Apologetic "Gotcha!" moments

[Michael96]

The Apologist’s Evening Prayer

*From all my lame defeats and oh! much more
From all the victories that I seemed to score;
From cleverness shot forth on Thy behalf
At which, while angels weep, the audience laugh;
From all my proofs of Thy divinity,
Thou, who wouldst give no sign, deliver me.

Thoughts are but coins. Let me not trust, instead
Of Thee, their thin-wore image of Thy head.
From all my thoughts, even from my thoughts of Thee,
O thou fair Silence, fall, and set me free.
Lord of the narrow gate and the needle’s eye,
Take from me all my trumpery lest I die.*

• C.S. Lewis

 

[Verbum]

Hi Michael,

A good conclusion to this thread. Apologetics is only effective inasmuch as it gives us an opportunity to give witness and to show charity, not to crush others.

Verbum

 

[e61iuser]

True enough. But then again there are just some people who don’t respond to anything else except a direct “gotcha!” at the heart of their flawed logic. Not to charity, not to reason, not to truth.

Granted charity must be present in apologetics, but one also must not sacrifice reason and truth just for charity, lest the one being evangelized or explained to go on in their error.

 

[MDK]

True enough. But then again there are just some people who don’t respond to anything else except a direct “gotcha!” at the heart of their flawed logic. Not to charity, not to reason, not to truth.

Granted charity must be present in apologetics, but one also must not sacrifice reason and truth just for charity, lest the one being evangelized or explained to go on in their error.

Without knowing the truth the Church teaches, how can we know Christ who is the Truth? It is charitable to share the truth with others to bring them closer to Christ. It is charitable to blunt a false argument for the sake of helping another get off the bad course. The Catholic Church uses excommunication as a medicinal measure, to show the person where they stand in relation to the Church so that hopefully they will repent and come into communion with the official teachings on faith and morals. I don’t see that as uncharitable. The intent is to get one to move closer to Christ… It’s certainly not true that the end justifies all means, but I think many get hung up on being “nice” even if we must pull back on the truth, because the one who holds false beliefs may be offended, rather than telling the bold truth.

What is uncharitable is to deceive one with the intent of pulling them away from the Church, and therefore from Christ. If one is nice while pulling another away from the Church, I would never consider that charitable.

 

[e61iuser]

Well said MDK. Charity certainly is necessary in explaining and defending the faith for all seekers of Truth. It’s just when apologists get too hung up on too much charity that they compromise the Truth with the anti-Catholic’s falsehood. This is never a good thing in that it presents a half-truth. A half-truth is a half-lie.

Any more people willing to share their “gotcha!” moments in apologetics?

 

[strngrnrth]

I have little success defending the faith in argument. It’s not that I lack arguments. i just tend to run into people who think the rules of debate go like this:

1. In every exchange, the Catholic is inaudible.
2. If a Catholic rebuts any statement or answers any question, the non-Catholic screams and runs away or barks in the Catholic’s face for hours without seeming to need oxygen.
3. Any points made by a Catholic that sink into the other person’s consciousness are a breach of etiquette and result in punishment or personal attacks of some kind.
4. Any displeasure in life, past or present, however small, on the part of the non-Catholic, is the fault of the Catholic Church. If the non-Catholic is a non-Christian, all Christians might be responsible for the failure of the universe to cater to the non-Christian’s desires throughout life. Otherwise it’s just Catholics.
5. All historic atrocities committed by Catholics must be recast with no context at all, laid at the feet of the Church, and multiplied by a factor of thousands in every reference. All atrocities committed by members of beleif systems like that of the other person are anomalies and obviously not representative of anything, and exaggeration terminates the debate.

 

[MDK]

I have little success defending the faith in argument. It’s not that I lack arguments. i just tend to run into people who think the rules of debate go like this:

1. In every exchange, the Catholic is inaudible.
2. If a Catholic rebuts any statement or answers any question, the non-Catholic screams and runs away or barks in the Catholic’s face for hours without seeming to need oxygen.
3. Any points made by a Catholic that sink into the other person’s consciousness are a breach of etiquette and result in punishment or personal attacks of some kind.
4. Any displeasure in life, past or present, however small, on the part of the non-Catholic, is the fault of the Catholic Church. If the non-Catholic is a non-Christian, all Christians might be responsible for the failure of the universe to cater to the non-Christian’s desires throughout life. Otherwise it’s just Catholics.
5. All historic atrocities committed by Catholics must be recast with no context at all, laid at the feet of the Church, and multiplied by a factor of thousands in every reference. All atrocities committed by members of beleif systems like that of the other person are anomalies and obviously not representative of anything, and exaggeration terminates the debate.

This shows why they aren’t Catholic… they can’t handle the truth!

And yet, we must continue to promote the truth in a world that is reluctant and hostile to the Truth, who is Jesus Christ. Hostility toward Christ spills over into hostility toward His Bride, the Church, His Body. This is sad, but no surprise to those who will side with Christ in the persecutions big and small and willingly share in them, in His Name. Still, never bending to falsehoods to avoid the persecutions, we continue to share in Him as the Way, Truth, and the Life.