Animals in heaven?

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(((Stella)))—you read well- and yet the Holy Spirit writes on the heart-you read a speculation of what an animal’s love might be- the Church does not know this to be fact but leans in that direction…if you do not choose to seek God any further than that-so be it- but you are limiting yourself and God in the process…if you are saying you DO see God in all of His creation and Love animals and see them as teachers-then you are leaps and bounds beyond what you quoted and the limits of God’s Love it implies… animals don’t NEED to commune with God- God communes with them…Man needs to commune with God because we have free will that can lead us from Him…we have done it so often that we need the sacraments to establish and renew our bond with Him-…we have Dominion-but as caretakers -just as God takes care of us and shepherds us- not to abuse that power-nor negate the preciousness of the gift…the hierarchy of God’s Creation is set up to see if we make the choices to focus on Him and His love of all -or- abuse the power and destroy…you’ll notice He did not make us bigger and stronger than everything else-(which He is) he gave us free will and a conscious inate awareness of right and wrong… to learn to be like Him…we have a lot to learn… and although you are a unique human being ((Stella))- you could just as easily have been the unique spirit of that quail- God chose to make you a human being…it’s up to you to choose what kind of human being you are…God Bless
 
Jesus was talking about people – not animals. In a number of places He talks about PEOPLE entering heaven. Nowhere does the bible make reference to animals entering heaven.

Mr. Goodknight. If you do not agree with us then fine. Believe what you want, but don’t try to prove it using the bible or religion. Because you do NOT have the authority to do this. When you get to heaven and you fill out your requests just don’t check the pets part and you will never see a pet there even though for others they will be there. I have not been given permission to tell you more.
 
JCnMe said:
(((Stella)))—animals don’t NEED to commune with God- God communes with them…Man needs to commune with God because we have free will that can lead us from Him…we have done it so often that we need the sacraments to establish and renew our bond with Him-…
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God does not commune with animals the same way he communes with us in the sacraments. Uniting with God during Holy Communion is a greater union than that of husband and wife. Even the angels do not share in this unity.

“If angels could be jealous of men, they would be so for one reason: Holy Communion.” - St. Maximilian Kolbe

I’m not even debating wether or not animals will be in Heaven or if they have immortal souls anymore-- (I apologize to the original poster.)

I would just like to emphasize that animals should not be given the same or greater affection than that of persons as the Catechism instructs and that equating God’s love for animals with that of man undermines the dignity of humanity.
 
Schultzz said:
Jesus was talking about people – not animals. In a number of places He talks about PEOPLE entering heaven. Nowhere does the bible make reference to animals entering heaven.

Mr. Goodknight. If you do not agree with us then fine. Believe what you want, but don’t try to prove it using the bible or religion. Because you do NOT have the authority to do this. When you get to heaven and you fill out your requests just don’t check the pets part and you will never see a pet there even though for others they will be there. I have not been given permission to tell you more.
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If the bible or the church teaches that animals can go to heaven, then show the proof. Otherwise, stop trying to mislead the readers with your " I have not been given permission to tell you more.".

Are you IMPLYING that you have PRIVATE revelation from God on this matter? May I remind you that that is a violation of forum rules – no unapproved private revelation may be discussed on this board.
 
JCnMe said:
SirKnight…Everything I said is Biblical-with the exception of the possiblility of you not being surprised by seeing dogs and cats walking with their loved ones-are you saying you wouldn’t be surprised?..
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Isn’t that the point of this discussion? That animals being in heaven is unbiblical?
JCnMe said:
…and you missed the point entirely when I referred to the Beatitudes-read it again-it is totally about PEOPLE.(sorry-but since you felt the need to “yell” it out-I assume that’s the word you have trouble hearing) animals did not need to be saved-they did not disobey God
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Exactly the point. They were not put to the test. If one is not tested, one can not fail. Would a ALL-just God require one part of creation to pass the test in order to enter heaven while giving another part of creation a free pass into heaven? I don’t see how that would be fair and let’s not forget that God is ALL-Just!
JCnMe said:
…and as far as snatching souls- they have no power in your life unless you give it to them…fear- gives it to them
1John 4:16-18…-you cannot be made complete God’s Love if you fear such things-you choose who you focus on- choose God and His Angels God bless
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Scripture also has it that even the pious man sins several times a day before the Lord.
 
(((Stella))))…and now you are saying …what-that even the Angels won’t be with us in Heaven?..let’s suffice it to say that the animals will be with the Angels then…LOL-you have to agree that this is beginning to border on the ridiculous…it’s a good thing God has a sense of humor about all this-he’d have wiped the slate clean a long time ago…I’ll go back to the original premise of my posts… animals share with us an unconditional kind of love that we can only aspire to-it is much closer to God’s love than most humans are capable of giving or returning- they teach us by sharing that love with us to be better humans…they aren’t searching for God’s love- they already know it-.if you don’t want to believe me- then perhaps you will believe the words of others…

All creatures are created from the same paternal heartbeat of God.Not to hurt our humble brethren is our first duty to them,but to stop here is a complete misapprehension of the intentions of Providence.We have a higher mission.God wishes that we should succour them when they require it.
St Francis of Assissi 1182-1226

The Franciscan spirit is the Catholic spirit.
Arthur, Cardinal Hinsey 1865-1943

Pope Pius XI in his letter on St.Francis of Assissi wrote:
  • St Francis was led to love all things which he knew had the same origin as he, and in which he recognized the goodness of God.For he followed his Well-Beloved everywhere and in every trace of Him to be found in His creatures,he made of all things a ladder to reach His throne.
Our obligation and our moral duty is to Him that made the animals…and in giving dominion over creatures to man,He gave it subject to the condition that they should be used in comformity
with His own perfections,one is,most profoundly,that of eternal mercy.
Henry,Cardinal Manning 1808-1892

Hope this helps…God Bless
 
SirKnight-…no -the point of YOUR discussion was to say animals in Heaven is unbiblical…the point of My discussion here was to affirm that all God’s creatures that know His love will be with Him in Heaven-because if you go back to the beginning-this particular post was to give comfort to someone who had lost a dear pet…you jumping in with your particular lack of compassion has offered nothing to the original intent…but God will forgive you…

as far as you feeling you need a test-I think you are taking one now…the animals have no need -they would never proclaim that you would not be going to Heaven…they would never be so egotistical or presumptuous to speak for God…as I said we have a lot to learn…and as far as questioning whether anyone is speaking of personal revelation or not…good thing-because you would no doubt have been blown out of the water a long time ago if it were allowed:thumbsup: … as it is…Popes and Saints do not share your lowly opinion of animals-let’s hope that your lowly opinion of them is no reflection on you in God’s eyes:eek::gopray: …God Bless
 
JCnMe said:
… show me something that says they won’t be in Heaven-
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Using this approach, show me something that says that guns won’t be in heaven. Then, they could be used to hunt the animals.
 
…nice try…you can’t do it…you have nothing to back up your elitist rants…you might be able to go hunting in Heaven- but not with bullets and the animals won’t die- on the other hand-perhaps the animals will have learned how to use a gun- and you can take turns being the hunter or the hunted…to experience the fear something hunted feels…poetic justice
 
JCnMe said:
…nice try…you can’t do it…you have nothing to back up your elitist rants…you might be able to go hunting in Heaven- but not with bullets and the animals won’t die- on the other hand-perhaps the animals will have learned how to use a gun- and you can take turns being the hunter or the hunted…to experience the fear something hunted feels…poetic justice
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Are you joking or serious about this statement?
 
JCnMe said:
…nice try…you can’t do it…you have nothing to back up your elitist rants…you might be able to go hunting in Heaven- but not with bullets and the animals won’t die- on the other hand-perhaps the animals will have learned how to use a gun- and you can take turns being the hunter or the hunted…to experience the fear something hunted feels…poetic justice
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I’m am trying to illustrate that just because the bible doesn’t say that something isn’t, doesn’t mean that it is. And as far as animals being hunted by animals, have you forgotten that God gave dominion to mankind over animals and not the other way around and the bible tells us that God does not change.
 
JCnMe said:
SirKnight-…no -the point of YOUR discussion was to say animals in Heaven is unbiblical…the point of My discussion here was to affirm that all God’s creatures that know His love will be with Him in Heaven-
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Show me chapter and verse where it says this.
JCnMe said:
because if you go back to the beginning-this particular post was to give comfort to someone who had lost a dear pet…you jumping in with your particular lack of compassion has offered nothing to the original intent…but God will forgive you…
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You don’t make a person feel better by LYING to them and telling the truth is never a sin.
JCnMe said:
as far as you feeling you need a test-I think you are taking one now…the animals have no need -they would never proclaim that you would not be going to Heaven…they would never be so egotistical or presumptuous to speak for God…
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The Church speaks for God because Jesus said that He and His church are one and no where in official church teaching does it say that animals will go to heaven. As a matter of fact, the church has declared that only man has an immortal soul. If only man has an immortal soul, that means that animals’ souls are mortal and therefore do not go anywhere after death.
JCnMe said:
as I said we have a lot to learn…and as far as questioning whether anyone is speaking of personal revelation or not…good thing-because you would no doubt have been blown out of the water a long time ago if it were allowed:thumbsup: … as it is…Popes and Saints do not share your lowly opinion of animals-let’s hope that your lowly opinion of them is no reflection on you in God’s eyes:eek::gopray: …God Bless
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Show me a Pope that stated that animals will go to heaven.
 
Are you IMPLYING that you have PRIVATE revelation from God on this matter? May I remind you that that is a violation of forum rules – no unapproved private revelation may be discussed on this board.

It doesn’t take a revelation to realize that you appear to be a very strange person.
 
JCnMe said:
…by the same token- do you eat animal flesh because of your revulsion of animals or lack of concern? Do you abhor the salad bar because all are living things? Being a vegetarian is still using other life for personal sustenance…on the other hand God has allowed what is given for food -hopefully everyone- vegetarian or omnivore-understands the sacrifice of the life taken and prays over it…as in everything-the sin is in the intent…would I kill an animal or eat a vegetable for anything other than the necessity of food- no -and would I ever allow a beloved pet to be used in this manner?- I would protect them with my life… would you?
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  1. I eat animals to live…by the way, I was once a vegan, before I was Catholic that is. (My eating animals has nothing to do with my being Catholic)
  2. Actually, with regard to the salad bar…I think I would like to ask you that. Do you think that eating a vegetable is precisely identical to eating an animal? By the same token, do you think that eating a human being is then the same as eating an animal? Why? Why not?
  3. I certainly hop that Christians are all thankful to God for giving them food to eat, such as animals. Hey, did you know that in Korea they eat dogs for food? Are they wrong to do that? Why? Why not?
  4. The sin is in the intent? What do you mean by “intent”, what does “intent” mean?
  5. You wouldn’t kill a vegetable? Have you ever pulled a weed? Have you ever plucked a flower? Have you ever stepped on a bug or squashed a Mosquito? Is it wrong to? Why, why not?
  6. I understand that you would protect a pet with your life if they were threatened…but let me ask you this, suppose that you had to choose between the life of say, myself, and your dog…which would you choose if you could only save one life? Why?
  7. Also you never really answered my question, or any of my previous objections for that matter…are you in fact a vegetarian? If not, do you not see the contradiction that you are in? If God loves animals in the exact way that you say, as if they were people, then how do you think God would feel about you killing and eating a cow, which God (as you say) has created for interpersonal love with himself? The ten commandments tell us to never ever murder another person! But how would it be permissible to kill a cow then? Did you know that cannibalism is a sin? That God does not permit the murder of humans for food? Why then would it be ok to eat another creature created for beatitude with God for food? Also, why did God in the old Testament instruct the Jews to kill animals as sacrifices? Did you know that the Canaanites practiced human sacrifice and that God declared it an abomination in Scripture? Is God schizophrenic or do you think that there is something different about animal and human sacrifice?
 
JCnMe said:
((Stella))… again- you sound naive…animals have souls too and but for the grace of God- you could have been that quail…God Bless
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Actually no, you seem to have a fundamentally confused notion about the nature of the soul. It’s not as if the soul is some ghost that can simply inhabit various corporeal bodies which it utilizes, like a sailor in a ship…if they had had been “born a quail” they actually would not be themselves at all. In truth, our unique incommunicable person, is not separable from our individual body which God has given us. The transmigration of souls and/or the notion that souls only accidently inhabit the body of various species is completely false. If you were born a dog, you would not be you as are now…in fact YOU would actually not exist at all.
 
JkSoren- we have hashed and rehashed your incredibly distorted views of God’s Love… as for your feeble attempt to show animals have a dark side…you don’t have enough pages to give the same coverage to the attrocities humans commit to other humans and animals alike…animals make mistakes-people make choices…the shark did not eat the victim- the bear did not maul the victim…and pets will bite when provoked-and some people should not have pets…there are bad owners- animals are not born bad-they respond or react to how they are treated…I have answered your questions- you just don’t want to accept my answers…that’s your problem
 
SirKnight- show me a Pope that has said they wouldn’t…and as far as the Church-they have not said because they don’t know-but they have canonized Saints who lived for and believed in the blessings of the animals…if that was heresy- they would have been burned or chastised for their beliefs
Let’s suffice it to say that you will never convince me that they don’t because of what I know to be true- and I will never convince you that they will because of what you want to believe is true…God Bless

((((((((Schultzz))))))))) I’ll say it again:blessyou:
 
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