Anyone else believe in universal coverage for kids?

[surfinpure]

Ah, so you can’t prove that we have them now or have ever had them…just as I suspected. Good thing I didn’t bother to start “googling”.

Sounds like you expect the rest of us to spend our time looking up sources for you, so you can give a one-line response. We’ve raised serious objections to the proposed legislation which you support, and you cannot even quote said legislation to prove our objections unfounded? I’m disappointed. But it’s good to know I don’t need to be overly concerned with providing any more sources, since this argument seems to be entirely one-sided.

Signing off for now. But if anyone else is willing to demonstrate that our healthcare rights are protected in the proposed legilsation, I’m certainly willing to have a look. Until then, my understanding remains that there is no such protection, and I certainly cannot support any such measure.

 

[pathia]

I have no idea what your conditions or your lifestyle are, but I’m very sorry you were refused emergency treatment. That is illegal in America, you know, and you have recourse.

Not when they eventually find a doctor to treat me. I ended up OK, so there was no evidence to sue by. However, I sat in the back of the ER (Post admittance, I’m not whining about being left in the waiting area). Eventually a nurse started screaming at doctors and they got their butts in gear.

If you don’t think all children should have healthcare, then what is your solution when they get sick and their parents can’t afford it? Medicaid doesn’t cover everyone, the middle class gets hammered by medical bills as bad, if not as bad as the poor, because they don’t qualify for assistance.

I’ve filed for bankruptcy twice myself, but my father had to do it too because of the medical bills I had when I was a minor. We are/were upper middle class, my medical problems have ruined my family over and over, from birth onwards. My father only was able to start saving for retirement until after I became an adult because basically every cent went to my health.

 

[Fitswimmer]

Sounds like you expect the rest of us to spend our time looking up sources for you, so you can give a one-line response. We’ve raised serious objections to the proposed legislation which you support, and you cannot even quote said legislation to prove our objections unfounded? I’m disappointed. But it’s good to know I don’t need to be overly concerned with providing any more sources, since this argument seems to be entirely one-sided.

Signing off for now. But if anyone else is willing to demonstrate that our healthcare rights are protected in the proposed legilsation, I’m certainly willing to have a look. Until then, my understanding remains that there is no such protection, and I certainly cannot support any such measure.

All that has been provided are opinions and everyone’s got one of those. It doesn’t take more than one sentence to dismiss them.

 

[ribozyme]

I don’t suppose you can provide us with the portion of the proposed legislation that protects patients from eugenics and utilitarianism? The right to timely procedures? The right to make our own healthcare decisions? The right to choose our own providers, and demand necessary testing for life-threatening conditions, regardless of our “quality of life”?

Please cite a credible source that guarantees us the right to manage our own healthcare, including the right to seek second opinions and alternative care when we deem it necessary. Please demonstrate that physicians and their overseeing government administrators will not calculate our “quality adjusted life years” and determine when our lives are no longer “worth living” or “worth saving.”

Most people do not have those rights. Most people on the right side of the political spectrum do not argue that those are rights, but priviledges.

 

[Skip_Wiley]

So what is wrong with providing access to adcanced health care to the poor if it will improve their quality of life and increase their lifespan?

Nothing, except that liberals want tax payers to do it and for the government to regulate health care.

 

[surfinpure]

All that has been provided are opinions and everyone’s got one of those. It doesn’t take more than one sentence to dismiss them.

No, we’ve provided reasonable objections based on demonstrable flaws in other socialized healthcare systems. And you have yet to provide so much as a single link to information that would lay those objections to rest. It’s been nothing but hot air. If you’re going to make claims about the superiority of socialized medicine, at least have the substance to back them up.

 

[Fitswimmer]

No, we’ve provided reasonable objections based on demonstrable flaws in other socialized healthcare systems. And you have yet to provide so much as a single link to information that would lay those objections to rest. It’s been nothing but hot air. If you’re going to make claims about the superiority of socialized medicine, at least have the substance to back them up.

I simply exchanged my opinions for the ones you referenced. No matter how much you point your finger at me, you still have 4 left pointing back at yourself.

 

[surfinpure]

I simply exchanged my opinions for the ones you referenced. No matter how much you point your finger at me, you still have 4 left pointing back at yourself.

This is absurd. You’re supporting a healthcare system you can’t even manage to define or defend. There is no argument, and the thread is going nowhere. So this is the end for me. And God help America’s children when bureaucrats and administrators are in charge of distributing their medical care.

 

[manualman]

I enjoy the wit, but the Chinese aren’t paying for Iraq. They are making MORE money off us by charging interest on their loans to us - making it all the more impossible to sustain the extra trillion dollars a year in expenditures.

We can’t pay for all the stuff the feds decide we “need” right now. It’s fallacious to think we can double down and come out ahead.

 

[rlg94086]

You got to be kidding me when you call that link liberal. John Stossel most certainly isn’t a liberal.

Okay…but is the article accurate? If it is, who cares if he is liberal, moderate (my opinion) or conservative?

 

[julia1234]

This is absurd. You’re supporting a healthcare system you can’t even manage to define or defend. There is no argument, and the thread is going nowhere./QUOTE]

Oh my gosh. I actually think the thread has gone somewhere. It shows the facts for what they are to anyone who is truly interested and capable of understanding. It almost seems as if the desire for “free health care” is at times fueled by a disdain for anyone who is against it. Those who are against it are against it for the GOOD of American children.

 

[cynic]

How can the good of children be served if they can’t receive basic medical treatement because of parental income?

 

[neillennon]

I do, i am Scottish and we all have universal health care which is free at the point of treatment, its a system that works well.

 

[Skip_Wiley]

I do, i am Scottish and we all have universal health care which is free at the point of treatment, its a system that works well.

It’s free? Really? The doctors and nurses just volunteer their services? The drug companies donate the medicine?

I guess people donate the land for the hospitals.

I think that’s great that you guys have figured out a way to provide healthcare that doesn’t take any money.

 

[cynic]

It’s free? Really? The doctors and nurses just volunteer their services? The drug companies donate the medicine?

I guess people donate the land for the hospitals.

I think that’s great that you guys have figured out a way to provide healthcare that doesn’t take any money.

The majority of taxpayers in Scotland would most likely support be in support of it.

 

[neillennon]

It’s free? Really? The doctors and nurses just volunteer their services? The drug companies donate the medicine?

I guess people donate the land for the hospitals.

I think that’s great that you guys have figured out a way to provide healthcare that doesn’t take any money.

No its free at the point of treatment which means that everyone pays there tax’s and then we pay for the health service.

Your right about the land tho most of it is public property.

The doctors and nurses are given a free education and are supported by the tax pay through it, although they don’t work for nothing, they wouldn’t be doctors if it wasn’t for the people they treat.

The drug companies are getting a pretty hard time here just now as they are putting profit before people.

 

[neillennon]

The majority of taxpayers in Scotland would most likely support be in support of it.

Correct:thumbsup:

 

[Fitswimmer]

No its free at the point of treatment which means that everyone pays there tax’s and then we pay for the health service.

Your right about the land tho most of it is public property.

The doctors and nurses are given a free education and are supported by the tax pay through it, although they don’t work for nothing, they wouldn’t be doctors if it wasn’t for the people they treat.

The drug companies are getting a pretty hard time here just now as they are putting profit before people.

Every industrialized nation except the US believes that healthcare is important enough to make sure everyone has access.

So, what does that say about the US?

A. We’re not smart enough to take the good points of other systems and create our own. (or we’re just too lazy)
B. We’re selfish. As long as the majority has access, they could care less about those that don’t-even if they’re children.
C. We like to punish people that we believe aren’t following the rules. “If they worked hard enough, they could afford healthcare”
D. We care more about making money than we do about people’s lives.
E. We continue to put such inept people into government that we’re afraid to give them any responsibility.

None of this makes us look very good. We used to be the nation that could do anything. What happened to those people?

 

[thomfra]

Every industrialized nation except the US believes that healthcare is important enough to make sure everyone has access.

So, what does that say about the US?

A. We’re not smart enough to take the good points of other systems and create our own. (or we’re just too lazy)
B. We’re selfish. As long as the majority has access, they could care less about those that don’t-even if they’re children.
C. We like to punish people that we believe aren’t following the rules. “If they worked hard enough, they could afford healthcare”
D. We care more about making money than we do about people’s lives.
E. We continue to put such inept people into government that we’re afraid to give them any responsibility.

None of this makes us look very good. We used to be the nation that could do anything. What happened to those people?

I think point C is at the heart of the issue. It’s all to do with the concept of “the American dream”.

People (even those born with a silver spoon in their mouths) will tend to see themselves as “hard workers”, who “struggled and fought” to get where they are. Therefore if they can do it and afford healthcare then so can everybody.

But I would also like to add:

Point F: An irrational fear of anything which may in some way be related to socialism, or social democracy.

 

[Skip_Wiley]

No its free at the point of treatment which means that everyone pays there tax’s and then we pay for the health service.

Your right about the land tho most of it is public property.

The doctors and nurses are given a free education and are supported by the tax pay through it, although they don’t work for nothing, they wouldn’t be doctors if it wasn’t for the people they treat.

So then it’s not free, it’s just that somebody else is paying for it.

Isn’t that what they’re in business for? To make a profit?

[/QUOTE]