Anger/shock over behavior at First Communion

[Eric_Olsen]

why do you need a mass sounding the rite of baptism?
Whatever happened to just bringing the baby in on Sunday after all the masses were done and doing it?

I hear the same sort of griping every time we have a baptism at Sunday Mass.

We tried scheduling baptisms at one or two Masses per month but that didn’t work - too many families ‘come home’ to have their babies baptized and we couldn’t schedule everyone’s holidays to fit the baptism schedule.

Finally Fr. decreed that only one Sunday every three months would have a celebration of baptism, the rest of the baptisms would have to be celebrated at the Saturday evening celebration of Sunday Mass. That’s all well and good, but it means that every three months a family or two or three have their children’s baptisms celebrated with full choir, baptismal hymns, etc., while the rest are relegated to a Mass with a handful of people in attendance, no music, little or no singing and my dulcet tones (not!) chanting the Litany of the Saints. I think it’s doing a disservice to the parish to not put the proper emphasis on the importance of this first sacrament.

 

[Phemie]

why do you need a mass sounding the rite of baptism?
Whatever happened to just bringing the baby in on Sunday after all the masses were done and doing it?

Because it’s a community event, even more than First Communion, and it’s important that the community be there. The Rite doesn’t envision a baptism devoid of the community – even when it’s an emergency baptism in danger of death the rite asks that there be witnesses. If the community won’t attend baptisms within a Liturgy of the Word after Mass, then you bring the baptism to Mass.

 

[ElToro]

The resolution is to announce such events in advance, and make it the celebration of the Parish. We are human beings, imperfect, and many things disturb us. If the first communion is important, then the pastor should announce it in advance many times during the preparation. One had to be prepared for a true celebration, it cannot be surprise party for a community.

People still leave like the building is ready to collapse around here, even if the pastor makes annoucements.

 

[EasterJoy]

There are upsetting things that are nevertheless not ours to fix.

All you can do at this point is to pray for the people who had this bad day, and pray for yourself that you will not extrapolate this one awful example of bad behavior into a judgement of the offenders as persons.

The Evil One likes to get lots of mileage out of something like this. Imagine that perhaps these people might have had an awakening, and regretted their actions later, or that this might happen via your prayers. You don’t have to let go of the concept that this may be a chronic wound in the Body of Christ that might be addressed by some positive action, but do let go of a desire to impose a judgment yourself. That road has only ruin at its end.

 

[asia53]

What really irked the heck of me was this: Evidently some of the parishioners were unaware that this Mass was a First Communion and I heard numerous people in the parking lot griping about it…that the Mass was going to take forever, they’d be late for another commitment, there won’t be anywhere to sit, etc. etc. Some of these people were genuinely annoyed and angry. Hearing these comments made me ashamed to be an adult because several of these children heard the comments and I KNOW it hurt their feelings…to think that their special day was “an inconvenience” for SOME grown ups. I can only imagine how hurt they must have felt hearing ADULTS say such things.

Three weeks before, and every week till the event, our bulletin announced First Communion Mass. Since the Mass was going to be a long one, it was gently suggested, we think about attending another Mass time. I, and others went to an earlier Mass, to make room for the overflow of people, so the children could have their special day.

I heard later, it was a great day!

 

[ElToro]

People really dislike change, and some folks really have a hard time accepting and adapting to it.

The people here have their usual Sunday routine, expect to park in their usual parking space, sit in their usual pew and be on their way to Wendy’s or Wal-mart within 5 minutes of the end of the 49 minute mass just like they’ve done almost every Sunday during the past 9 years.

This mass time was chosen for First Communion probably because the priest expected there to be enough room because of lower expected attendance. At least some of the folks that regularly attend the mass because it has lower attendance and is celebrated in a very regular fashion.

I’m not excusing the behavior of these folks, but I certainly understand people’s angst, particularly if they were not informed in advance that the mass would be extra crowded and extra long, like it would also be at Palm Sunday.

I don’t mean to beat you up but ANGST because Mass was more crowded and it took 10-15 minutes longer? REALLY? What have we become as Catholic Christians?

 

[heathernoel]

I am the mother to four girls. Two have had their First Communions…I can see both sides of the issues here, but for different reasons.

I don’t allow my children to go running around the church before or after Mass. We go 45 minutes before mass to pray. Then the girls are allowed to go see the fish outside, but have to come back and sit down and pray/read bulletins/wait. I have no patience for talking, etc.

I think the parents of First COmmunicants need to be instructed on how to behave. F.C. masses drive me insane because of the gum chewing, arguing over seats, yelling at family members, etc. I would prefer to NOT go to a FC Mass because of this. It makes me anxious, and then I have to explain to the kids that this is NOT acceptable behavior.

 

[Seatuck]

This is a problem. The First Communion is community celebration, one celebration in a year for the whole parish. This emphasizes that the Church is ONE, and there are not different set for individuals or small group.

Church teaching , please as to limiting one celebration instead of many. Every mass is a community event for the parish. 400 people is a good representation of the community. It’s a much more dignified and reverent celebration than when you have the one event with what could be a hundred people in attendance who do not know how to participate at Mass and will not stay put in the pew and insist on getting up for photos and video recording. Not to mention the talking. With the smaller groups it is easier to educate them. We also have a paid videographer to limit those other issues.

 

[puzzleannie]

The resolution is to announce such events in advance, and make it the celebration of the Parish. .

like every Catholic in the world does not know there is a huge likelihood first communions will be celebrated the Sundays of May. In most parishes it is publicized and ushers even “warn” the regulars, but the still persis in owning the Mass and their pew, and their parking spot and that is the source of the problem. they are also this rude everywhere else in life.

you try to park your car and see a dozen little girls in white dresses, and that does not give you a clue to come back to a later Mass? Because you cannot bear to be part of that celebration because it intrudes in your little world? No most Catholics do NOT celebrate when their compadres celebrate sacraments–you should see the resentment for baptisms if you think this is bad.

 

[Phemie]

Church teaching , please as to limiting one celebration instead of many. Every mass is a community event for the parish. 400 people is a good representation of the community. It’s a much more dignified and reverent celebration than when you have the one event with what could be a hundred people in attendance who do not know how to participate at Mass and will not stay put in the pew and insist on getting up for photos and video recording. Not to mention the talking. With the smaller groups it is easier to educate them. We also have a paid videographer to limit those other issues.

When DD was of age for First Communion we were in a parish where parents did the instructing and each child was interviewed by the Pastor when the work was finished. If he considered the child ready for Communion then the parents could take him/her to receive at the next Mass the family attended.

There were many celebrations of First Communion that year, as each child reached the point where Fr. considered him/her ready. All these little individual First Communions were dignified and recognized by the parish at the end of Mass. It was so much more reverent than the zoos I saw in the last two years in my parish.

 

[Seatuck]

When DD was of age for First Communion we were in a parish where parents did the instructing and each child was interviewed by the Pastor when the work was finished. If he considered the child ready for Communion then the parents could take him/her to receive at the next Mass the family attended.

There were many celebrations of First Communion that year, as each child reached the point where Fr. considered him/her ready. All these little individual First Communions were dignified and recognized by the parish at the end of Mass. It was so much more reverent than the zoos I saw in the last two years in my parish.

Much more beautiful memory than all of ours which were group events and really tested my patience and charity with others and threatened my joy and closeness with God.

 

[Phemie]

Much more beautiful memory than all of ours which were group events and really tested my patience and charity with others and threatened my joy and closeness with God.

For ten years, recognizing the role of parents as primary catechists, we had the children who were receiving First Communion sitting with their families and coming up for Communion as part of a family. Things were dignified.

Two years ago a new catechist decided to go back to the kids sitting together and the whole thing has degenerated into chaos. I was about to tackle the next person who rushed the sanctuary with a camera.

 

[Spirithound]

Evidently some of the parishioners were unaware that this Mass was a First Communion and I heard numerous people in the parking lot griping about it…

This is what happens when one does not take a parish bulletin…

 

[Kielbasi]

I don’t mean to beat you up but ANGST because Mass was more crowded and it took 10-15 minutes longer? REALLY? What have we become as Catholic Christians?

It doesn’t have anything to do with being Catholic or not.

People suffer angst when bus schedules are changed, roads are closed for repairs or procedures at their jobs change too.

That’s why its generally a good protocol to clue folks in about changes in advance.

 

[Gardenman]

This is an interesting collection of responses to my original post.

For the record, the parish bulletin DID announce for three weeks in advance that this particular Mass was going to be a FC…so clearly there are those who don’t read the announcements. It was also listed in bold letters for everyone to see on the large permanent sign in front of the church that indicates the services and events schedule of the parish.

The most unfortunate part of this whole incident is that it gave a conflicting message to the CHILDREN about the sense of “community” they are being taught…when a number of grown adults can’t even acknowledge or honor them for an extra 5 minutes (at the most) to complete their little procession with the dignity and respect it deserves.

PERHAPS an announcement could have been made at the beginning of the Mass asking people to refrain from exiting the church until the kids had processed out, but have so many people really lost that much common sense ??? Evidently.

 

[ElToro]

It doesn’t have anything to do with being Catholic or not.

People suffer angst when bus schedules are changed, roads are closed for repairs or procedures at their jobs change too.

That’s why its generally a good protocol to clue folks in about changes in advance.

Of course. I also agee that it’s a good idea to keep people informed. But to feel ANGST because the church is more crowded, your parking space is taken or you get to the restaurant 20 minutes later than usual?

Simply put, BUCK-UP already! You’re at church! Give thanks at the new group of first communicants!

 

[ElToro]

This morning at Mass a visiting priest (and gifted homilist) mentioned the absolute concentration we have when we watch first communicants receive communion for the first time or process out of the church.

This thread immediately came to mind…

 

[exnihilo]

Selfishness and a lack of priorities have always existed. In our time it seems there is not only a lack of shame involving this but also a celebration. We have more material comfort than any people in history and yet rush around like chickens with our heads cut off. Our hard working forefathers who struggled just to stay fed found time to pause and celebrate what is good. It is no surprise that so many people today are on anti-anxiety and anti-depressant medicines.

Not that long ago people would be called out for bad behavior. And this would be done by the average person. This can be done with gentleness, where appropriate. The problem is it hardly has any affect these days because the mass of people have judged rude, selfish behavior to be good. The shame of old worked because the person would see that they were out of step. When you no longer have a culture or norms being out of step is not even a concept people can understand.

There are good ways to mitigate this problem suggested by others. But the root of the problem is people have no foundation or center. That needs to be fixed and with it many other problems will start to clear up.

Because it’s a community event, even more than First Communion, and it’s important that the community be there. The Rite doesn’t envision a baptism devoid of the community – even when it’s an emergency baptism in danger of death the rite asks that there be witnesses. If the community won’t attend baptisms within a Liturgy of the Word after Mass, then you bring the baptism to Mass.

My only experience in a Catholic Church was a baptism. Apparently the parish I went to does baptisms on Saturday in the chapel and schedules them throughout the morning. This particular morning they were having a funeral for a prominent man. The priest was brought in from another parish to help that day since so many other priests were involved in the funeral.

The baptism was done in groups of families. It was just attended by the families and a few friends of the families. There was no music and no participation for those in attendance besides maybe saying the Lords Prayer or something like that. At one point music did come into the chapel as a speaker was on and receiving prelude music being played for the funeral. The priest was unable to turn off the speaker so it stayed on for the rest of the baptisms. I was shocked to hear A Mighty Fortress being played.

The priest was very friendly and I enjoyed that he involved the older children of the infants receiving baptism in the service. But I was surprised that he allowed photographing of the service. Not only did he allow photographing but would arrange himself and others so that a good photograph could be taken of the actual pouring of the water.

I have to say I was very surprised by the whole thing. In my church baptisms normally take place during the Sunday service. The members of the congregation pledge to help bring the child up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. The experience I had was more like waiting at Disney to have your picture taken with Mickey Mouse than a sacred ritual wherein the child is grafted into the church.

 

[ElToro]

Selfishness and a lack of priorities have always existed. In our time it seems there is not only a lack of shame involving this but also a celebration. We have more material comfort than any people in history and yet rush around like chickens with our heads cut off. Our hard working forefathers who struggled just to stay fed found time to pause and celebrate what is good. It is no surprise that so many people today are on anti-anxiety and anti-depressant medicines.

Not that long ago people would be called out for bad behavior. And this would be done by the average person. This can be done with gentleness, where appropriate. The problem is it hardly has any affect these days because the mass of people have judged rude, selfish behavior to be good. The shame of old worked because the person would see that they were out of step. When you no longer have a culture or norms being out of step is not even a concept people can understand.

There are good ways to mitigate this problem suggested by others. But the root of the problem is people have no foundation or center. That needs to be fixed and with it many other problems will start to clear up…

I find your comments fascinating. People do things at Mass (the last place you would think they would do such things) that they would not get away with in the world. I watched this one man “return to the church.” For quite a while he was quiet and reverent – I know him from outside of church and it was good to see him.

Then he become accustomed to church and he changed. He began loudly talking with others and loudly wandering around the church before Mass slapping backs and shaking hands as others do. Then he joined the “insiders club” and became a reader and a EMHC.

Tomorrow at Mass I will probably see him walk from the sacristy to the nave of the church through the sanctuary at least a half dozen times before Mass. He’ll be loud and boisterous. If he does one of the readings, it’s even money that he’ll shake hands as he walks to and from the ambo DURING the Mass. If anyone complains we’ll be reminded that he’s 80 years old. Leave him alone! My pastor certainly isn’t going to do anything. Yes, he’s “all there” even though he acts like he’s not.

If it was just this one jerk everyone would just tune him out. Sadly quite a few act the way he does, PARTCULARLY those “involved” with the Mass.

What makes me really wonder is most of these people are the same generation as my parents. NO WAY would be parents act in such a crude manner at Mass. Absolutely no way.

You say these people have “no foundation or center”? What exactly happened to these people.

 

[MissRose73]

Unfortunately, people are not giving the occasions the respect they deserve. It does not matter if 2 children are going up for First Communion at that Mass or 12, all of them should be prepared, and their families should be prepared ahead of time in regards to seating arrangements and behavior.

I don’t remember much about my day, but it seemed a lot more civilized compared to some of the posts made. Then again, only me and another boy in my class did our First Communions at the same Mass. I am sure our other classmates’ family chose different Masses as that was allowed about 30 years ago.