Anyone else dislike the sign of peace?

[Olympia]

robertaf:

For those who worry about “catching something” from someone, do you pass up the cup as well. Imagine catching something from a vessel holding Jesus? I would believe that while being immersed in His Grace so much, His shed blood would protect us.
.

You are exactly right about fear of germs from taking communion from “THE CUP” (new terminology, I would rather call it the BLOOD OF JESUS CHRIST). It is my understanding that amy divine protection from disease, etc, would be only while one were on a mission to evangelize or perform charitable works, etc., not solely while receiving the sacrament. Also, expecting Divine Protection from germs would be rather a superstitious belief, IMHO. Also, I believe that the sudden interest in THE CUP ( terminlogy again) is to increase the number of lay Euch. Ministers. It seems that this is the most popular parish involvement which most people want. Weeding and mowing lawns, painting, cleaning, or teaching catechism to other people’s children, seems to be rather unpopular, as they are always asking for last minute volunteers.

quote: One hint about catching something from the cup, that is the best reason I know to sit in the front pew. Get up there first and let everyone worry about catching something from you END QUOTE

Why would you offer this hint, if there were no validity to this objection?

Thank you for bringing this up, no disrespect intended.

 

[Olympia]

ally:

Alot of the above posters have already mentioned my objections to the shaking. Germs! Germs! Germs!!!

. . . one church that I visited once that had a washing of the hands ceremony for the ministers before they distributed communion. I like that idea. .

No, it is not just GERMS that bother me. It is being forced to participate. Also the timing is all wrong. The handshake should be in the beginning of the mass, not just at the high point of the consecration, when all attention should be on the Sacrifice of the Mass.

PS: the “Washing of the Hands Ceremony”: is this a sanctioned liturgical event within the Mass? At what point in the Mass this did this occur? This used to be part of the Tridentine Mass, but what you described did not sound like it, it sounded like it was to accomodate the germophobic congregation, whereas in the Tridentine Mass, hands were washed BEFORE the consecration as a mark of great reverence and respect for the Sacrament.

Can you see the difference in emphasis?

 

[Edwin1961]

In the Byzantine Catholic Church we do not have this gesture, however, when I was going to the Latin Rite, I was VERY uncomfortable with the gesture. For me, it distrated the flow of the Mass and often ruined my reverence to our Lord, because the Eucharist was just around the corner. NOW if the Sign of Peace could be instituted just after Mass was started, then maybe that would change opinions.

go with God!
Edwin

 

[mtr01]

jimmy:

Yeh, If you go to a traditional Latin mass you will not find anyone doing the sign of peace. It is a new addition to the mass.

Actually you are incorrect. This practice was performed by the early Church. For some reason it was dropped in the Tridentine Mass. Vatican II simply restored the practice in the Novus Ordo Mass. St Justin Martyr writes in his first apology (circa 155 AD):

Chapter LXV.-Administration of the Sacraments.

But we, after we have thus washed him who has been convinced and has assented to our teaching, bring him to the place where those who are called brethren are assembled, in order that we may offer hearty prayers in common for ourselves and for the baptized [illuminated] person, and for all others in every place, that we may be counted worthy, now that we have learned the truth, by our works also to be found good citizens and keepers of the commandments, so that we may be saved with an everlasting salvation. Having ended the prayers, we salute one another with a kiss.141 There is then brought to the president of the brethren142 bread and a cup of wine mixed with water; and he taking them, gives praise and glory to the Father of the universe, through the name of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, and offers thanks at considerable length for our being counted worthy to receive these things at His hands. And when he has concluded the prayers and thanksgivings, all the people present express their assent by saying Amen. This word Amen answers in the Hebrew language to ge/noito [so be it]. And when the president has given thanks, and all the people have expressed their assent, those who are called by us deacons give to each of those present to partake of the bread and wine mixed with water over which the thanksgiving was pronounced, and to those who are absent they carry away a portion.

ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-46.htm#P3935_744654

If anything, the kiss of peace in the early Church was performed just before the Eucharistic Prayer, whereas today it is after, but before the Communion Rite.

[cont’d…]

 

[mtr01]

[cont’d…]

jimmy:

I don’t like it because it is forced contact and because it turns church into a social time. Church is meant to be a time when we witness the sacrifice of Christ, it is not supposed to be a social time.

Then don’t shake hands. As others have noted, you could nod and offer peace. Your mistake, however, is in characterizing it as “social time”. That is not the intent, it is an abuse that should be corrected by your pastor or bishop. This is what Fr. McNamara (professor of liturgy at the Regina Apostolorum Pontifical Athenaeum in Rome) had to say about it:

The reason the GIRM dwells on this point is to put the kiss of peace into its proper context as a brief, and relatively unimportant rite in preparation for Communion; in fact, few realize that it is actually optional. It is the forthcoming Communion, not the priest, nor the good feelings we harbor toward our neighbors, that is the reason and source of the peace we desire for our fellows and the peace we receive from them. As GIRM 82 says, in the Rite of Peace: **“the Church asks for peace and unity for herself and for the whole human family, and the faithful express to each other their ecclesial communion and mutual charity before communicating in the Sacrament.” **

…and for how it should be carried out:

The gestures of the faithful, while respecting local custom, they should avoid excess exuberance and ebullience, again according to GIRM 82: “as to the sign of peace to be given, the manner is to be established by Conferences of Bishops in accordance with the culture and customs of the peoples. **It is, however, appropriate that each person offer the sign of peace only to those who are nearest and in a sober manner.” **

philosophy-religion.org/calendar/passing.htm

Handshaking is “within the local custom” in this country, and is therefore appropriate. The main point however, is that is should be done in a solemn manner, and only with people close to you (no ostentatious displays or yelling across the church).

jimmy:

It is also placed in the mass at a bad place. It is placed in the middle of the consecration of the body and the blood. It distracts from what is going on in the mass.

Personally I wouldn’t mind if it were moved to before the Eucharistic Prayer, as it seems to have been in the early Church. But for what is symbolizes, I have no problem at all with where it currently is. In a way, it also makes me feel somehow connected to the earliest Christians, as it is another link that we today can trace directly back our earliest brethren in Christ.

 

[CD4]

I do not object to the Sign of Peace itself, but like you dislike where it is in the Mass. I find it jarring, and disruptive in its present place.

 

[Emmy]

robertaf:

That’s OK, Dear, I will say a Novena for you along with the Rosarys. You know, none of us can choose.

Nothing wrong being Dutch…

Emmy

 

[Emmy]

And I love the sign of peace. To wish somebody the peace of Christ and somebody do that to you makes my day in mass.

Emmy

 

[Esquire]

MTR01:
thank you for citing the Justin Martyr quote. I was about to post it myself.

I just hate these touchy-feely post-Vatican II innovations. Don’t you?

You people really need to get a life, when you’re reduced to complaining about things that have been part of the Mass since the earliest days.

 

[coeyannie]

I definitely don’t like the sign of peace. I used to go to the big basilica downtown, and one of the priests would leave the sanctuary and go up and down the aisle, shaking hands with, first, one side of the church, and then the other. It took 15 minutes. Another church I attend has the sign of peace at the beginning of Mass, and the church I like best doesn’t have it at all. Holding hands at the Our Father is like stand-up comedy. People go through impossible positions to grab your hand. It is ridiculous. If I were a priest saying Mass, I would probably start laughing. I don’t understand how the Bishop’s and priests can think this is great spiritual stuff.

 

[mtr01]

Esquire:

MTR01:
thank you for citing the Justin Martyr quote. I was about to post it myself.

I always like to refer to the Fathers. It often seems like they bring a sense of clarity and rationality to many of our modern day issues.

Esquire:

I just hate these touchy-feely post-Vatican II innovations. Don’t you?

I’m not sure exactly which touchy-feely innovations you are referring to. I’m not sure if it’s the fault of V2, but there does seem to be a growing lack of reverence in the Mass. I was a lapsed Catholic for about 20 years (I’m a post V2 baby), and some of the things I encountered when I came back into the fold were rather disheartening: no kneeling, hand holding (and people in the orans posture) during the Our Father, socializing during Mass, etc etc.

I don’t know where to place the blame. Maybe the pastors have been too liberal in their approaches, maybe the bishops have been lax in enforcing abuses, or maybe poor catechesis . What I do know is that many people in Church today seem to forget the actual purpose of why they’re there (I can’t fathom that any Catholic would not believe in the Real Presence).

Esquire:

You people really need to get a life, when you’re reduced to complaining about things that have been part of the Mass since the earliest days.

Hopefully, many that didn’t realize this fact now know better. Anyhow, there are many more important issues facing the Church than the sign of peace.

 

[Brennan_Doherty]

mtr01:

Actually you are incorrect. This practice was performed by the early Church. For some reason it was dropped in the Tridentine Mass. Vatican II simply restored the practice in the Novus Ordo Mass. St Justin Martyr writes in his first apology (circa 155 AD):

Chapter LXV.-Administration of the Sacraments.

But we, after we have thus washed him who has been convinced and has assented to our teaching, bring him to the place where those who are called brethren are assembled, in order that we may offer hearty prayers in common for ourselves and for the baptized [illuminated] person, and for all others in every place, that we may be counted worthy, now that we have learned the truth, by our works also to be found good citizens and keepers of the commandments, so that we may be saved with an everlasting salvation. Having ended the prayers, we salute one another with a kiss.141 There is then brought to the president of the brethren142 bread and a cup of wine mixed with water;…

The above quote seems to refer to a baptismal ceremony. And, as noted, it occurred prior to the consecration.

 

[hearye]

WWJD? comes to mind here…

eg: Jesus walked up to LEPERS and SHOWED them LOVE…

We are all temples of the Holy Spirit, and I’ve often been reminded to picture the face of Christ in those around me…What would He be proud of you for doing? I think that’s an important thing to consider.

 

[puzzleannie]

I have no problem with the general idea, it goes back to the early church, but the timing seems awkward, wouldn’t it be more appropriate as part of the penitential rite, or preceeding bringing the gifts, which as others have pointed out would link it more with its scriptural basis? It seems to be a general signal to break the silence and reverence that attend the Eucharistic prayer and begin chatting and visiting, adding to the general hustle and bustle of the Communion rite, very destructive to the attitude of thanksgiving and reverence we should be adopting.

 

[TheGrowingGrape]

When I participate in the sign of peace, I shake the hands of those nearest me, but don’t “lean” or “stretch” to shake hands of those out of arm’s length. I also NEVER turn my back to the altar.

It’s just a personal thing I do. I think that turning my back to the altar is places the importance of the sign of peace above the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. We need to keep in mind that Mass is not a social hall.

Also, The Pope said in Redemptionis Sacramentum that we are not to go overboard with the sign of peace. His Holiness said that it is best to only shake the hands of those nearest us.