Anglicanism/Anglican Communion/Orthodox Anglicanism

  • Thread starter Thread starter dallas_r
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
D

dallas_r

Guest
Hey mates, I was reading a article on Anglicanism and it confused the heck out of me…

So what is Anglicanism? Why do they call themselves Catholic? It’s not possible to be “selectively catholic” so… I also read Anglicans think of their branch as the purest expression of Catholicism, how can someone prove this false in a debate?

Feel free to share anything (ANYTHING) related to Anglicanism on this thread too, as this thread is to simply look at the Anglican communion.
 
Memories…light the corners of my mind…memories … of my first post, anywhere, 15-16 years ago. On Anglicanism, on a RC board.

Ask one question. We shall see.

GKMotley, posterus traditus Anglicanus, Anglicanus Catholicus.

Anglicans might confuse anyone. Nil desperandum
 
Last edited:
dallas_r said:
So what is Anglicanism?
Click to expand...
Basically, England had a Protestant Reformation. The king and Parliament nationalized the Catholic Church–thus the Church of England is established. The CofE goes from being basically Roman Catholic without the Pope to being very Protestant to being something in between in the time of Queen Elizabeth I–this is called the Elizabethan Settlement.

Meanwhile, Scotland has its own Reformation. Its Parliament nationalizes the Catholic Church there but goes further than the English Reformation. The Scots get rid of their bishops and dioceses. They become Presbyterians. Yet, when the Stuarts become kings of both Scotland and England, however, they try to reintroduce bishops and liturgical worship back into the Church of Scotland. Most Scots reject this, but some like it. The national Church of Scotland remained presbyterian, but a new church is started that has bishops and prayerbook worship–the Scottish Episcopal Church.

Later, England starts establishing colonies. Thirteen of these colonies are in America, and the Church of England is brought here as well. In 1776, the United States declares independence. Members of the Church of England in the new US realize they need a new name, so they choose the name “Protestant Episcopal Church” since they are Protestants with bishops. Today, the name has been shortened to the Episcopal Church.

Other Anglican and Episcopal churches were founded in other nations, many as colonial churches. Eventually, these collections of national Anglican churches become known as the Anglican Communion–all having their origins in the Church of England.
 
Last edited:
dallas_r said:
Hey mates, I was reading a article on Anglicanism and it confused the heck out of me…

So what is Anglicanism? Why do they call themselves Catholic? It’s not possible to be “selectively catholic” so… I also read Anglicans think of their branch as the purest expression of Catholicism, how can someone prove this false in a debate?

Feel free to share anything (ANYTHING) related to Anglicanism on this thread too, as this thread is to simply look at the Anglican communion.
Click to expand...
The “Act of Supremacy” of Henry the VIII of England was the passed by the English parliament in 1534, which appointed the king as the only head of the Church of England. After Henry the VIII died (1547), in 1549 the mass was abolished and a new liturgy in English was implemented called the Book of common Prayer, during the reign of King Edward VI. The Act of Supremacy was reversed by Queen Mary Tudor (1554), but eventually Elizabeth I, the daughter of Henry VIII and Ann Boleyn, came to power and re-instituted the Supremacy Act (1559), asserting that as queen she was the head of the Church of England. Then she appointed new bishops to revise the Church doctrine producing a text called the 39 articles (1563) which was adopted as the official text by the Anglicans. These doctrines were derived from Luther, Calvin and Bucer.
  • Luther excommunicated 1521
  • Bucer excommunicated 1523
  • Calvin broke with Catholicism 1533
  • England broke with Rome 1534
  • Henry VIII excommunicated 1534/1538
  • Elizabeth I excommunicated 1570
 
Last edited:
Elizabeth’s Act decreed her to be Supreme Governor, Supreme Head being thought a little of an over-reach.
 
dallas_r said:
I also read Anglicans think of their branch as the purest expression of Catholicism, how can someone prove this false in a debate?
Click to expand...
I would say because their religion can be traced to King Henry VIII as their founder. Whereas, the Catholic Church goes back to Jesus Christ.
 
I tried this, but since they think they are catholic, they said henry was like a reformer, not the creator of Anglicanism.
 
dallas_r said:
I tried this, but since they think they are catholic, they said henry was like a reformer, not the creator of Anglicanism.
Click to expand...
He made himself the supreme head of his form of Christianity. He literally cut away a branch of the Church and usurped the authority over it.

He couldn’t, for example, claim to be the head of the Catholic Church in France. Whereas, the French Church was still subject to the Pope.
 
Not all Anglicans would make any sort of assertion that they were Catholic, in any sense, though others might do so (it’s the motley bit). Who are these Anglicans of whom you speak, specifically?
 
Anglo-Catholic is a term used by certain types of Anglicans, yes. I’m one of them. It places them in the Anglican spectrum, as folk whose background was in the Oxford/Tractarian Movement and /or the later Ritualist movement in the Church of England. And likewise, Anglicans can refer to themselves as traditionalists, which would not necessarily mean Anglo-Catholic. Though that would be me, again. But is there some sort of jurisdictional name these folks possess? I’m getting a feel that they might be Continuing Anglicans (which is not the name of a specific jurisdiction or Church, but a generic term for some Anglicans not in communion with Canterbury, hence not in the official Anglican Communion).
 
Last edited:
Good to see Martin Bucer get a mention — he’s too often forgotten amidst the Sturm und Drang of Luther, Calvin and Zwingli. Of the main reformers perhaps Bucer and Cranmer were the most influential on the spirit of the CofE (whether they were on its theology I’m not equipped to judge).
 
dallas_r said:
Feel free to share anything (ANYTHING) related to Anglicanism on this thread too, as this thread is to simply look at the Anglican communion.
Click to expand...
“Archbishop Cranmer” is an informative and entertaining Anglican blog (link below). You’ll find constant argument there―mainly Anglicans vs other Anglicans, but with (name removed by moderator)ut from Catholics and also from a wide array of anti-Anglican Protestants.

http://archbishopcranmer.com/
 
I’m a Roman Catholic convert, raised very much Church of England. Much I love England, my country, the Reformation has never sat well with me. The scars of what Henry VIII did are still visible all over the land.
 
The comments on Archbishop Cranmer are always best avoided though.

Martin Sewell’s piece, though generally unimpressive, contains this nice paragraph describing Anglican motleyness:

If I were to take a handful of bread rolls and cast them randomly around the chamber of General Synod, who would catch them? Here, one who sees the Bible as the literal word of God; over there, someone who reads the inspired word of God. This bishop here sees praying for the dead as a Christian duty, whilst a priest (or is he a minister?) over there thinks this to be a futile exercise. Others could urge upon us the efficacy of praying through the Virgin Mary, petitioning through the Saints and venerating icons. The lady sitting next to me might see this as strangely unacceptable, if not borderline idolatry. Then there are the women bishops and priests – or not.
 
dallas_r said:
I tried this, but since they think they are catholic, they said henry was like a reformer, not the creator of Anglicanism.
Click to expand...
You’re not going to “convince” Anglicans of anything. No good Catholic would ever think of an Anglican as “Catholic”. Anglicans spent hundreds of years persecuting Catholics who follow the Pope, killing them in wars, and in Ireland, eliminating them through a mass genocide.

Just let Anglicans keep having their weird little fantasy that they are Catholics. Their sect is already dwindling in numbers and will likely just disappear soon enough.
 
We need to remember that under Queen Mary, Catholics also persecuted Anglicans.
The religious wars in England were very ugly.
 
Yes, this is true, but underscores my point, that the Anglicans are not Catholics and never will be Catholics unless they merge with the Catholics. Which actually was discussed at one point, but as I understand it, foundered over the issue of women priests, which the Anglicans permit. Now that the Anglicans have also become very gay-friendly and have gay ministers who march around in support of abortion clinics, it’s even less likely that any merger would take place.

Sorry, I am not too friendly to Anglicans since they forced my great-grands and grands to move away from Ireland to avoid starving to death. I suppose it worked out nicely for me in the end, as I think the USA is a nice place to live, but I have had to pray very hard to make myself forgive them. Catholics they are not, and never will be. I find it rather insulting that they would claim to be so.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top