Animals in heaven?

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The Genesis account teaches that human beings were the only creatures created in the very image and likeness of God. This means that as God is triune, humans were also threefold in nature. As God manifests Himself in three modes, even so man in nature manifest himself in three parts: body, soul and spirit, of which these three are hundred percent man. In the case of animals, they were not created in the image and likeness of God. They don’t have souls. This implies that when they die, they cease to exist. They are not meant for eternity. Only humans are. That explains why we won’t meet animals resurrected in heaven. That is also why we don’t preach salvation and His Gospel to animals.
 
I got my information from Father Hardon, same as Barbara Therese. In universities where Catholicism is taken serisouly, he is THE go-to author.

1.) Where does it say that Catholics are sola scriptura, and believe only the Bible as their authority?
2.) Why put a limit on God? We do not do so with infants who have died without baptism, but trust in God’s mercy. We can’t trust in God’s mercy for pets- who, although they have inanimate souls, are nevertheless under the care of the Creator who gave them to us? If babies, who are infinitely more valuable with animate souls, can be trusted to God, perhaps the best thing to do is simply trust these creatures to God and His Will, however He sees fit.
3.) Therefore, in my opinion, as long as one doesn’t start praying to St. Rover as a private devotion, how we trust our pets to God’s mercy is up to us. The Church is silent on the matter.
 
OutinChgoburbs said:
I got my information from Father Hardon, same as Barbara Therese. In universities where Catholicism is taken serisouly, he is THE go-to author.

1.) Where does it say that Catholics are sola scriptura, and believe only the Bible as their authority?
2.) Why put a limit on God? We do not do so with infants who have died without baptism, but trust in God’s mercy. We can’t trust in God’s mercy for pets- who, although they have inanimate souls, are nevertheless under the care of the Creator who gave them to us? If babies, who are infinitely more valuable with animate souls, can be trusted to God, perhaps the best thing to do is simply trust these creatures to God and His Will, however He sees fit.
3.) Therefore, in my opinion, as long as one doesn’t start praying to St. Rover as a private devotion, how we trust our pets to God’s mercy is up to us. The Church is silent on the matter.
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Many thanks for the post. Sometimes we get so wound up in what is LAW, we forget the mercy of God and His love for us. We need to trust Him more. 🙂 Peace.
 
Porthos11…first of all- I don’t “blather”…isn’t even in my vocabulary-but it apparently is in yours…the TOP theologian in his time,John Paul II, believed and DECLARED animals have souls…I find it quite sad that you don’t see God in your own dogs…If you love them-that connection will not be broken-ever…and if you keep that love alive in your heart- you will be pleasntly surprised when your time comes…May God open your eyes-and your heart to the obvious…God Bless
 
JCnMe said:
Porthos11…first of all- I don’t “blather”…isn’t even in my vocabulary-but it apparently is in yours…the TOP theologian in his time,John Paul II, believed and DECLARED animals have souls…I find it quite sad that you don’t see God in your own dogs…If you love them-that connection will not be broken-ever…and if you keep that love alive in your heart- you will be pleasntly surprised when your time comes…May God open your eyes-and your heart to the obvious…God Bless
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You are blathering because of the strung sentences, all the … and the failure to use paragraphs.

There is nothing “obvious” about it. The Church has not spoken definitively on the matter and if you re-read my post, you will see that **I said that the joy my pets give me comes from God. **And yes, animals have souls, otherwise, how can they be alive? How can they move. All living things, animals and plants have souls.

However, do not be led by your emotions. Animal souls are material souls that do not persist after death. When I go to heaven, I will have God, and that’s all that matters. If you remain attached to your pets, then you are looking for a lesser joy than God. We were created for only three things: to love God, serve him, and be happy with him forever in heaven. God is the only real joy. When they die, I will grieve deeply, but as always God will be my comfort. So DON’T YOU DARE ACCUSE ME OF NOT LOVING MY DOGS!

But again, if you bother to read my posts properly, I also said that none of these preclude God’s re-creating our friends in the afterlife. If he sees that our joy will be complete with them, they will be there. But to insist that they are immortal like us is not part of the Catholic faith. Only God knows for sure.

I will only trust in God’s love with regards to my pets and will do no thing as foolish as canonizing them.
 
porthos11…someone with as much hostility in your heart- needs to hang around with their dogs more…when you don’t know what to say you resort to insult and YELLING…:eek: :rolleyes: … consider yourself “blathered”…

I will say it again-I’ll word it differently this time…;-)…You now have professed great love for your dogs-and I’m sure they have great love for you…how can you profess to know and love God and yet not see God at work in that unconditional love your dogs give you…it’s not rhetorical-I already have my answers-just think about it…My prayer for you is one of recognition and awareness …God embraces you in many ways-human to human is just one of them… and-I have to say with your attitude, after reading your posts, you should count your blessings that a dog’s love is unconditonal-they are much more tolerant than I am-but I’m working on it…-God Bless
 
EXACTLY!!..you’re right- thank you for validating my point so eloquently… -nowhere in your posts do you appear to know or recognize God’s Love …
 
JCnMe said:
EXACTLY!!..you’re right- thank you for validating my point so eloquently… -nowhere in your posts do you appear to know or recognize God’s Love …
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Where did I deny God’s love in my pets? And how do you reconcile that slanderous accusation with my posts earlier which said:
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Me:
They are here now to give me joy and that joy comes from God.
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and
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Me:
**I said that the joy my pets give me comes from God. **
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…first of all since you feel a need to correct and pick apart-and trade insults instead of dealing with the issue at hand- for the record-written word it would be 'libelous"- not slanderous-that’s reserved for the spoken word…

You said joy- not love…there is a difference- especially in your posts- you seem to think that what brings you “joy” is just a present from God that is used up and disposable for our amusement…LOVE is different-GOD is LOVE…and dogs and other animals are gifts of LOVE from GOD and have the ability to share GOD’s LOVE with us…if you recognize that LOVE that pets give so freely without judgement- you will recognize GOD at work …pets make us better humans-they are privy to an honest non-judgemental Love that we can only aspire to-they teach us by sharing it with us… which takes us back to the first posts you tried and failed to contradict…you are booksmart- you are not heartsmart…the Holy Spirit writes on the Heart…
 
JCnMe said:
…first of all since you feel a need to correct and pick apart-and trade insults instead of dealing with the issue at hand- for the record-written word it would be 'libelous"- not slanderous-that’s reserved for the spoken word…

You said joy- not love…there is a difference- especially in your posts- you seem to think that what brings you “joy” is just a present from God that is used up and disposable for our amusement…LOVE is different-GOD is LOVE…and dogs and other animals are gifts of LOVE from GOD and have the ability to share GOD’s LOVE with us…if you recognize that LOVE that pets give so freely without judgement- you will recognize GOD at work …pets make us better humans-they are privy to an honest non-judgemental Love that we can only aspire to-they teach us by sharing it with us… which takes us back to the first posts you tried and failed to contradict…you are booksmart- you are not heartsmart…the Holy Spirit writes on the Heart…
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Okay fine. You win.
 
LOL…I haven’t heard anything about flies and other insects having souls…but “praying mantis” may be working on it…😃
 
JCnMe said:
LOL… sorry for laughing- but your aversion to animals sounds more like a personal problem rather than fact…your observations and obvious utter revulsion towards animals goes against everything anyone who loves and knows animals know is true…why all the hostility??? Perhaps another subject would be more to your liking- …and more to your understanding and hopefully would bring out the best of you-rather than the worst…animals ARE teachers and surround us with unconditional love as pets- of course you have to be able to feel it to acknowledge it…some people never will and they will never know what they have missed either-…you will never understand that bond between people and their pets…and what is really sad is you have absolutely no compassion for the loss of a beloved pet that started this thread… how would you feel is some inconsiderate unfeeling poster intruded on your grief-with such repsonses directed at you…think about it…God Bless you for believing you really had something to offer here
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I feel that this message directed toward me was deeply lacking in charity, do you not see any problems with what you have said? It seems that we cannot continue to discuss this, because you have yet to ever respond to any of my specific objections/arguments with regard to your stance with any reasoned argument of your own. Instead all you have returned is impassioned diatribe and insults…you see, someone disagreeing with you is not an attack on your person, it is not aimed at you personally. I can simultaneously respect and love you as a human being without agreeing with you intellectually. But it seems that you do not wish to engage me intellectually but would rather mock me. I feel that this is quite wrong on your part and I think that you ought to know it.

Please read carefully all that I have said: I have no revulsion against animals, I in fact love animals. I was deeply saddened by the loss of my dog which I had for 17 years. I mentioned it above.

I have shown no hostility. I have only asked questions and given arguments…I have yet to receive more than one reasonable and meaningful response.

How is it that you can claim that this is “the worst of me”? All I did was disagree. What do you even mean by that?

I do understand, I think, the connection that people have with their pets…I also understand the illegitimate obsession and misplaced value that some people can have for their pets as well. There is a mode of love for animals that is within moral perimeters and then there is one that unintentionally harms the dignity of the human person in all that it implies. Also, I gave my sympathies earlier.

If you cannot specifically address all that I say, with a real argument, then we cannot actually have any conversation…what we’ve been doing so far is completely devoid of true conversation. That was difficult for me. But what I find to be absolutely REPREHENSIBLE is that you would offer me a “blessing” in the name of the Lord that was really nothing more than an insult…I really think you need to reflect on that and how terrible it is! If God is love, as you and I both say He is, how do you suppose we could ever go about abusing the name of the Lord as a means to cut another person down? Is there any part of you that thinks this is really ok?

With all sincerity in my heart, I hope goodness for you. And please do pray for me, if you feel personally injured by my disagreement, but do not abuse a blessing or prayer so that you can make an insult.
 
JCnMe said:
Jksoren…God doesn’t make anything that isn’t loved by Him- yes, grape branches are a term of endearment… again…your inability to acknowledge or comprehend the length and breadth of God’s infinite and inclusive love is absolutely incredible to me…good thing God doesn’t fit into that very small box you are trying to put him in…His Love for all His creation is not limited by your narrow views…Thank you Lord :signofcross:

God does loves all of creation, he looked upon it said that it was good…no more proof of this is needed beyond the fact that all creation continues in existence. It only does so because God wills it, and God wills it because it is good…why is it good? Because God created it. Anyway…I think I do to a certain degree comprehend God’s love of all created reaility, but not ALL created reality is intended to be in loving communion with God. Grape branches are not going to be in interpersonal union with the Lord…people are! Can you imagine how silly it would be if the loving communion with God were somehow inclusive of every single bit of creation? Not just cute animals but the more “less than cute animals too”?

I don’t think its a matter of having a narrow view regard to God, I think its a matter of being consistent in my application of Dogma, scripture, and reason.

((((CreosMary))))… well said…Bless you
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porthos11 said:
As mentioned, no our beloved pets do not go to heaven, as their souls cease to exist at their death.

This is not cause for sorrow in the afterlife, because in heaven, the Beatific Vision will be our complete happiness, and we will need nothing else.

That said, God’s re-creating of our beloved friends is not precluded by this theology.
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Thank you!
 
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