Anti-abortion protest signs - how far is too far?

[legeorge]

jess7396:

BTW- the idea proposed by a previous poster about a bus with ultrasound images and the heartbeat blaring, complete with sidewalk counselors—THAT is one of the best ideas I have heard in a very long time. I hope someone takes that and runs with it. You should contact ALL and other groups about this.

**That IS a great idea!! ** I loved it too!
I am also inspired to take my kids’ ultrasound pictures and have them put on t-shirts for them to wear. Or maybe put them on signs next to pictures of them now. Kind of like a “before and after” thing.

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Dawn, in reply to your Post #20:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=576887&postcount=20

I started crying from the first paragraph of your post, and I’m still crying as I type this. “I can feel your pain,” sounds like such a trite thing for me to say, but I do think I have some idea of just how much you hurt.

I know that this is now 8 days later, but I do hope that you’re still reading this thread, because I would like to see what, if anything, I can fdo to help.

Your pain has only one answer, and that is the love and forgiveness of God. Please, come on in, because the Church is a hospital for wounded, sick and hurting souls. Please, be baptized (if you haven’t already been) and find yourself a good priest, and tell him what you told us.

This is why, God promises that, if we confess our sins in His operating room (that’s what the confessional is), that He will begin to take away the pain and shame of the sins that we have committed (both of ours):

Fear not, you shall not be put to shame; you need not blush, for you shall not be disgraced.The shame of your youth you shall forget, the reproach of your widowhood no longer remember. For he who has become your husband is your Maker; his name is the LORD of hosts; Your redeemer is the Holy One of Israel, called God of all the earth…Though the mountains leave their place and the hills be shaken, My love shall never leave you nor my covenant of peace be shaken, says the LORD, who has mercy on you.

Isaiah 54: 4, 5 & 10. NAB

You see, Dawn, I was GONE for 20+ years, and during that time, I probably did more damage than your “Fiancee”, just not in the way he did.

So, please, become a Catholic, and please see your priest a few times about this. I can tell you from personal experience that it’s not going to be easy, but that that promise from the Book of Isaiah will be fulfilled.

The LORD bless you and keep you!
The LORD let his face shine upon you, and be gracious to you! The LORD look upon you kindly and give you peace!
Numbers 6:24-26. NAB

Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Shinobu:

Does this mean we should also show children of explicit sexual acts because it is part of the “real world”? Should we also show them images of crime scenes because it is the “real world”?

Don’t you think this is up to the parents when and how such things will be revealed?

Shinobu:

The generation right after the WW II was forced to see firms of the Holocaust and the attrocities of the Empire of Japan from 1945 up to the 1960’s. For children to avoid seeing the films, their parents had to sign slips to get them out of class on those days.

In the 1960’s, that was changed because some parents obhjected, so the films couldn’t be shown to children without their parents’ written permission.,

Now, they don’t show the films at all. Yet, the local High School Counsellor can take your daughter off to have an abortion during school hours, WITHOUT YOU EVER KNOWING ABOUT IT! and, If you call while she’s gone, THEY DON’T EVEN HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT SHE’S GONE!

Now, there was a dictator who slaughter some 3 million people over the last 25 years, some 700,000+ of whom (many of them children) he had TORTURED AND RAPED TO DEATH, and yet the guy who wanted to depose him was the one the activists called a NAZI!

I DON’T CALL THAT PROGRESS!! I CALL THAT DEGRESS!

The people who hated the films of the Holocaust are the same ones calling Bush a NAZI, and the people who don’t want us to use the graphic imagery showing what abortions kill are the same ones who will take your daughters to the Abortion mills without you even being informed, let aloneonly doing it with your permission!

They’re relying on our naivete and our squeemishness!

If you want to live in a world where you don’t have to see those pictures, then go to the following thread and see what you can do to halp get the Democrats to stop requiring that judges pass a PRO ABORTION litmus test before they’ll let them have a vote:

End Pro-Abortion Litmus Test
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=50594

Otherwise, so long as Roe v. Wade is the law of the land, we’ll need to use those blasted signs.

Blessings and Peace, Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

CatholicPoet:

Well said. There is plenty that is ugly in the world. Most likely, more converts will be won with what is beautiful and true.

Catholic Poet:

I would agree with you except for a few problems - Both Senators Kerry and Reid claim that they believe that life starts at Conception, and yet they not only support Roe v. wade, they’re ringleaders in the Democratic effort to require a Dogmatic Pro-Abortion litmus Test on ALL Appointments to the Federal Appeals Bench, and they plan to do the same for ALL apointees to the Supreme Court.

Even I had forgotten just how truly human 7 to 11 week old fetuses are until I saw them on the Priests for Life Website:

priestsforlife.org/resources/photosbyage/index.htm

So long as Roe v. Wade is the law of the land, and Pro-Life means you can behave like Senators Kerry, Reid and McCain (don’t let the MSM fool you on this one - He’s just handed the forces of DEATH a huge victory), I think that wqe’re going to have to use the signs rto combat the misinformation and the apathy that are both so much what the other side is relying on.

Blessingws and Peace, Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

TheGarg:

Ill be happy to send you some if you wish, they look exactly like babies, cause they are babies. and even though they are in pieces, you can still tell they are babies…just got to google, click images, and type in abortion or aborted babies and you will get plenty of nightmares.

Garg:

If we can get every women who’s thinking about having an abotyion, or every man who’s forcing his girfriend to have one, to read the following story, posted here, I bet we’d see see a LOT fewer abortions:

SUNRISEDAWN - Post # 20
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=576887&postcount=20

Believe it or not, Priests for Life has several women counsellors who’ve gone through what Dawn has gone through.

If we can get these women to hear stories like Dawn’s, so that they know that Abortion isn’t the end but only the begininning of the pain, we might be able to save a few lives and stop a few women from experiencing the pain that Dawn is going through.

To do that, we’ll have to show that we care more about them than the people in the clinics do. That shouldn’t be too hard, 20 years ago, I and another “Protestor” picked a woman off the ground and helped her “boyfriend” put her in their car after they had just walked out of a abortion clinic after she had an abortion. NO one from the clinic helped, or even bothered to ask if she was OK, even though it was IN their parking LOT, right in front of the main entrance to the clinic, and she had just had the abortion.

Obviously we need to talk more about the resources to back up that caring on another thread. But they have to be there, because, “Mercy is more powerful than Shame.”

Blessings and Peace, Michael

 

[SUNRISEDAWN]

Michael, thank you so much for caring. And thanks to all the others that cared too. There is alot love here, I can feel it.

Someone in this thread asked what happened after. (i forgot who, sorry) I did marry that guy. We last for four years. When we got married I want a baby right away. I guess I was one of those that wanted the replacement babies. But you don’t see that at the time. It took nine months to get pregnant. I had a healthy baby girl June 19, 1987. I loved this baby. She never filled that empty soft I thought she would. That was bad to start off a mother and child relationship like that. We did ok til New Years eve 1990 to1991, when I husband told me I am leaving you. I asked him how could you leave me, I KILLED for you. He had no shame in his heart for that. But I did. This was a shock to me cause I did not know our marriage was in trouble. He left us for his secretary and her daughter. I say he left her too cause when he was suppose to come get her on her visits he never showed up and she would be sitting in the window waiting and not loosing faith that her daddy loved her. Her hope fadded over the years and now she wants nothing to do with him but now he wants her. She don’t want to hear it.
I have remarried to a great guy that adopted my daughter and we have had two more children. I have a 17 year old daughter, Jessica. An 8 year old son, Jonathan and a 3 year old daughter Jennifer. All three healthy thanking GOD.
In between my son and younger daughter I had a miscarriage. This is what broke me down. I went into a depression so bad it was two months before I come out of my house. I lost my job. I thought GOD was punishing me for killing my first baby. I know better now. I would not give up on that baby or that GOD would let the baby live. I put myself in danger because of what I had been through with the abortion. I was bleeding for two weeks, and then one night I was hemorrhage serverly. The baby would not detatch from me. And I lived 45 minutes away from the hospitol. I had lost so must blood when I got there. I was pale and very weak. The doctor still had to talk me into taking the baby out. I was so thrown back to what I went through with me first baby I just want to die with this one. I could not kill another. I will just have to die too. My poor husband was crying was trying to talk some since into me. And then I relaxed and prayed. I knew I still had two babies at home that needed me. When the doctor took out the baby, I quit bleeding. He told me there was nothing left of the baby, but that I gave it every chance possible to live. I was ok for a couple of days and then it hit me. The depression was all over me. I was not a good mother or wife.
It took three months of darkness to go to a councelor. He did help me and we planned a service for both of my babies. They even made a certificate saying that these babies are being given over to GOD. I had to name them. My first baby’s name is Emerald and my fourth baby’s name is Sapphire. I named them this cause those were the months they were suppose to be born in. And they are GOD’s little jewels.

I will be glad to answer any questions. Especially if it will help stop another murder.

Dawn

 

[Zooey]

TheGarg:

Ill be happy to send you some if you wish, they look exactly like babies, cause they are babies. and even though they are in pieces, you can still tell they are babies…just got to google, click images, and type in abortion or aborted babies and you will get plenty of nightmares.

I know they are babies. I don’t need any more nightmares thasn I have all ready. BTW,we are both on the same side here, in case you had misunderstood me.
I got the book out again, & looked at the pictures . I stand by my statement, which needs to be read in context. The least convincing [pictures] are so bloody that they do not look like babies.The most convincing look like babies. Dead babies, but clearly babies.
The problem is that we have to remember that the lie being told is “just a blob of tissue”. Showing pictures that cannot be easily identified is NOT a helpful tactic. One of the problems that I find in some right to life people, is that there are those who seem to want to be right more than they want to stop abortion.
This is not a …]ing contest. This is a matter of life & death. 4000 children die every day. This is too important an issue to waste our energies on going for shock value at the expense of children’s lives.
God bless.

 

[Zooey]

**That IS a great idea!! **I loved it too!
I am also inspired to take my kids’ ultrasound pictures and have them put on t-shirts for them to wear. Or maybe put them on signs next to pictures of them now. Kind of like a “before and after” thing.

:clapping: :clapping: :clapping:

 

[Zooey]

SUNRISEDAWN:

Michael, thank you so much for caring. And thanks to all the others that cared too. There is alot love here, I can feel it.

Someone in this thread asked what happened after. (i forgot who, sorry) I did marry that guy. We last for four years. When we got married I want a baby right away. I guess I was one of those that wanted the replacement babies. But you don’t see that at the time. It took nine months to get pregnant. I had a healthy baby girl June 19, 1987. I loved this baby. She never filled that empty soft I thought she would. That was bad to start off a mother and child relationship like that. We did ok til New Years eve 1990 to1991, when I husband told me I am leaving you. I asked him how could you leave me, I KILLED for you. He had no shame in his heart for that. But I did. This was a shock to me cause I did not know our marriage was in trouble. He left us for his secretary and her daughter. I say he left her too cause when he was suppose to come get her on her visits he never showed up and she would be sitting in the window waiting and not loosing faith that her daddy loved her. Her hope fadded over the years and now she wants nothing to do with him but now he wants her. She don’t want to hear it.
I have remarried to a great guy that adopted my daughter and we have had two more children. I have a 17 year old daughter, Jessica. An 8 year old son, Jonathan and a 3 year old daughter Jennifer. All three healthy thanking GOD.
In between my son and younger daughter I had a miscarriage. This is what broke me down. I went into a depression so bad it was two months before I come out of my house. I lost my job. I thought GOD was punishing me for killing my first baby. I know better now. I would not give up on that baby or that GOD would let the baby live. I put myself in danger because of what I had been through with the abortion. I was bleeding for two weeks, and then one night I was hemorrhage serverly. The baby would not detatch from me. And I lived 45 minutes away from the hospitol. I had lost so must blood when I got there. I was pale and very weak. The doctor still had to talk me into taking the baby out. I was so thrown back to what I went through with me first baby I just want to die with this one. I could not kill another. I will just have to die too. My poor husband was crying was trying to talk some since into me. And then I relaxed and prayed. I knew I still had two babies at home that needed me. When the doctor took out the baby, I quit bleeding. He told me there was nothing left of the baby, but that I gave it every chance possible to live. I was ok for a couple of days and then it hit me. The depression was all over me. I was not a good mother or wife.
It took three months of darkness to go to a councelor. He did help me and we planned a service for both of my babies. They even made a certificate saying that these babies are being given over to GOD. I had to name them. My first baby’s name is Emerald and my fourth baby’s name is Sapphire. I named them this cause those were the months they were suppose to be born in. And they are GOD’s little jewels.

I will be glad to answer any questions. Especially if it will help stop another murder.

Dawn

Dawn, your story is so important. I am so glad that you are speaking out. There are so many women who suffer in silence. God bless you. You are in my prayers.

 

[Pisio]

mommy:

I If you are too “in your face” you can come off as a wacko.

Like Jesus?

He was pretty in your face to those in charge, and He was not exactly too private either… Do you think when He was calling the Pharisees a brood of vipers and whitewashed tombs there were parents with small children present?

Truth is hard, better you be forced to talk to your child about it at an early age then to let their schools do it before they are ready… Praise God that He is forcing your hand at parenting…

Peace be with you,

Pisio

 

[chicago]

*pro-life_teen*:

I have thought about this a lot, and have organized a few Face the Truth tours in my city. We have signs that warn people about the graphic nature of our signs and you know what?

Ah, the Pro-Life Action League model. They really are the experts at this. For they understand how the effective tactics of such presentations must be carried out and have designed their program extremely well. They always include a warning sign before the actual display. So anyone who wants to turn away before seeing them has that opportunity. They follow this up with life affirming pictures of born babies. Eventually, you get to the pictures of aborted children which are repeated signigantly to impress the image upon you. Further, they hand out literature at such displays. And it works. Conversions to the pro-life cause are often made and women have changed their minds about aborting their children. Their demonstration displays are not usually centered around an abortion clinic location, incidently, but rather center around places where there is much traffic either on foot or vehicular. As pro-life_teen has pointed out, they answer all of the usual objections quite well. I understand that Joe Schieldler, head of PLAL and something of the father of the pro-life movement, let his children see this pictures from a very young age.

prolifeaction.org/facethetruth/

They also have a video about this work:

myfaith.com/Face-The-Truth-DU.ram

 

[jess7396]

chicago:

Ah, the Pro-Life Action League model. They really are the experts at this. For they understand how the effective tactics of such presentations must be carried out and have designed their program extremely well. They always include a warning sign before the actual display. So anyone who wants to turn away before seeing them has that opportunity. They follow this up with life affirming pictures of born babies. Eventually, you get to the pictures of aborted children which are repeated signigantly to impress the image upon you. Further, they hand out literature at such displays. And it works. Conversions to the pro-life cause are often made and women have changed their minds about aborting their children. Their demonstration displays are not usually centered around an abortion clinic location, incidently, but rather center around places where there is much traffic either on foot or vehicular. As pro-life_teen has pointed out, they answer all of the usual objections quite well. I understand that Joe Schieldler, head of PLAL and something of the father of the pro-life movement, let his children see this pictures from a very young age.

prolifeaction.org/facethetruth/

They also have a video about this work:

myfaith.com/Face-The-Truth-DU.ram

Just wanted to say that I have no problem with the display described here, it has the necessary ingredient of warning people, so that small children should not be exposed. I think Joe Scheidler is a wonderful man, so true to the cause! I have had the pleasure of meeting him and hearing him speak, he is such an inspiration.

 

[princz23]

But I do think the right to life movement has to be careful not to alienate those who would otherwise be on their side. If you are too “in your face” you can come off as a wacko. There is probably a good balance here somewhere, but you want to make sure your message gets to the right people. And I think young children who don’t understand it isn’t the target audience.

If posters such as this alienate people, they were never really on the side of life anyway, IMHO. They may want to give lip service to it, but they are not doing anything to promote life if they can be so easily alienated. Its not like it is something you can say, “well, you made me mad with your signs, so now I believe in killing babies”. Murder is murder. No, I would not like my children seeing it, but not because the pro-life people are doing something wrong, but because the 4000 parents everyday are doing something wrong by murdering their innocent children.

I too believe in protecting their innocence. I have prayed about this because a friend was upset with posters such as these at our barbeque festival. Her four year old daughter was with them. After praying about it extensively, I felt God told me that however horrifying the posters may be, the act of abortion is a 1000 more times horrifying and we must go to whatever lengths and whatever works to stop it.

For some, it will take this information, for others more of changing hearts. That is my humble opinion.

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Dawn:

You’re welcome.

SUNRISEDAWN:

Michael, thank you so much for caring. And thanks to all the others that cared too. There is alot love here, I can feel it.

Someone in this thread asked what happened after. (i forgot who, sorry) I did marry that guy. We last for four years. When we got married I want a baby right away. I guess I was one of those that wanted the replacement babies. But you don’t see that at the time. It took nine months to get pregnant. I had a healthy baby girl June 19, 1987. I loved this baby. She never filled that empty soft I thought she would. That was bad to start off a mother and child relationship like that. We did ok til New Years eve 1990 to1991, when I husband told me I am leaving you. I asked him how could you leave me, I KILLED for you. He had no shame in his heart for that. But I did. This was a shock to me cause I did not know our marriage was in trouble. He left us for his secretary and her daughter. I say he left her too cause when he was suppose to come get her on her visits he never showed up and she would be sitting in the window waiting and not loosing faith that her daddy loved her. Her hope fadded over the years and now she wants nothing to do with him but now he wants her. She don’t want to hear it.
I have remarried to a great guy that adopted my daughter and we have had two more children. I have a 17 year old daughter, Jessica. An 8 year old son, Jonathan and a 3 year old daughter Jennifer. All three healthy thanking GOD.
In between my son and younger daughter I had a miscarriage. This is what broke me down. I went into a depression so bad it was two months before I come out of my house. I lost my job. I thought GOD was punishing me for killing my first baby. I know better now. I would not give up on that baby or that GOD would let the baby live. I put myself in danger because of what I had been through with the abortion. I was bleeding for two weeks, and then one night I was hemorrhage serverly. The baby would not detatch from me. And I lived 45 minutes away from the hospitol. I had lost so must blood when I got there. I was pale and very weak. The doctor still had to talk me into taking the baby out. I was so thrown back to what I went through with me first baby I just want to die with this one. I could not kill another. I will just have to die too. My poor husband was crying was trying to talk some since into me. And then I relaxed and prayed. I knew I still had two babies at home that needed me. When the doctor took out the baby, I quit bleeding. He told me there was nothing left of the baby, but that I gave it every chance possible to live. I was ok for a couple of days and then it hit me. The depression was all over me. I was not a good mother or wife.
It took three months of darkness to go to a councelor. He did help me and we planned a service for both of my babies. They even made a certificate saying that these babies are being given over to GOD. I had to name them. My first baby’s name is Emerald and my fourth baby’s name is Sapphire. I named them this cause those were the months they were suppose to be born in. And they are GOD’s little jewels.

I will be glad to answer any questions. Especially if it will help stop another murder.

Dawn

Dawn, I would want to know that you’re ok and that you’re whole BEFORE you start answering those questions. The Pro-Death people will try every nasty trick they can think of (The have on Ms. McCarvey, the Jane Roe of Roe v. Wade), and then they’ll publicize and celebrate when they get to you.

I’m sure that at least some of the people working the clinics aren’t like this, but the people defending the industry are as nasty and rotten as they come.

So, I want to make sure that you’re whole BEFORE you start speaking and answering questions.

If you read the part of the scripture, that I didn’t quote, you’ll see that “Sapphires”, “Emeralds” and other precious stones are included in the construction of the City of God:

Isaiah 54: 11-13
vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__PP1.HTM

Revelation 21: 10-21
vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__P134.HTM

May God bless you and grant you the desires of you heart, Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Princz23,

When push comes to shove, I don’t think there’s a NICE way to tell people that they’re myurdering babies…I was shocked when I heard John Kerry answer the Pro-Life person in the 2nd debate that he believed tha life began at conception but that it wasn’t going to effect his vote! IOW, the hypocrite KNEW they were murdering babies and was going to do absolutely nothing to stop it!

princz23:

If posters such as this alienate people, they were never really on the side of life anyway, IMHO. They may want to give lip service to it, but they are not doing anything to promote life if they can be so easily alienated. Its not like it is something you can say, “well, you made me mad with your signs, so now I believe in killing babies”. Murder is murder. No, I would not like my children seeing it, but not because the pro-life people are doing something wrong, but because the 4000 parents everyday are doing something wrong by murdering their innocent children.

I too believe in protecting their innocence. I have prayed about this because a friend was upset with posters such as these at our barbeque festival. Her four year old daughter was with them. After praying about it extensively, I felt God told me that however horrifying the posters may be, the act of abortion is a 1000 more times horrifying and we must go to whatever lengths and whatever works to stop it.

For some, it will take this information, for others more of changing hearts. That is my humble opinion.

The worse part of that whole debate is that 10 nominees to the Federal Bench have been filibustered by Democrats in the Senate over the last 2 years acting at the behest of Pro-Death activist organizations. I heard the heads of these organizatins, and they will make sure, if they succeed this year, that NO nominee who might oppose ANY provision of Roe v. Wade or support ANY limits on a woman’s right to murder her baby in the womb will even get a vote on the floor of the Senate.

If you’re tired of debating signs, and you believe that judges who oppose the leftest “orthodoxy” of Roe v. Wade should have a chance to serve on the Federal Bench, GO HERE

Re: End Pro-Abortion Litmus Test
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=597164#post597164

and follow the directions, and then tell your friends and fellow posters to do the same!

How much longer do you think God is going to listen to the cries of 4,000 children being murdered each day before he decides enough is enough??

Blessings and Peace, Michael

 

[Mom_of_one]

SunriseDawn…:crying: :crying: :crying: My heart is broken for you and for all those who have had abortions.

 

[SUNRISEDAWN]

Trying to put the certificate up here.
Dawn

 

[coralewisjr]

Tom444:

Yesterday, some friends and I drove past a pro-life protest on Forbes Avenue by Magee-Womens Hospital in Pittsburgh. Normally, I agree with such protests, but in this case, most of the protesters were holding huge (3 to 4 feet high) full-color photographs of aborted fetuses. While I can appreciate their motive of wanting to show the reality of abortion, I’m not sure whether this is really an appropriate way to do so. They weren’t even on the sidewalks outside the hospital (the building is actually on a side street), but right on one of the busiest roads in the city on a Sunday afternoon. My biggest reservation about this is that families with young children will also see these extremely graphic pictures. Overall, I’m not sure whether or not this is an appropriate means of protest. What does everybody else think?

I understand your reservation regarding young children. I hope that if my preborn child ever sees one of those signs and asks about it, DH and I will explain it well. I think that if the abortion clinics won’t tell the mothers what’s going on, we need to show them with pictures and pray for them.

 

[Monica02]

The graphic signs are the most effective means of educating people on the truth of abortion. I have participated in countless demonstrations with these images. The very fact that people react in the extreme is an indication that the signs are very effective. My experience has been that children do not get upset, but are very curious. More often than not very young children do not even notice the signs. The older kids ask lots of questions. We are planning to start a campaign to hold signs outside of high and juiniour high schools.

I do not hold graphic images outside of the clinics because I have heard that they are not effective in stopping ladies or girls from going in. At that point they are more concerned with themselves, so offering any assistence to them seems to be the most logical thing to do.

 

[SUNRISEDAWN]

I saw a really cool bumper sticker today. It read, You can’t be Catholic and Pro Abortion. That is really to the point.

Dawn