Anne Rice Breaks Up With Christianity via Facebook

[Publisher]

How do you know this is God as opposed to somebody’s nice idea?

I accept the worth of all people. I do not believe Genesis is “history”…it is religious myth to convey truths. God’s creation of male and female…two totally different beings are a declaration of His diversity in creation…it is a celebration. Gay people are part of that creation. I accept that God is revealed through natural means as well as through our sciences. Scientific disiplines…even “soft sciences” seem to indicate that homosexuality is simply a variation…a natural variation of human sexuality…always has been…and as far as I am able to understand in my short lifetime…always will be.

Each of us is operating by “faith” on the matter…the “revelation” which you accept may be at odds with the body of “revelation” I accept…it is a “faith” issue since at this point in time neither of us can “prove” our point…you claim you trust what the church tells you scripture means and what “God’s” design for human sexuality entail…which is based not on current understanding of human sexuality…but writings and flawed understanding 2700 years old.

The sexual “ethic” which your faith tradition has developed begins with a literal reading of Genesis 1-4…I do not accept Gen 1-4 is history…but “myth”…while I would be willing to bet Elaine Pagels isn’t one of your favorite authors…she outlines in her book “The Origin of Satan” how the religious sexual ethic begins with a literal reading of Genesis.

Some of the other beliefs that Christians have embraced are also addressed…but it’s sexual “ethic” is one topic I enjoyed from her book.

I am not at odds with you believing what you believe about gay people…I believe you are wrong…dead wrong…but I accept it as your religious belief…I am at odds with you seeking to bar gay people from civil rights, civil contracts, civil protection of the rights they wish for themselves which “straight” people enjoy by some “divine fiat”. I am for equal protection under the rule of law…not to be governed by others religious beliefs imposed upon a secular society who’s body of evidence compiled so far claims homosexuality as a natural, normal variation of human sexuality.

 

[dontknow]

Who’s Anne Rice?

 

[Publisher]

Who’s Anne Rice?

She is a writer of best selling novels…“Interview With A Vampire”…“Vampire Lestat”…“Queen of the Damned”…“The Witching Hour”. She had a faith crisis several years ago and sought to return to a more “orthodox” religious life…but the restrictions of her religious tradition no longer “spoke to her condition”…and she renounced it on Face Book…thus the hub-bub.

 

[Monica4316]

I don’t believe she…nor I for that matter…have abandoned Eternal Truths…we both cannot blind ourselves to the image of Christ we see in those who are so very different from us…as Ghandi said…“I have no problem with Christ…it is His followers I have problems with.”(paraphrase)

The “leper” she is called to reject in the name of Christ…wears the face of Christ Himself…and THAT she cannot do…I understand her anguish.

I read her “rant” as a prophetic insight she had…the Christ she embraced and believed in is not the same as the church she attended…she could not reject the image of Christ living before her in her son and those marginalized by conservative Christianity…she had to be faithful to His call…“Follow me.”

I believe there is a Buddhist saying…“Once a person has become Enlightened, they cannot become un-enlightended.” She could not blind herself to the image of God in those around her…no matter what her church said.

Would Christ say something contrary to what He said in the Gospels? He said that the sexually immoral will not inherit the Kingdom of God. It doesn’t mean we shouldn’t LOVE all people, but that doesn’t include agreeing with their actions. God loves all but does He agree with sin?? Sin greatly offends Him. God destroyed 2 cities in the Old Testament because of homosexuality… it’s a sin because one of the purposes of sex is to have children. It goes against how God designed the world. Notice I’m talking about the actions here, not same sex attraction, which isn’t the same, if the person doesnt’ consent to it and willingly has lustful thoughts.

I don’t understand how it is “rejecting” someone to recognize that their actions as sinful.

Love without truth is sentimentality, not love…

here’s a great quote by CS Lewis
"the load, or weight, or burden of my neighbour’s glory should be laid daily on my back, a load so heavy that only humility can carry it, and the backs of the proud will be broken. It is a serious thing to live in a society of possible gods and goddesses, to remember that the dullest and most uninteresting person you talk to may one day be a creature which, if you saw it now, you would be strongly tempted to worship, or else a horror and a corruption as you now meet, if at all, only in nightmare. All day long we are, in some degree, helping each other to one or other of these destinations. It is in the light of these overwhelming possibilities, it is with the awe and the circumspection proper to them, that we should conduct all our dealings with one another, all friendships, all loves, all play, all politics.

There are no ordinary people. You have never talked to a mere mortal. Nations, cultures, arts, civilization - these are mortal, and their life is to ours as the life of a gnat. But it is immortals whom we joke with, work with, marry, snub and exploit - immortal horrors or everlasting splendors. This does not mean that we are to be perpetually solemn. We must play. But our merriment must be of that kind (and it is, in fact, the merriest kind) which exists between people who have, from the outset, taken each other seriously - no flippancy, no superiority, no presumption.** And our charity must be a real and costly love, with deep feeling for the sins in spite of which we love the sinner - no mere tolerance or indulgence which parodies love as flippancy parodies merriment**. Next to the Blessed Sacrament itself, your neighbour is the holiest object presented to your senses. If he is your Christian neighbour he is holy in almost the same way, for in him also Christ vere latitat - the glorifier and the glorified, Glory Himself, is truly hidden."

(CS Lewis, Weight of Glory).

 

[mellowcalico]

There are actually seven different sexual orientations:

1. Heterosexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions exclusively for the opposite sex of the appropriate age.
2. Regressed Heterosexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions exclusively for the opposite sex with no regard to age (including children).
3. Bisexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions for both opposite same sex of the appropriate age.
4. Regressed Bisexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions for both opposite same sex with no regard to age (including children).
5. Homosexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions exclusively for the same sex of the appropriate age.
6. Regressed Homosexuality - Sexual feelings, desires, and emotions exclusively for the same sex with no regard to age (including children)
7. Fixated - Sexual feelings desires and emotions exclusively for children with no regard to gender.

I would think asexual should be in that list too… Sexual feelings desires and emotions for no one. Where did the list come from?

 

[Publisher]

B] And our charity must be a real and costly love, with deep feeling for the sins in spite of which we love the sinner - no mere tolerance or indulgence which parodies love as flippancy parodies merriment

. Next to the Blessed Sacrament itself, your neighbour is the holiest object presented to your senses. If he is your Christian neighbour he is holy in almost the same way, for in him also Christ vere latitat - the glorifier and the glorified, Glory Himself, is truly hidden."

(CS Lewis, Weight of Glory).

And here is the crux of our issue…those who hold my position do not believe homosexuality is a sin…at least no more than heterosexuality is…and that homosexuality is a natural variance of human sexuality. Those gay and lesbian men and women who wish to covenant themselves before God and their faith tradition do so with all the blessings of God upon them. The same “sexual ethic” of fidelity, commitment and longevity embrace both.

Gay people should not have to receive “less rights” simply because they have a same-sex relationship as opposed to their straight counterparts.

Since the government is not concerned with religious dogma and beliefs concerning what is “sin” and what is not…equal rights under the rule of secular law should and eventually WILL be extended to same sex couples.

 

[dontknow]

She is a writer of best selling novels…“Interview With A Vampire”…“Vampire Lestat”…“Queen of the Damned”…“The Witching Hour”. She had a faith crisis several years ago and sought to return to a more “orthodox” religious life…but the restrictions of her religious tradition no longer “spoke to her condition”…and she renounced it on Face Book…thus the hub-bub.

Thank you… Never heard of her so I was a little confused with all of the hoopla about her.

I myself think many people have spiritual crisis in life (at the very least) and have ups and downs (in more ways than one).

Unfortunately her position being in the public eye lends her to more people with many, many opinions and this thread is an example of that.

What she doesn’t need is additional bashing - what she needs is spiritual/ religious support & guidance.

Only my opinion and it shouldn’t/doesn’t amount to anything.

 

[1holycatholic]

Publisher:

As a Friend, I do not confine the revelation of God to scripture alone…it is now showing us the worth and humanity of gay people as they are understood NOW as one more variation of how two people of the same sex CAN embody the astounding diversity of God’s creation

How do you know this is God as opposed to somebody’s nice idea?

How do you know the Bible isn’t somebody’s nice idea?

 

[Publisher]

How do you know the Bible isn’t somebody’s nice idea?

The Bible holds a very special place in our Western culture. It is a very human book. It is a partial record of man’s search to understand God…it reflects very human struggles through a span of some 2500 years to define a working understanding of God. It is a partial record of that struggle.

Through it’s pages I am able to see my own struggle in it’s pages to seek to understand the Light which indwells humanity and seeks to make Himself known. The Bible is not perfect…it should be weighed against experience, history, common sense and reason.

 

[AmateurPianist]

How do you know the Bible isn’t somebody’s nice idea?

Can’t prove that it isn’t.

But if I were to believe that it were…

I would be chucking aside 2000 years of common Christianity where everybody (Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox) believes the Bible as God’s word.

I would have no reason to believe in a historical figure Jesus Christ who died on the cross for my sins.

I would end up as the final arbiter of morality and all beliefs of faith. If I like it, then it is good…if not…then I chuck it.

Apparantly this is not a problem for some but for me this is a big problem.

 

[AmateurPianist]

I accept the worth of all people. I do not believe Genesis is “history”…it is religious myth to convey truths. God’s creation of male and female…two totally different beings are a declaration of His diversity in creation…it is a celebration. Gay people are part of that creation. I accept that God is revealed through natural means as well as through our sciences. Scientific disiplines…even “soft sciences” seem to indicate that homosexuality is simply a variation…a natural variation of human sexuality…always has been…and as far as I am able to understand in my short lifetime…always will be.

Each of us is operating by “faith” on the matter…the “revelation” which you accept may be at odds with the body of “revelation” I accept…it is a “faith” issue since at this point in time neither of us can “prove” our point…you claim you trust what the church tells you scripture means and what “God’s” design for human sexuality entail…which is based not on current understanding of human sexuality…but writings and flawed understanding 2700 years old.

The sexual “ethic” which your faith tradition has developed begins with a literal reading of Genesis 1-4…I do not accept Gen 1-4 is history…but “myth”…while I would be willing to bet Elaine Pagels isn’t one of your favorite authors…she outlines in her book “The Origin of Satan” how the religious sexual ethic begins with a literal reading of Genesis.

Some of the other beliefs that Christians have embraced are also addressed…but it’s sexual “ethic” is one topic I enjoyed from her book.

I am not at odds with you believing what you believe about gay people…I believe you are wrong…dead wrong…but I accept it as your religious belief…I am at odds with you seeking to bar gay people from civil rights, civil contracts, civil protection of the rights they wish for themselves which “straight” people enjoy by some “divine fiat”. I am for equal protection under the rule of law…not to be governed by others religious beliefs imposed upon a secular society who’s body of evidence compiled so far claims homosexuality as a natural, normal variation of human sexuality.

But you are not asnswering my question. How do you know this is all not somebody’s nice idea?

 

[Publisher]

But you are not asnswering my question. How do you know this is all not somebody’s nice idea?

How do you know that what you believe isn’t someone’s “nice ideas” as well? Are you asking about “gnosis” as in “know inwardly” or “know” as in “fact based knowledge”?

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

That’s odd. Christians believe that they are created male and female in the image and likeness of God.

Stranger still is Christ establishing one and only one Church, the Catholic Church. Perhaps you’ve heard of it, or of a very popular book that proceeds from the Catholic Church called the Bible.

Amen.

Will Rice’s next book be titled ‘Bill and Ted The Vampires Excellent Adventures Against The Mean Ol’ Catholic Church?’

 

[1holycatholic]

Can’t prove that it isn’t.

But if I were to believe that it were…

I would be chucking aside 2000 years of common Christianity where everybody (Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox) believes the Bible as God’s word.

The Church existed for many years before one word of what would become the New Testament was written down. What constitutes the Bible wasn’t infallibly defined by the Church until ~350 years after Christ.

In any case Protestants removed and reject parts of the Bible that they disagree with. That’s hardly common Christianity.

 

[1holycatholic]

I would end up as the final arbiter of morality and all beliefs of faith. If I like it, then it is good…if not…then I chuck it.

Seven books of the Bible were “chucked” by Protestants.

Q.E.D.

 

[Eklecktika]

A great book concerning the “ex-gay movement” is “Anything But Straight”…the “ex-gay” poster boy and the founders of Exodus Int’l…“reverted”…the book is an expose on the movement.

With sufficient motivation a person with “bi-sexual” orientation CAN live a reasonably happy life with an opposite sex partner…but sexual orientation IS fixed and cannot be changed…whether through prayer…“miracles”…chanting…or “therapy”…it is set in stone.

Are you seriously stating that bisexual individuals can’t be truly happy unless they have multiple partners?

You condemn ‘conservative christians’ for bias, yet how biased is it of you make the statement that they just can’t help it? Victimizing a group of people where no real disability exists is not a kindness.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

[/INDENT]
I understand completely. Christianity has devolved into three things: “Go To Church, Don’t Have Sex, and Vote Republican”.

More lies about both the Church and conservatism.

My prayer is that at least some people will see these blatant lies for what they are.

 

[Publisher]

Are you seriously stating that bisexual individuals can’t be truly happy unless they have multiple partners?

You condemn ‘conservative christians’ for bias, yet how biased is it of you make the statement that they just can’t help it? Victimizing a group of people where no real disability exists is not a kindness.

Ummm…no…I stated no such conclusion. Sorry.

 

[PaulDupre]

Amen.

Will Rice’s next book be titled ‘Bill and Ted The Vampires Excellent Adventures Against The Mean Ol’ Catholic Church?’

I hear she is working on a trilogy of books about angels. That should be interesting. I very much enjoy her work.

 

[Eklecktika]

With sufficient motivation a person with “bi-sexual” orientation CAN live a reasonably happy life with an opposite sex partner.

Then, pray tell, what is the purpose of this sentence?

Are not feelings of lust, feelings of lust? If you’re married, and those feelings sprout up regarding someone you aren’t married to, you quash them. End of story.You know, forsaking all others, and all that.

What’s remarkable about it? It’s called committment.