it is called something to the effect of The Mass is Not All About You. Someone should give that woman that article. That was way over the top and innapropriate, especially considering that you indicating it was a pretty good Mass for your daughter. As a parent of a toddler, they sometimes are going to have a hard time sitting still. When they do get fidgety or start to act up, removing them from Mass until they can settle down is the exact appropriate thing to do. What this woman seemed to be thinking was that she should just not be at Mass. Hence, the article: the Mass is not all about you.

 

[Bklynguy]

That’s completely out of line. I hope that woman didn’t receive communion.

I agree with you. Part of the reason for the peace offering is so not to approach the altar with hate in our hearts (go, be reconciled with your brother). So, no, that woman should not have gone up to receive communion. I’m almost positive that she probably did.

 

[Bklynguy]

Every time I read about, or hear about, this type of behavior I am so grateful I was not there to witness it.

That is completely out of line.

That being said, I have a loud singing voice. I love to sing. Most of the time it doesn’t bother people because they are singing too. Twice in the past two weeks, older men have made it a point of telling me how loud I am. My Genovese Mom is next to me in the pew when this happens - and she has taken both of them out with a sweet smile and a, “Oh, what a CLEVER thing to say, young man” (she is 90 - they are probably in their 70’s or 80’s).

You don’t mess with Italians, even at Mass !

There is an older lady in my parish who says the prayers very loud, and many times out of sync with everyone else. To boot, she sits right up in front. One time, the priest was reciting the Gloria at the beginning of Mass and this lady starts and gets him all mixed up. He ended up stopping in the middle and allowed the rest of the parishioners to finish. I remember him stopping looking to the side, and rolling his eyes and shaking his head in disgust. He was very angry and put-off.

 

[Iheartcoffee]

Hopefully my funny misbehavior at Mass story will brighten the day.

As a 2 year old I had a habit of turning all of my bones into some flexible 2 year old goo and I had the ability to slither down in the pew until I slid to the floor. I did this a lot and it drove my mother crazy. I was a real pain during Mass. Compound that with the fact that my mother also had to contend with an infant that had to be carried out every time she took the feral 2 year old out. My father isn’t Catholic and did not attend Mass with us.

One day, when I was being particularly…two years old…in Mass my mom drug me out to the hallway and really let me have it. An elderly nun walked by and said, “Aww…surely that little angel didn’t do anything too bad”.

My mom said it was all her frazzled and sleep-deprived self could do not to yell, “YOU SIT WITH HER!!!” at the nun.

I am an adult and married and my Mass antics as a toddler still seem to be a thing of legend in my family. I just hope it isn’t genetic. My husband and I want to have kids and I am absolutely terrified of having a small version of me!

 

[Ophelia23]

Hopefully my funny misbehavior at Mass story will brighten the day.

As a 2 year old I had a habit of turning all of my bones into some flexible 2 year old goo and I had the ability to slither down in the pew until I slid to the floor. I did this a lot and it drove my mother crazy. I was a real pain during Mass. Compound that with the fact that my mother also had to contend with an infant that had to be carried out every time she took the feral 2 year old out. My father isn’t Catholic and did not attend Mass with us.

One day, when I was being particularly…two years old…in Mass my mom drug me out to the hallway and really let me have it. An elderly nun walked by and said, “Aww…surely that little angel didn’t do anything too bad”.

My mom said it was all her frazzled and sleep-deprived self could do not to yell, “YOU SIT WITH HER!!!” at the nun.

I am an adult and married and my Mass antics as a toddler still seem to be a thing of legend in my family. I just hope it isn’t genetic. My husband and I want to have kids and I am absolutely terrified of having a small version of me!

That’s AWESOME!