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brb3
Guest
I was told that Quakers sit in church in silence. Is there no preaching of gospel or singing of song ? What in scripture forms the basis for the Quaker concept of worship.
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MyzTek
Guest
While some Quakers do have their “unprogrammed” meeting for worship without a preacher with a planned message, sitting in (mostly) silent waiting on the Spirit, this is not universal among the Friends. I was raised in “programmed” Quaker meetings, meaning they had a preacher who brought a sermon (usually my dad). At the Quaker meetings that I have been to which don’t have a preacher, the period of silent waiting on the spirit was always preceeded by prayer and singing of hymns or music played by members. Even in Friends’ Meetings with a pastor, like the ones I grew up in, a period is set aside for silent waiting on the Spirit.
The best Bible reference I can give you on this Quaker practice is John 1:9: “That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.” Just as the Catholic faith doesn’t condemn any one person specifically to hell because as far as we know even a person who never heard of Rome, Jesus, or the Church may have responded to the grace extended to them by God to the extent they were able to accept it, Quakers believe that the “Light of Christ” is given to every human, if they will but listen for it. Thus in the Quaker view, all have ready access to our Lord and Savior, through the Holy Spirit, so a message given to the lowliest member of the congregation may be no less important than that brought by the preacher (should the meeting have one).
Hope this helps a little, if I think of any other verses or anything I’ll let you know here
The best Bible reference I can give you on this Quaker practice is John 1:9: “That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.” Just as the Catholic faith doesn’t condemn any one person specifically to hell because as far as we know even a person who never heard of Rome, Jesus, or the Church may have responded to the grace extended to them by God to the extent they were able to accept it, Quakers believe that the “Light of Christ” is given to every human, if they will but listen for it. Thus in the Quaker view, all have ready access to our Lord and Savior, through the Holy Spirit, so a message given to the lowliest member of the congregation may be no less important than that brought by the preacher (should the meeting have one).
Hope this helps a little, if I think of any other verses or anything I’ll let you know here
S
SebastianRocco
Guest
I am not Quaker, but my sister is. We were raised baptist, but when my sister married, her husband who was nonreligous, but believed in some sort of God, she became Quaker. My brother-in-law did not want to be preached to, so they chose a meeting house to raise their family in. I have gone with her a few times over the last 30 years, including one Easter morning. My limited experience has been, there was no homily, no choir, no readings, no creeds. Whenever anyone felt moved to say something, they stood and spoke. Most of the time everyone just sat in silence. One of the things my sister & her husband like there is that you can believe what ever you want and be accepted.
P
Publisher
Guest
Un-programmed Friends so not use a paid clergy. Each of us is “priest and minister”. We “do not sit in church”…“The church sits in silence awaiting direction from the Lord.” is a better way of stating how we worhsip.
We sit and wait upon the Lord to speak to us directly or through another Friend who is led to offer “vocal ministry.” This may be a commentary upon a scripture…or statement of an early Friend…or an exhortation which the Friend feels led to give concerning social justice, simplicity of life or speak of a “concern” that has been laid upon them that they feel led to share.
One Friend may be led to lead the meeting in song…or prayer. In some of our Meetings there is a “song time” before Meeting or afterwards to any who wish to participate.
Ephesians 5:19
Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
Ephesians 5:18-20 (in Context) Ephesians 5 (Whole Chapter)
Colossians 3:16
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord." are a couple passages.
There are also “Programmed” meetings…usually they use the designation “Friends Church” instead of “Society of Friends”. These Friends do employ a paid clergy and their service usually has a time of “Silent Waiting”…their worship services usually follow a nominal Evangelical format.
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BrianH
Guest
1Cr 14:26 Well, my brothers and sisters, let’s summarize what I am saying. When you meet, one will sing, another will teach, another will tell some special revelation God has given, one will speak in an unknown language, while another will interpret what is said. But everything that is done must be useful to all and build them up in the Lord.
1Cr 14:27 No more than two or three should speak in an unknown language. They must speak one at a time, and someone must be ready to interpret what they are saying.
1Cr 14:28 But if no one is present who can interpret, they must be silent in your church meeting and speak in tongues to God privately.
1Cr 14:29 Let two or three prophesy, and let the others evaluate what is said.
1Cr 14:30 But if someone is prophesying and another person receives a revelation from the Lord, the one who is speaking must stop.
1Cr 14:31 In this way, all who prophesy will have a turn to speak, one after the other, so that everyone will learn and be encouraged.
1Cr 14:32 Remember that people who prophesy are in control of their spirit and can wait their turn.
1Cr 14:33 For God is not a God of disorder but of peace, as in all the other churches.*
1Cr 14:27 No more than two or three should speak in an unknown language. They must speak one at a time, and someone must be ready to interpret what they are saying.
1Cr 14:28 But if no one is present who can interpret, they must be silent in your church meeting and speak in tongues to God privately.
1Cr 14:29 Let two or three prophesy, and let the others evaluate what is said.
1Cr 14:30 But if someone is prophesying and another person receives a revelation from the Lord, the one who is speaking must stop.
1Cr 14:31 In this way, all who prophesy will have a turn to speak, one after the other, so that everyone will learn and be encouraged.
1Cr 14:32 Remember that people who prophesy are in control of their spirit and can wait their turn.
1Cr 14:33 For God is not a God of disorder but of peace, as in all the other churches.*
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anode
Guest
I find Quaker Meeting very peaceful and refreshing.
As a funny aside, I have a good friend who is a Quaker, and she reports that what you ‘save’ by not supporting a pastor, you spend in meetings! Apparently, according to a (apocryphal?) story, a Quaker met a prominent Catholic religious leader (pope?) introduced herself, and the dignitary responded: “Oh my goodness! ALL those meetings!”
As a funny aside, I have a good friend who is a Quaker, and she reports that what you ‘save’ by not supporting a pastor, you spend in meetings! Apparently, according to a (apocryphal?) story, a Quaker met a prominent Catholic religious leader (pope?) introduced herself, and the dignitary responded: “Oh my goodness! ALL those meetings!”
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Publisher
Guest
Yep, we meet at the drop of a hat. “Meeting for Worship”, “Meeting for Worship for Business”, “Memorial Meeting for Worship”, "Meeting for Worship for Marriage’, “Clearness Meeting”, “Comittee Meeting”, “Prepatory Meeting”, “Monthy Meeting”, “Quarterly Meeting”, “Yearly Meeting”, “Friends United Meeting”…the church meets for every decision that will affect the Meeting as a whole.
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brb3
Guest
Richard Nixon was a Quaker … was he not ?
Quakers played a prominent role in the Early English Colonies. Are the Quakers growing in #'s ? Do they evangelize, or is the faith mainly transfered to the children, etc.
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Publisher
Guest
Yes Richard Nixon was raised a Friend…I believe he had his membership at Wittier Friends Meeting in So. Cal.
The Evangelical Friends are growinig…especially in some African nations and among the Amayras in South America whre they have missions…the majority of Friends now live outside the Untited States.
Unprogrammed Friends are growing…but very slowly…here in the United States, but no formal proselytizing occurs…except by ‘word of mouth’. The meetings in the east seem to be declining some…but those independent meetings in the west and northwest have had a steady growth…slow growth…for the last 25 years or so. The Meeting I attend has gone from 1 to 2 meetings for worship…and has sponsored two or three Prepatory Meetings(a meeting that is overseen by the sponoring Monthy Meeting)…one of them is a Monthly Meeting now with their own oversight and steadily growing and may soon seek to buy their own meeting house…right now they rent a space in a private school.
At PSU there is a weekday meeting for worship for the students and those in the community who wish to attend.
Friends record the births that occur among their members and each child is treated a “full members” in the Society of Friends. They are sometimes designated as “Associate Friends”…they are given religious instruction through out childhood and when they reach 18 years of age(or there abouts) they are able to petition to become formal members of the Meeting.
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CMatt25
Guest
Do unprogrammed and programmed meetings share the same beliefs?
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Publisher
Guest
“Yes” and “no”…most “programmed” meetings use the term “Friend’s Church” instead of “Society of Friends”. Those Friends with “pastoral” leadership tend to be much more conservative in their beliefs…usually…but not always…embracing a more “evangelical” theology. “Programmed” Friends are usually…but not always…part of “Evangelical Friends International”.
Some “programmed” meetings are part of “Friends United Meeting” and have a much more moderate to “liberal” theological slant…Philip Gulley and James Mulholland, authors of “If Grace is True” and “If God is Love” are Friend’s pastors and while holding to a more “conservative” theology…are “universailists” and believe that eventually God will reconcile all of creation to Himself through Christ.
“Friends United Meeting” also has “unprogrammed” meetings under it’s care…these tend to be more “Christocentric” meetings employing a more conservative theology.
“Friends General Conference” and Independent Friends meetings tend to be somewhat liberal in theology. Since Friends have no creed and believe that the Light of Christ or “that of God” indwells each and every human being and seeks to make Himself known to each of us…and where we are along the “spectrum” of our “Journey” is usually reflected in our theological expressions is seen in many of the Meetings.
The meeting I attend uses very “Christian” language…but we range from “unitarian” to “trinitarian” in theology…and fairly “conservative” to “liberal” in expression. Most of us use “biblical” language in expressing our theological expressions…but there are a few Friends who tend to use a more “panentheistic” language in their religious expression.
There are even some Friends who profess to be agnostic but accept the principle of the “divine spark” within each of us. Friends don’t emply a “creed” to speak of our faith…our faith is “experiential”…each of us is called to take responsibility for our own spiritual growth. It is the goal of each meeting to foster that spiritual growth. In my own particular meeting I have known Friends who joined as “pagan” and over time through the life of the meeting became “Christian” in their expression.
God meets each of us where we are…one doesn’t need to have a “well formed theology” to experience the grace of God through Christ in our lives…“mustard seed faith” is honored by God…“Lord I believe…help my unbelief” is a phrase echoed in scripture most of us can relate to.
All Friends, from all our varied organizations, come together and work on social issues as well as humanitarian work through the “American Friends Service Committe” and “Friends Committe on National Legislation”.
Some “unprogrammed meetings” share a meetinghouse with a “programmed” meeting…some “programmed meetings” have their worship service at 10:00 and then those who wish to attend a more “traditional” Meeting for Worship may do so the next hour…there is sometimes a time of singing in between “meetings” to act as transition.
Our differneces are a strength we believe.
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brb3
Guest
True … at our first faith and conversion. But, thereafter, we have an absolute expectation to grow in knowledge and wisdom, per instruction of scriptures and Church.
The Church Christ gave to the first century Christians … is the pattern we need to conform to. This worship experience is clearly described in the Epistles, Revelation, and by the writings of Early Church Fathers.
Do Quakers see the necessity to conform their ‘worship experience’ to the Church Christ established ? If not, why not ?
P
Publisher
Guest
Yes, Friends do seek to conform to the worship experience of the Church Christ established…that where two or three were gathered in his name, he would be in their midst. If you mean to confrom to what the Catholic church claims…no…not in the least.
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anode
Guest
It is rather difficult to become a Quaker, that is, to be accepted as an adult into a meeting. You are interviewed at length, usually after attending the meeting for some time. The people on the committee which decides membership (always committees in the Friends!) have to know you well. You are obliged to contribute fully to the Meeting, if not monetarily, then by your gifts of time and involvement. In a way, it’s sort of like becoming a Jew. It’s not just attending classes and a ceremony–it’s a lot more than that. This is why there are not very many Quakers. But because of their dedication, their influence is felt far beyond their numbers.
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Ceil-1
Guest
Is there no baptism?
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anode
Guest
I don’t know, but I don’t think so. Maybe the more conventional Quakers have Baptism (those that have preachers, sermons and music) --I’m not sure. I think that Quakers would say that they are baptized by the Spirit and that this baptism is an ongoing life-long conversion.
Quakers tend to live very simply, are politically liberal, green and often vegetarians. They donate heavily to Quaker organizations, such as the American Friends Service Committee, and to charities.
Anyone re Quakers and baptism?
Quakers tend to live very simply, are politically liberal, green and often vegetarians. They donate heavily to Quaker organizations, such as the American Friends Service Committee, and to charities.
Anyone re Quakers and baptism?
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brb3
Guest
Generally 3 or more are gathered to worship Christ at Mass, just as at a Quaker assembly of Friends. Christ said, ‘there is ONE flock and ONE Shepherd’. Perhaps your Friends and ours need to listen to Christ … and OBEY.
Could your assembly join ours for Ecumenical worship ? Would the Eucharist be an issue for Quakers ?
P
Publisher
Guest
This is a good synopsis of how one becomes a Friend. One must display in their lives the commitment of being a Friend.
I was convinced at 19…it took almost a year for me to be formally named a Friend. I had to go through an interview process…become familiar with our history…our “traditions”…respond to a line of questioning about our committment toward peace and justice. I had to become involved.
There is a commitment to peace, simplicity and social justice. Each Friend is expected to “do something” in their community…there are only a few “sideline Friends.”
P
Publisher
Guest
Friends do not practice water baptism…“One Lord, One faith, One baptism” that “baptizes” us into the Body of Christ is in and with the Holy Spirit regenerating us in newness of life…
Those Evangelical Friends in “programmed meetings”…aka “Friends Church” embrace the stance of historic Quakers by not participating in “outward forms”…“rituals” conducted on our behalf by priest or minister…each Friend enters into the Presence of God and share in Christ’s Priesthood…no rituals or rites are required to make someone a “Christian”…one must LIVE the Christian life and can never point to “I was baptised in water at such and such an age…so I’m a Christian.”…Our faith is experiential dispensing with “outward forms” that for us detracts from the “inward life” by trusting in “outward forms”.
Some Friends among the Evangelical variety do allow a provision in their respective meetings to offer water baptism for those who feel a need for the ritual…the Clerk and Pastor ususally set something up with another faith tradition which practices water baptism…some Evangelical Friends also may be led to practice the memorial meal or foot washing as well…but it’s not seen as a “means of grace”…it it left to the individual Friends conscience. California Yearly Meeting of Friends Church is one such Yearly Meeting which allows it’s members to engage in “outward forms” if they so wish.
P
Publisher
Guest
We are made one in Christ through the baptism of His Holy Spirit, it is His work in us that makes us One in Him…He is our One Shepherd and One Priest…unless one walks the walk…one is not a “Christian”…we must not only “talk the talk” but “walk the walk”…to not do so is a deception.
Those of us in Friends General Conference and Friends United Meeting and some Independent Meetings are involved in ecumenical worship. If the Eucharist is served it is up to each individual Friend to decide if they wish to partake.
Depending on the circumstances I find myself…I have participated in the Memorial Meal in an ecumenical woship setting. I also have refused to particiapte on grounds of conscience. I have attended several Catholic funeral masses and even though I was invited up by one the the Sister’s of Mercy…I refused as I was at a Sister’s funeral and out of respect for her…did not participate.
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