Applause after homily

[PennyinCanada]

Wherever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment. Such attrac*tiveness fades quickly—it cannot compete in the market of leisure pursuits, incorporating as it increasingly does various forms of religious titillation.

Pope Benedict XVI, The Spirit of the Liturgy​

Our homilies are 20 - 25 min. There is only one Divine Liturgy on Sunday so there’s no hurry to rush out for the next Liturgy to come in. We have Catholic homilies though, quoting scripture and the Catechism. No nonsense “Oprah” type homilies. It’s a pleasure to have someone care about our faith. Sorry if it’s long with the wrong content.

 

[jwinch2]

Wherever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment. Such attrac*tiveness fades quickly—it cannot compete in the market of leisure pursuits, incorporating as it increasingly does various forms of religious titillation.

Pope Benedict XVI, The Spirit of the Liturgy​

I absolutely agree with this.

If there is applause from time to time on special occasions such as when candidates and catechumens are received into the Church at Easter, during the installation Mass of a new pastor, or following first communion for kids, I’m not going to get in a huff over it. However, if there is a situation such as is described by Julianne, it would bother me greatly.

 

[markomalley]

I absolutely agree with this.

If there is applause from time to time on special occasions such as when candidates and catechumens are received into the Church at Easter, during the installation Mass of a new pastor, or following first communion for kids, I’m not going to get in a huff over it. However, if there is a situation such as is described by Julianne, it would bother me greatly.

But wouldn’t the applause in those circumstances be thought of as a mass, communal “welcome” versus “good job, we enjoyed your _(fill in the blank)”?

I do agree with your post.

 

[jwinch2]

But wouldn’t the applause in those circumstances be thought of as a mass, communal “welcome” versus “good job, we enjoyed your _(fill in the blank)”?

I do agree with your post.

Yep, that’s why it wouldn’t bother me in the slightest. You hit the nail right on the head.

Peace,

 

[promethius]

Wherever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment. Such attrac*tiveness fades quickly—it cannot compete in the market of leisure pursuits, incorporating as it increasingly does various forms of religious titillation.

Pope Benedict XVI, The Spirit of the Liturgy​

Ahem… a minor correction: it was Cardinal Ratzinger who said this. There is a reason the pope undergoes a name change upon appointment… new position, new authority. This is a teaching that the Pope has not chosen to reassert after his election (and assumption of new authority), so we cannot presume that he ever meant it to be given with papal authority at all.

 

[markomalley]

Ahem… a minor correction: it was Cardinal Ratzinger who said this. There is a reason the pope undergoes a name change upon appointment… new position, new authority. This is a teaching that the Pope has not chosen to reassert after his election (and assumption of new authority), so we cannot presume that he ever meant it to be given with papal authority at all.

It was a book, it wasn’t a Magisterial document in any regards.

I still fully agree with his conclusions. That is why I posted it.

 

[promethius]

We have a retired priest at our parish. Nice guy but a little too Oprah/modernist for my taste. So he gives one of his “I’m okay, you’re okay” homilies at mass one day and at the end he receives applause. This only happened once but I was really frustrated. So many Catholics just don’t get mass.

It’s quite a leap to go from saying “people clapped one time” to asserting that “so many catholics just don’t get the mass”.

No matter what you may think of a homily it is always inappropriate to applaud.

Actually, it was quite common for parishoners to applaud in church up until the 8th century, when the practice began to be discouraged. This, however, is because applause does not necessarily mean “good job” but more traditionally means concurance or “I agree”… thus if a priest said “abortion is wrong” and people break out into applause, it would be safe to assume that they are affirming agreement with the priest, rather than applauding him for saying three simple words.

Granted, I still think it’s right that applause was supressed, especially considering that the GENERAL usage today is “good job”, but we can’t immediately jump to the conclusion that this is ALWAYS the usage of applause (eg: in the military at formal banquets, if you wish to agree with a speaker you applaud by tapping a spoon on the table)

It’s not supposed to be about the personalities with us, it’s about the real presence of our Lord in the Eucharist. Some folks think they’re there to be entertained and applauding a good performance only seems natural. Might as well go join a so-called bible church.

What is a “so-called bible church”? Aren’t there forum rules against bashing protestants as being non-christians or claiming that they aren’t “real churches”? Would you please clarify what you meant by this statement?

 

[silicasandra]

I absolutely agree with this.

If there is applause from time to time on special occasions such as when candidates and catechumens are received into the Church at Easter, during the installation Mass of a new pastor, or following first communion for kids, I’m not going to get in a huff over it. However, if there is a situation such as is described by Julianne, it would bother me greatly.

I agree with this. I do think there are a few occasions when applause is merited - like where you describe. There has been applause a few times at my parish but is far from an every week thing, and I mean it every time I applaud someone.

But if I were Juliane and it were happening every week I would be annoyed, too. Especially after the homily, which, while important, is far from the most important part of the Mass. I know in my parish our pastor is making an effort to have one or two minutes of silence for reflection after the homily before we stand for the Profession of Faith. While clapping is an appropriate gesture at times, I am not sure how it would help a person reflect on the pastor’s message of how to apply the Gospel to our lives - it would be totally distracting.

 

[promethius]

It was a book, it wasn’t a Magisterial document in any regards.

I still fully agree with his conclusions. That is why I posted it.

Nonetheless, you posted it with an improper citation which might have (and did!) lead people to assume that he said it as pope, and not as cardinal Ratzinger, hence why I saw the need to clarify lest people continue to be confused as to what authority was granted to the statement at the time it was written.

I happen to agree with the quote as well, insofar as applause of congratulations for human endeavor should not appear in mass, but that does nothing to change the fact that Pope Benedict never said such a thing. The man he WAS, operating under his PREVIOUS, and LOWER level of authority wrote it.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Thanks to everyone who has contributed. The priest of this parish, who is the only one serving, has an ego and is very stubborn. He drove a lot of our big contributors and long-time members away with changes he made right after he arrived, and things haven’t improved since then. A lot of our ministries disappeared when the people serving in them defected to the other nearby parish.

1. His homilies are regularly so long that the Mass is 90 minutes long, and he does it on purpose. He made that clear to us by repeating over and over in his homilies how he thinks Catholics do not give enough time to God during the course of their week. Of course he doesn’t take into consideration the families with children, or the fact that many of us spend a lot more time in prayer even when we aren’t in Mass.
2. Thus, the regular Mass times had to be shifted around to accommodate his schedule since one Mass would not have left the church when the next Mass arrived to a full parking lot.
3. He started allowing quincineras during the English speaking Masses, which became a huge distraction, with all the girls in their fancy dresses and the boys in tuxes and popping their gum. Now, don’t get me wrong, I think the ceremony is a wonderful thing for young ladies of the Mexican culture, but it didn’t need to be held within a Mass. That no longer takes place but the damage was done and the people who left have not returned.
4. As far as his homilies go…He is a brilliant man, there’s no doubt. Some of his homilies are great, some are too repetitive, and all of them could be edited. He tends to ramble around, especially at the vigil Mass which is the one we usually attend. You don’t need to repeat and repeat the same idea 15 times in slightly different ways, especially if you’ve already droned on for 35 minutes!

I really think, on some level, that he believes it’s kind of his show. He’s not traditional in any way, we don’t have a lot of the orthodox elements such as the bells, and of course we do the hand-holding and orans posture which I have also come to dislike greatly.

He shared with us once that early in his priestly career, he got a notice that someone was in the process of dying and he tried to get there to give them Last Rites, but didn’t make it in time. He actually had to get counseling to recover, which to me suggests that he believes HE is more important than the Holy Spirit. I mean, it’s not as if the person is going to hell because Father got stuck in traffic and their soul left their body…but I could see that he was totally sincere in that he really believed himself to be responsible…I felt sorry for his younger self but I still think he has a lot of ego tied up in his job.

I guess I can be happy no one gives him a standing ovation… I know that audiences these days seem to ALWAYS stand up, no matter how flawed a presentation might have been…I guess it’s the “participation trophy” that is awarded just for trying…

And to the poster who said it’s kind of an automatic response for some people and then others join in…That’s true. The applause always starts on the other side of the church so I suspect he has a few “fans” over there, I have never found them or I’d glare at them. As it is, I simply put my head down and say a quick prayer.

 

[dorrbell]

Oh I cant stand when people clap at Mass!
My parish use to do it after the Mass for the choir. Our last pastor put a stop to that THANK GOD! I hope it doesnt start again we arent at a concert.

 

[Cindyr9]

I think if the applause were a rare ocurrence it might be tolerated, however if it happens regularly, the priest himself should demonstrate some humility and ask the congregation to refrain from applause out of reverence for the solemnity of the liturgy. If he doesn’t do it verbally, perhaps he could get the message out by way of the weekly bulletin or by encouraging a moment of silence immediately after the sermon. We had this happen whenever a certain cantor sang solo. She has a beautiful voice and if she were performing in a concert setting, applause would certainly be warranted. Our pastor finally put something in the bulletin to ask people to refrain from applause. He would immediately begin the next segment of the liturgy so as to not allow a time gap after the last note for people to start to applaud. It seems to work for the most part.

Looking back to the beginning of this thread, it doesn’t sound like this priest is going to do anything to discourage the applause, so maybe you could send an email to your bishop to ask his advice as to whether he deems it appropriate and if not, perhaps he will ask your priest to set the example to discourage the practice.

 

[Rina_Badal]

Applause is not the habit in my parish or The Cathedral where I go on certain feasts, but there are many occasions when I gladly join the faithful and clap hands, usually to express agreement, happiness, encouragement or gratitude. I do not mind applause then, I think it is for the right reason.
Here is an interesting homily about applause. Please take some time to read it.
stmaryvalleybloom.org/homilyfor1advent-a.html
God bless you.
Peace,
Rina

 

[paperwight66]

It’s a cultural thing. In some parts of the world, the congregation clap and cheer all the way through Mass. In other parts, they remain in stony silence until the end, not even joining in the responses (we have people to do that). Just be glad that they are listening - and that they don’t keep shouting “Hallelujah!” every five minutes.

That’s an interesting comment.

In which parts of the world? Is it something you’ve experienced yourself, by the way?

 

[GwenL]

Spontaneous applause after an especially strong or important point in the homily is one thing. The people are applauding the idea or point being made. I don’t particularly like it, but people do spontaneous things sometimes.

On the other hand, applause at the conclusion of a homily is all about the priest as performer, with him as the center of the show. It’s tacky and not appropriate for the holy sacrifice of the Mass.

Our rector concludes his homilies with the sign of the cross, and “in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.” Really dampens any impulse to applaud, and focuses the congregation on Whom they should be focused.

 

[Faithdancer]

Applause is not the habit in my parish or The Cathedral where I go on certain feasts, but there are many occasions when I gladly join the faithful and clap hands, usually to express agreement, happiness, encouragement or gratitude. I do not mind applause then, I think it is for the right reason.
Here is an interesting homily about applause. Please take some time to read it.
stmaryvalleybloom.org/homilyfor1advent-a.html
God bless you.
Peace,
Rina

I’m just being silly I know, Rina but- did the homily about applause receive applause?

 

[ConstantineTG]

Maybe they were just applauding the fact that the long homily is over

 

[jmoneyideas]

Really I find this whole topic sort of counter productive. First of all at my Parish on Christmas eve vigil the Homily was so beautiful, the priest spoke of joy and read Silent Night and the whole Church started to sing and then the Piano started to play, It was just breath taking and yes every applauded. He was not searching for applause but the moment just caused it to naturally occur. I have no problem after the Homily but If someone was acting up or distracting during well yes then I might have a issue. I think when we look into every detail of everything we can find faults many things that happen during service. I stick to the fact of the the readings, Sacraments and order are the most important and the Homily does its best to tie the readings together into our daily life. Enjoy the Mass and take home the Message and be Blessed. Just my two cents.

 

[ByzCathCantor]

If applause were deemed OK, would the converse be true? Would it be OK to voice disapproval as well?

Please, I’m not trying to be controversial, but it seems that this may be a reason why decorum would dictate that applause are not appropriate in a church setting. We would not want to signal that it would be OK to voice disapproval, as well.

In the Eastern Slavic traditions, we would “recognize” individuals or groups selectively at the end of a Divine Liturgy, by singing “God grant him / her / them many years!” to wish them peace, health, happiness and long life. Normally this is done on festive occasions (wedding anniversaries, baptisms, etc.), or generally on Sundays for all the faithful present.

 

[TheMc]

Spontaneous applause after an especially strong or important point in the homily is one thing. The people are applauding the idea or point being made. I don’t particularly like it, but people do spontaneous things sometimes.

And priests can just as easily preach on why such spontaneous things aren’t at all appropriate during the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.