B
- Status
I
irenaeus1
Guest
You are wrong. It is not the only grounds. Canon 915 is applicable to persons who obstinately persists in manifest grave sin. It says nothing of mortal sin. Certainly, in most cases this means that a person is in the state of mortal sin. But theoretically, we don’t have to know with any absolute certainty the degree of their willful consent or the degree to which they have knowledge of their wrong.
D
DebChris
Guest
By our Baptism, we have been incorporated into the Body of Christ. We are all members of the same family and it is no small matter to deny a brother or sister access to the table from which we feast.
“The sacraments manifest and communicate to men the mystery of communion with the God who is love.” (CC1118). As members of the one Body, our actions should demonstrate that love. “The Spirit heals and transforms those who receive him by conforming them to the Son of God.”(CCC1129). While “anyone who desires to receive Christ in Eucharistic communion must be in a state of grace” (CCC1415), it is not the role of the eucharistic minister to determine who does or does not meet the criteria. All have sinned and fallen short of the greatness of God. As St. Joan of Arc reminds us, we are in a state of grace by the mercy of God.
"The purpose of the sacraments is to sanctify men, to build up the body of Christ, and finally to give worship to God. Because they are signs they also instruct. They not only presuppose faith, by by words and objects they also nourish, strengthen, and express it; that is why they are called ‘sacraments of faith.’ "(Documents of Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, #59).
“…the conscience of the Catholic Christian must pay respectful and obedient attention to the teaching authority of God’s Church. It is the duty of this teaching authority, or Magisterium, to give guidance for applying the enduring norms and values of Christian morality to specific situations of everyday life.” (Basic Teachings for Catholic Religious Education,"17).
The instruction given by Archbishop Burke is directed against those who blatantly reject and rebel against Magisterial teaching.
Many parishes have a shortage of volunteers to become an EMCH. It is a very humbling position, knowing that we do indeed hold the Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ in our hand. It is our role to share the love of Christ with our brothers and sisters. I invite those who think they know what this role entails to answer the call of this important ministry.
In the meantime, let us pray for our brothers and sisters that they may once again accept what the Church teaches and so share in the banquet of our Lord.
“The sacraments manifest and communicate to men the mystery of communion with the God who is love.” (CC1118). As members of the one Body, our actions should demonstrate that love. “The Spirit heals and transforms those who receive him by conforming them to the Son of God.”(CCC1129). While “anyone who desires to receive Christ in Eucharistic communion must be in a state of grace” (CCC1415), it is not the role of the eucharistic minister to determine who does or does not meet the criteria. All have sinned and fallen short of the greatness of God. As St. Joan of Arc reminds us, we are in a state of grace by the mercy of God.
"The purpose of the sacraments is to sanctify men, to build up the body of Christ, and finally to give worship to God. Because they are signs they also instruct. They not only presuppose faith, by by words and objects they also nourish, strengthen, and express it; that is why they are called ‘sacraments of faith.’ "(Documents of Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, #59).
“…the conscience of the Catholic Christian must pay respectful and obedient attention to the teaching authority of God’s Church. It is the duty of this teaching authority, or Magisterium, to give guidance for applying the enduring norms and values of Christian morality to specific situations of everyday life.” (Basic Teachings for Catholic Religious Education,"17).
The instruction given by Archbishop Burke is directed against those who blatantly reject and rebel against Magisterial teaching.
Many parishes have a shortage of volunteers to become an EMCH. It is a very humbling position, knowing that we do indeed hold the Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ in our hand. It is our role to share the love of Christ with our brothers and sisters. I invite those who think they know what this role entails to answer the call of this important ministry.
In the meantime, let us pray for our brothers and sisters that they may once again accept what the Church teaches and so share in the banquet of our Lord.
A
Apryl
Guest
Yeah… right
Ok… I’m a lifeguard at a pool
While I’m off of my perch, one of the swimmers tells me ‘Yeah, I just ate a HUGE corned beef sandwich, and swished it down with a big diet Coke at 1:40’
It is now 2:05
Now, I in no way was the one to decide that eating within an hour of swimming would cause cramps. I’m sure this character knows the risks, but for some reason, doesn’t want to acknowledge them.
If the swimmer hadn’t told me that they had just eaten (and drank) I wouldn’t know that they had eaten (or drank)
Do you think it’s MY judgment that they shouldn’t be swimming?
Mind you: I’m not only responsible for his safety, but the safety of others. I can’t exactly watch someone else if I’m pulling him out of the waters.
So, I’m going to continue to not yet. But I haven’t made any judgements. My comments are in no way a judgement.
A
Apryl
Guest
… and just HOW does this EMHC know that a priest or Bishop has told any one that they are not to receive communion?
Only in these high profile news stories does it make the press.
Jim… I realize that you have a point, but the point has been lost in your obstinence on this issue. I am all for ‘let’s hear the points and make a rational decision’, but this all hinges on the idea that YOU seem to have that EMHCs should dispense communion to any one that darkens their path.
You need to find me where that is. Barring that, you have lost all steam with me.
(and still, I do not yell!)
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
As a life guard, you are in a position of authority, where have the the responsibility to make life saving decisions.
As an EMHC, you are not in a position of authority, where you can determine if a person is in mortal sin and should not be receiving Holy Communion or not. That decision belongs to the Bishop and pastors. Your instruction on this matter, must come from your pastor.
Jim
Jim
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
EMHC’s are informed by their pastors. In my parish, you must be approved and trained by the pastor, to serve as an EMHC. They receive monthly schedules in the mail and other communication from the pastor. They don’t operate independent of the pastor.
Jim
S
Strevel
Guest
I
irenaeus1
Guest
You, as well as many others here, have clearly demonstrated that you do not understand what the real point is. Canon 915 does not address the issue of determining whether one is in the state of grace or not. It only addresses whether one obstinately persists in manifest grave sin. This can be objectively verified and does not require anyone to determine the state of another’s soul.
I should just copy and paste the same answer everytime someone regurgitates the same false dichotomy.
I
irenaeus1
Guest
Geesh, Jim, then you need to check again. Grave matter is only one of the criterion for mortal sin.
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
Right, which is why leaving such matters on who can not receive Holy Communion to an EMHC, is a dangerous idea.
Jim
R
rpp
Guest
The rubrics regarding the use of EMoHCs is that they are never to be scheduled. Scheduling EMoHC a liturgical abuse. Even if the abuse is common and nearly universal, it is still an abuse.
R
rpp
Guest
From Redemptionis Sacramentum
Full text
From Article 8, §2 of *INSTRUCTION ON CERTAIN QUESTIONS REGARDING THE COLLABORATION OF THE NON-ORDAINED FAITHFUL IN THE SACRED MINISTRY OF PRIEST *(Does that earn an award for the longest title of a document?
)Link to artcle.
These have generally been interpreted as forbidding the scheduling of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion. The intent is to keep non-ordained people from *habitually *serving in this capacity. The act of scheduling denotes that they are not really extraordinary.
However, since I am not a liturgist, I am may be wrong. If someone can post something that states that scheduling EMoHCs is permitted, I am open to correction.
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
Of course this interpretation is literal interpretation, and not in accord with the USCCB. Bishops in the US, have allowed for EMHC’s even when a priest is present.From Redemptionis Sacramentum
Full text
From Article 8, §2 of *INSTRUCTION ON CERTAIN QUESTIONS REGARDING THE COLLABORATION OF THE NON-ORDAINED FAITHFUL IN THE SACRED MINISTRY OF PRIEST *(Does that earn an award for the longest title of a document?
Link to artcle.
These have generally been interpreted as forbidding the scheduling of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion. The intent is to keep non-ordained people from *habitually *serving in this capacity. The act of scheduling denotes that they are not really extraordinary.
However, since I am not a liturgist, I am may be wrong. If someone can post something that states that scheduling EMoHCs is permitted, I am open to correction.
However, in my parish, when there is more than one priest, celebrating Mass or there is a deacon, we don’t have EMHC’s, nor are they scheduled for those Masses. However, there are still 3 other Masses, where the pastor will be by himself.
Also in my dioceses as I’m guessing is the case in most, the Bishop has given the priest the authority to make the decision, whether to use EMHC’s or not.
Jim
A
Apryl
Guest
… and still, I have not made a judgement.
What does te ‘OCDS’ in your name mean, anyway?
A
Apryl
Guest
Ok… that’s at your parish. Not at mine, and as far as I know (from the many Catholics that I’m exposed to) not at any in my area.
Still, until you get the mail, what do you do? You don’t know what’s going on that Sunday, or that mass, if there is no mail.
I don’t think your way is very efficient.
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
Apryl
Do your EMHC’s just come out of the pews at will, or is there some system of organization on how and when they approach to serve?
If your EMHC’s don’t have a minimal level of communication with your pastor, then they certainly should not be making judgment calls on who is not allowed to receive Holy Communion.
Jim
This is the operative phrase in your post, “as far as I know.”
Do your EMHC’s just come out of the pews at will, or is there some system of organization on how and when they approach to serve?
If your EMHC’s don’t have a minimal level of communication with your pastor, then they certainly should not be making judgment calls on who is not allowed to receive Holy Communion.
Jim
A
Apryl
Guest
Talk about taking things out of context. Very disingenuous, I must add. You could have at least linked to what we were talking about - no matter, it was the immediately prior post.
I stand behind my comment: as far as I know, there are no schedules going to OTHER PARISHES in my area. Do you know what happens at all parishes? If I were to ask you, and you said, ‘no, it doesn’t’, and it turned out that yes, in fact that situation does or did occur, then what? So, since I do not pretend to speak for every one, I stand behind my comment that AS FAR AS I KNOW NO PARISH IN MY AREA GETS A MAILED NOTIFICATION OF WHO CAN AND CANNOT RECEIVE COMMUNICATION SENT TO THE EMHCs.
What is so hard for you to grasp about that?
And I’m still not passing any judgement.
Get over it.
Can we move on to some other point? Since the point we are standing on now is not judgement? Can you have something to add that would make this conversation move beyond your attempts to misconstrue my comments?
- Status