Anglican Ordinariate (Gathering of Anglicans coming home to Rome)

[RevDrNorth]

Looks like according to these articles that the establishment of the Anglican Ordinariates will first occur in England. Five Church of England Bishops have announced they are leaving for Rome as well as priests, etc.

The Catholic Bishops of England & Wales have announced how the Personal Ordinariate for former Anglicans will come into being during the first half of 2011. Confirming much speculation, the former not-yet-retired Anglican bishops who enter the Ordinariate will be Ordained as Catholic Deacons and Priests very quickly and the former Anglican priests who follow them shortly afterwards will also be Ordained as Catholic Deacons and Priests pretty quickly, around or at Pentecost 2011, their formation taking place intensively before and continuing after their Ordination.

theanglocatholic.com/

Fr. Phillips of Our Lady of the Atonement (Roman Catholic Church) has been hosting an event for Anglicans in San Antonio that was put together on short notice and attracted 125 people from all over the US Canada. He appears to be quite dynamic and has built a strong church and school (see link above) and is a possibility for the ordinariate (talked about anyway but no one knows).

More than 125 people are attending the conference, approximately 80 of them clerics, mostly from the Anglican Church in America, including Archbishop Falk and Bishops Campese and Moyer. Several Anglican Use pastors and priests are present as well as priests from the Anglican Catholic Church of Canada led by Bishop Botterill and priests from the Anglican Church of Canada as well as the Episcopal Church. The mood is described as being from positive to joyous as people have an opportunity to meet one another, pray together, and begin to plan for a shared future.

This morning, Fr. Phillips celebrated an Anglican Use Low Mass and Archbishop Falk was the celebrant at an Anglican Mass from the American Edition of the Anglican Missal. After sharing Morning Prayer, conference participants came together with the students of the 550-strong Atonement Academy, packing the church for Sung Mass according to the Book of Divine Worship, which was described as “incredibly moving.”

It appears the stage is set for the preservation of the beautiful orthodox Anglican liturgy and culture within the Roman Catholic church. It will be interesting to see how many Anglicans take advantage of the offer from the Pope. It will also infuse new orthodox clergy into the Catholic Church.

 

[GKC]

Looks like according to these articles that the establishment of the Anglican Ordinariates will first occur in England. Five Church of England Bishops have announced they are leaving for Rome as well as priests, etc.

The Catholic Bishops of England & Wales have announced how the Personal Ordinariate for former Anglicans will come into being during the first half of 2011. Confirming much speculation, the former not-yet-retired Anglican bishops who enter the Ordinariate will be Ordained as Catholic Deacons and Priests very quickly and the former Anglican priests who follow them shortly afterwards will also be Ordained as Catholic Deacons and Priests pretty quickly, around or at Pentecost 2011, their formation taking place intensively before and continuing after their Ordination.

theanglocatholic.com/

Fr. Phillips of Our Lady of the Atonement (Roman Catholic Church) has been hosting an event for Anglicans in San Antonio that was put together on short notice and attracted 125 people from all over the US Canada. He appears to be quite dynamic and has built a strong church and school (see link above) and is a possibility for the ordinariate (talked about anyway but no one knows).

More than 125 people are attending the conference, approximately 80 of them clerics, mostly from the Anglican Church in America, including Archbishop Falk and Bishops Campese and Moyer. Several Anglican Use pastors and priests are present as well as priests from the Anglican Catholic Church of Canada led by Bishop Botterill and priests from the Anglican Church of Canada as well as the Episcopal Church. The mood is described as being from positive to joyous as people have an opportunity to meet one another, pray together, and begin to plan for a shared future.

This morning, Fr. Phillips celebrated an Anglican Use Low Mass and Archbishop Falk was the celebrant at an Anglican Mass from the American Edition of the Anglican Missal. After sharing Morning Prayer, conference participants came together with the students of the 550-strong Atonement Academy, packing the church for Sung Mass according to the Book of Divine Worship, which was described as “incredibly moving.”

It appears the stage is set for the preservation of the beautiful orthodox Anglican liturgy and culture within the Roman Catholic church. It will be interesting to see how many Anglicans take advantage of the offer from the Pope. It will also infuse new orthodox clergy into the Catholic Church.

Interesting, indeed.

GKC

 

[RevDrNorth]

Interesting, indeed.

GKC

Truly. The Bishops moving to Rome is certainly a big deal. Since we seem to be on the verge of the first ordinariate it will be very interesting to see how many laity follow. I do not imagine we will see many Bishops in the TEC make the move as they have become a rather heterodox body. However, there seem to be a fair number of clergy in the US from various Anglican groups.

Simply amazing though. It is interesting to read and see catholics interested in the ordinariates as well (ie as a place in which to find more traditional worship).

I wonder what five years down the road will look like?

 

[GKC]

Truly. The Bishops moving to Rome is certainly a big deal. Since we seem to be on the verge of the first ordinariate it will be very interesting to see how many laity follow. I do not imagine we will see many Bishops in the TEC make the move as they have become a rather heterodox body. However, there seem to be a fair number of clergy in the US from various Anglican groups.

Simply amazing though. It is interesting to read and see catholics interested in the ordinariates as well (ie as a place in which to find more traditional worship).

I wonder what five years down the road will look like?

I will be watching. But I’d be surprised if there were any TEC bishops in the mix. There are no more doctrinal Anglo-Catholics in there, since +Iker left.

GKC

 

[MarkBrown]

A timeline for the England Ordinariate.

31 Dec 2010. 5 CoE Bishops resignations from the CoE

Jan 2011. The Five Bishops are recieved in full communion. The 3 active are ordained
Deacon and Priest. At this time the Ordinariate is announced and the Ordinary is named.
(at this time only rumor as to who it will be).

Beginning of Lent, those priest and parishes wishing to enter communion will be confirmed and recieved during Holy Week. Around this time, those priests approved by the CDF will be ordained Deacon by Eastertide. Sacramentally the parishes will be under the care of a Catholic Priest.

Pentecost. The Anglican Catholic Deacons will be ordained to the Priesthood. The retired Bishops will also be ordained if this has not happened prior.

At this time I do not know the actual numbers of parishes and priests entering the Ordinariate. News reports have talked of about 50 priests and “numerous” parishes. Archbishop Rowan has made comments of an apparent clergy shortage for the CoE after the Ordinariate is established. During the same interview he was open to the sharing of parish buildings with the new Catholic parishes. But this is not firm numbers.

The Catholic Bishops of England have already set aside “seed” money to financially help the ordinariate establish itself.

As to education. The Catholic Bishop’s plan is for some priestly education to occur prior to ordination and for continuing education to happen after ordination for those who need it. It appears the CDF and the Catholic Bishops are being very welcoming and generous to their Anglican Brothers. Contrary to what many have said and continue to say in the Anglican Communion and the Catholic Church.

In the States, Cardinal Wuerl is still gathering information and numbering the Bishops, priests, deacons, parishes and individuals who want to join in ordinariate in the States. Same is happening in Canada, Australia etc. This information stage is to end 31 Dec.
According to my contact in the Cardinal’s office, the phone does not stop ringing and there are many messages each morning from clergy and laity, both Anglican and Catholic.
The response appears to be greater than expected. So far everything my contact has told me “unoffically” concerning Ordinariate timelines has come true.

On google maps, a map has been created to show the parishes in Canada and the States who have declared for the Ordinariate. The count is at 46, put will be updated as 2 more parishes this weekend have voted to join. The Ordinariate in the States will have an established foundation upon which to build, the Anglican Use parishes. Organization is already occuring, just unofficially by those wanting to enter. Groups of catholic and anglican laity are forming societies to begin formation of Anglican Ordinariate parishes. The Ordinariate will be “top-heavy” it appears with clergy, as some clergy are coming with out their parish. For example, me. It is expected to match clergy with these groups. I know of one priest who is moving with his family from Virginia to a parish in the midwest as a result of parish formations etc.

On the Anglo-Catholic blog, there are pictures of the gathering of Anglican and Catholic Clergy and laity in Houston. These pictures will give you an idea of the Orthodox theology of the Anglicans coming to the Church. Very conservative and very orthodox. 80 clergy attended. Due to secular employment and distance, many other clergy were unable to attend. In Dec 2010, at St Mary’s in the L.A area (I believe) another such but small meeting is planned with Fr. Phillips attendings.

Do not expect Bishops from the TEC to enter for obvious reasons. Some former TEC Bishops now Catholic priest are in the AU movement, but I have not seen too much interaction with them in the Ordinariate. There are some TEC priest who are interested as well as Anglican priest from many different jurisdictions. The same in happening in Canada. Though the majority at this time appear to be from the Continuing Churches, specifically the TAC or ACA as known in the States. I have heard of some non-TAC Bishops who are asking questions and appear to be interested. Time and the Holy Spirit will tell.

Fr. Mark

 

[BernadetteM]

A timeline for the England Ordinariate.

31 Dec 2010. 5 CoE Bishops resignations from the CoE

Jan 2011. The Five Bishops are recieved in full communion. The 3 active are ordained
Deacon and Priest. At this time the Ordinariate is announced and the Ordinary is named.
(at this time only rumor as to who it will be).

Beginning of Lent, those priest and parishes wishing to enter communion will be confirmed and recieved during Holy Week. Around this time, those priests approved by the CDF will be ordained Deacon by Eastertide. Sacramentally the parishes will be under the care of a Catholic Priest.

Pentecost. The Anglican Catholic Deacons will be ordained to the Priesthood. The retired Bishops will also be ordained if this has not happened prior.

At this time I do not know the actual numbers of parishes and priests entering the Ordinariate. News reports have talked of about 50 priests and “numerous” parishes. Archbishop Rowan has made comments of an apparent clergy shortage for the CoE after the Ordinariate is established. During the same interview he was open to the sharing of parish buildings with the new Catholic parishes. But this is not firm numbers.

The Catholic Bishops of England have already set aside “seed” money to financially help the ordinariate establish itself.

As to education. The Catholic Bishop’s plan is for some priestly education to occur prior to ordination and for continuing education to happen after ordination for those who need it. It appears the CDF and the Catholic Bishops are being very welcoming and generous to their Anglican Brothers. Contrary to what many have said and continue to say in the Anglican Communion and the Catholic Church.

In the States, Cardinal Wuerl is still gathering information and numbering the Bishops, priests, deacons, parishes and individuals who want to join in ordinariate in the States. Same is happening in Canada, Australia etc. This information stage is to end 31 Dec.
According to my contact in the Cardinal’s office, the phone does not stop ringing and there are many messages each morning from clergy and laity, both Anglican and Catholic.
The response appears to be greater than expected. So far everything my contact has told me “unoffically” concerning Ordinariate timelines has come true.

On google maps, a map has been created to show the parishes in Canada and the States who have declared for the Ordinariate. The count is at 46, put will be updated as 2 more parishes this weekend have voted to join. The Ordinariate in the States will have an established foundation upon which to build, the Anglican Use parishes. Organization is already occuring, just unofficially by those wanting to enter. Groups of catholic and anglican laity are forming societies to begin formation of Anglican Ordinariate parishes. The Ordinariate will be “top-heavy” it appears with clergy, as some clergy are coming with out their parish. For example, me. It is expected to match clergy with these groups. I know of one priest who is moving with his family from Virginia to a parish in the midwest as a result of parish formations etc.

On the Anglo-Catholic blog, there are pictures of the gathering of Anglican and Catholic Clergy and laity in Houston. These pictures will give you an idea of the Orthodox theology of the Anglicans coming to the Church. Very conservative and very orthodox. 80 clergy attended. Due to secular employment and distance, many other clergy were unable to attend. In Dec 2010, at St Mary’s in the L.A area (I believe) another such but small meeting is planned with Fr. Phillips attendings.

Do not expect Bishops from the TEC to enter for obvious reasons. Some former TEC Bishops now Catholic priest are in the AU movement, but I have not seen too much interaction with them in the Ordinariate. There are some TEC priest who are interested as well as Anglican priest from many different jurisdictions. The same in happening in Canada. Though the majority at this time appear to be from the Continuing Churches, specifically the TAC or ACA as known in the States. I have heard of some non-TAC Bishops who are asking questions and appear to be interested. Time and the Holy Spirit will tell.

Fr. Mark

One slight correction the meeting of Anglicans and Catholics was held in San Antonio, TX, not Houston. From all the comments of people who attended it was a wonderful event. I have a feeling that there might be several parishes in the US that are still waiting to vote whether to enter the Ordinariate or not. Although there is a time line, I think that is just to get a feel for how many at this point are coming in, as any priest or parish can decide in the future to join. Many might be waiting to see how the Ordinariates are working out.

God Bless

Bernadette

 

[RevDrNorth]

A timeline for the England Ordinariate.

31 Dec 2010. 5 CoE Bishops resignations from the CoE

Jan 2011. The Five Bishops are recieved in full communion. The 3 active are ordained
Deacon and Priest. At this time the Ordinariate is announced and the Ordinary is named.
(at this time only rumor as to who it will be).

Beginning of Lent, those priest and parishes wishing to enter communion will be confirmed and recieved during Holy Week. Around this time, those priests approved by the CDF will be ordained Deacon by Eastertide. Sacramentally the parishes will be under the care of a Catholic Priest.

Pentecost. The Anglican Catholic Deacons will be ordained to the Priesthood. The retired Bishops will also be ordained if this has not happened prior.

At this time I do not know the actual numbers of parishes and priests entering the Ordinariate. News reports have talked of about 50 priests and “numerous” parishes. Archbishop Rowan has made comments of an apparent clergy shortage for the CoE after the Ordinariate is established. During the same interview he was open to the sharing of parish buildings with the new Catholic parishes. But this is not firm numbers.

The Catholic Bishops of England have already set aside “seed” money to financially help the ordinariate establish itself.

As to education. The Catholic Bishop’s plan is for some priestly education to occur prior to ordination and for continuing education to happen after ordination for those who need it. It appears the CDF and the Catholic Bishops are being very welcoming and generous to their Anglican Brothers. Contrary to what many have said and continue to say in the Anglican Communion and the Catholic Church.

In the States, Cardinal Wuerl is still gathering information and numbering the Bishops, priests, deacons, parishes and individuals who want to join in ordinariate in the States. Same is happening in Canada, Australia etc. This information stage is to end 31 Dec.
According to my contact in the Cardinal’s office, the phone does not stop ringing and there are many messages each morning from clergy and laity, both Anglican and Catholic.
The response appears to be greater than expected. So far everything my contact has told me “unoffically” concerning Ordinariate timelines has come true.

On google maps, a map has been created to show the parishes in Canada and the States who have declared for the Ordinariate. The count is at 46, put will be updated as 2 more parishes this weekend have voted to join. The Ordinariate in the States will have an established foundation upon which to build, the Anglican Use parishes. Organization is already occuring, just unofficially by those wanting to enter. Groups of catholic and anglican laity are forming societies to begin formation of Anglican Ordinariate parishes. The Ordinariate will be “top-heavy” it appears with clergy, as some clergy are coming with out their parish. For example, me. It is expected to match clergy with these groups. I know of one priest who is moving with his family from Virginia to a parish in the midwest as a result of parish formations etc.

On the Anglo-Catholic blog, there are pictures of the gathering of Anglican and Catholic Clergy and laity in Houston. These pictures will give you an idea of the Orthodox theology of the Anglicans coming to the Church. Very conservative and very orthodox. 80 clergy attended. Due to secular employment and distance, many other clergy were unable to attend. In Dec 2010, at St Mary’s in the L.A area (I believe) another such but small meeting is planned with Fr. Phillips attendings.

Do not expect Bishops from the TEC to enter for obvious reasons. Some former TEC Bishops now Catholic priest are in the AU movement, but I have not seen too much interaction with them in the Ordinariate. There are some TEC priest who are interested as well as Anglican priest from many different jurisdictions. The same in happening in Canada. Though the majority at this time appear to be from the Continuing Churches, specifically the TAC or ACA as known in the States. I have heard of some non-TAC Bishops who are asking questions and appear to be interested. Time and the Holy Spirit will tell.

Fr. Mark

Good summary!

 

[xixxvmcm85]

I’ve asked this before and haven’t gotten a substantive answer (though in all fairness the lack of answers might be due to sheer novelty of the situation), but I would like to know if this Anglican Ordinariate will serve as an actual Rite within the Catholic Church comparable to the Roman Rite, or if the Ordinariate will serve as a temporary provision for the conversion of entire congregations until the time comes that such congregations can be fully assimilated into the Roman Rite?

 

[BernadetteM]

It is a “use” of the Latin Rite and no it is not temporary, it is permanent. Actually the Anglican Use has been around for over 28 years and that was without the promise that it would continue. Now the Holy Father has put it in writing that is will always be part of the liturgies, along with the other Anglican traditions.

Once they are established and if there is a parish close to any Catholics it would be educational for them to visit and see exactly what the liturgy is like.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

 

[MarkBrown]

One slight correction the meeting of Anglicans and Catholics was held in San Antonio, TX, not Houston. From all the comments of people who attended it was a wonderful event. I have a feeling that there might be several parishes in the US that are still waiting to vote whether to enter the Ordinariate or not. Although there is a time line, I think that is just to get a feel for how many at this point are coming in, as any priest or parish can decide in the future to join. Many might be waiting to see how the Ordinariates are working out.

God Bless

Bernadette

Thanks for the correction, do not know why Houston was on my mind. Another correction or update. The count for parishes/missions/formations who have committed to the Ordinariate now stands at 54. This includes both Canada and the States.

Fr. Mark

 

[BernadetteM]

Thanks for the correction, do not know why Houston was on my mind. Another correction or update. The count for parishes/missions/formations who have committed to the Ordinariate now stands at 54. This includes both Canada and the States.

Fr. Mark

Well Houston has a parish and you were probably thinking of them. I might be able to attend the Anglican Use Conference in July, my daughter lives close to St. Mary the Virgin.

That is great, are any from the US? How about Incarnation, did they vote yet. I am counting the days until the meeting at St. Marys. Pray they accept. I suppose they will try to do it before the deadline. Of course there is really no deadline, except the more on board in the beginning the better.

I’ll be in touch. Praying for you.

God Bless

Bernadette

 

[xixxvmcm85]

It is a “use” of the Latin Rite and no it is not temporary, it is permanent. Actually the Anglican Use has been around for over 28 years and that was without the promise that it would continue. Now the Holy Father has put it in writing that is will always be part of the liturgies, along with the other Anglican traditions.

Once they are established and if there is a parish close to any Catholics it would be educational for them to visit and see exactly what the liturgy is like.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

So it isn’t a new rite, rather another form of the Roman Rite?

Does this mean we now have three forms of the Roman Rite: Extraordinary, Ordinary, and Anglican?

 

[Rolltide]

So it isn’t a new rite, rather another form of the Roman Rite?

Does this mean we now have three forms of the Roman Rite: Extraordinary, Ordinary, and Anglican?

Actually, if you want to get technical, there are about ten forms of the Roman Rite still in use:

1. Ordinary Form
2. Extraordinary Form
3. Ambrosian
4. Mozarabic
5. Bragan
6. Anglican Use
7. Dominican
8. Carthusian
9. Carmelite
10. Cisternian

Many of these, like the Mozarabic, are generally referred to as rites, but they are NOT true rites (like the Byzantine), but simply forms of the Roman rite.

 

[BernadetteM]

So it isn’t a new rite, rather another form of the Roman Rite?

Does this mean we now have three forms of the Roman Rite: Extraordinary, Ordinary, and Anglican?

Actually we have had 3 forms of the Latin Rite for over 28 years. But now with the Ordinariates, it is insured that it is permanent. Any Catholic can fill their obligation at these parishes and there are many Catholics who have become registered members of these Anglican Use parishes.

Hopefully as time goes by more and more Anglicans will join the Ordinariate and have parishes. The liturgy is going to be reivsed as Anglicans from all the countries have differences in their liturgies and we must wait to see if the new one will conform more closely to the one of the Anglican Missals. If you go to Our Lady of the Atonement Catholic Church, Texas, they have a video of the full Mass. I would say it is in some ways like the EF and in English, although at times parts are in Latin. It depends on the Mass setting. There is even more participation by the congregation than in the OF Mass.

God Bless

Bernadette

 

[Matthew_Holford]

Actually, if you want to get technical, there are about ten forms of the Roman Rite still in use:

1. Ordinary Form
2. Extraordinary Form
3. Ambrosian
4. Mozarabic
5. Bragan
6. Anglican Use
7. Dominican
8. Carthusian
9. Carmelite
10. Cisternian

Many of these, like the Mozarabic, are generally referred to as rites, but they are NOT true rites (like the Byzantine), but simply forms of the Roman rite.

Are none of these actual rites? Are they all uses of the Roman Rite? Doesn’t the Latin Catholic Church have more than one rite?

 

[Bluegoat]

Very interesting - it seems like there are a lot more than I thought there would be! Three in my province! I will be very interested to see how many Catholics start going, because there is really nothing liturgically here for more traditional Catholics.

 

[Rolltide]

Are none of these actual rites? Are they all uses of the Roman Rite? Doesn’t the Latin Catholic Church have more than one rite?

Ok, after doing some further exploring, and gaining a bit of information from Wikipedia (which is not always reliable) and the Catholic Encyclopedia, I see where my confusion came from. The “Latin Rite” of the church uses several rites (two different usages of the word “rite” here…). As far as I can tell, this is how it breaks down:

**1) The Roman Rite
**The Roman Rite has several forms:
a) Ordinary Form
b) Extraordinary Form
c) Anglican Use
d) Algonquian and Iroquoian Use
e) Zaire Use

2) Western Rites of the “Galician” Type
a) Ambrosian Rite
b) Mozarabic Rite
c) Bragan Rite
d) Carthusian Rite

3) Rites of Religious Orders
a) Carmelite Rite
b) Cisternian Rite
c) Dominican Rite
d) Premonstratensian or Norbertine Rite

 

[pipper]

I have a question. In this new group what will the liturgy be like? Will it be base on the book of common prayer 1928, with the gloria at the end? And the language of "his one sacrifice of himself ONCE offered?

How can that be a Catholic Mass?

 

[BernadetteM]

I have a question. In this new group what will the liturgy be like? Will it be base on the book of common prayer 1928, with the gloria at the end? And the language of "his one sacrifice of himself ONCE offered?

How can that be a Catholic Mass?

If you view the Anglican Use Mass at Our Lady of the Atonement church you can see the Mass as it was approved over 28 years ago. It will now be revised and no one at this time knows what the changes will be. As I have said before, hopefully it will be based on one of the Anglican Missals, including the same Canon used now. At that site there is also the written form of the liturgy that one can read.

Hopefully the Anglican Use priests will have (name removed by moderator)ut into the new translation, as they were not happy with the first. Whether Rome will allow them to use the missal or not is in question. It contained the prayers at the foot of the altar and the Last Gospel. The Anglican Use Mass is the one approved by Rome, so for anyone to question if it is inline with Catholic theology they are incorrect.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

 

[Bluegoat]

I have a question. In this new group what will the liturgy be like? Will it be base on the book of common prayer 1928, with the gloria at the end? And the language of "his one sacrifice of himself ONCE offered?

How can that be a Catholic Mass?

Huh. Well, I think the Orthodox Western Rite uses that phrase. And as far as I am aware, the Catholic Church also teaches that Christ was only sacrificed once.