Archbishop of San Francisco warns of coming war on marriage

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One does not choose to be Black. The idea that homosexual behavior and race are equivalent is specious.
One does not choose one’s race or sex. But one does choose who to marry.

So comparing interracial marriage and same sex marriage is perfectly valid.
Whos definition is it? Why did it take eons for this definition to come about? What makes us so much smarter than all who went before us?
Again, that was not a definition. Why is that so hard to understand?:confused:
 
DrTaffy,
You are conflating sex (sexual preference) with gender. And you are conflating sexual preference with love/marriage.
One is born with gender.
One is born with skin/hair/eye color.
The natural definition of marriage does not discriminate against gender or race - it discriminates against unnatural sexual preferences and proclivities of which there are hundreds and thousands of varieties.
And family/matrimonial law cannot (and ought not) try to accommodate ever variety of sexual inclination and preference.
There are thousands of ways ppl can have an orgasm.
…and people discover these AFTER they are born!
 
One does not choose one’s race or sex. But one does choose who to marry.
Of course, if you’re choosing to marry (and whom) you can also choose not to do so at all.

Choices are made. Only a base animal is forced to give in to their unchoosen desires and physical demands.
 
What does “killing unborn human beings” have to do with the topic of born SS adult couples marrying?
Did you read the article? The tactics used to convince the public that killing unborn human beings has and is being used to convince the public that homosexuality is normal and that these relationships are equivalent to Natural Marriage. Instead of the focus being on the ghoulish practice, it is treated as being “compassionate” to the pregnant woman. Instead of focusing on the reality that homosexual relations and relationships are disordered, unhealthy and sterile the focus is on that nice gay couple or those sweet Lesbians that have been together for 20 years. The public can hardly be bothered about serious domestic and international issues. They certainly are not going to actually think about the results of yet another experiment in social structure.
 
One does not choose one’s race or sex. But one does choose who to marry.

So comparing interracial marriage and same sex marriage is perfectly valid.
Only if one considers race and sexual behavior to be equivalent-which is nonsense on the face of it.
Again, that was not a definition. Why is that so hard to understand?:confused:
Are you contending that Same sex “marriage” is not premised on changing the eons old definition of marriage?
 
You were just pointing out to me earlier about how Thomas Aquinas “explained how reasonable, rational and fact based are Catholic teaching”. But his beliefs about the intellectual inferiority of women and how reproduction works do not seem to be fact based or reasonable and rational. That being the case, why should I assume that what he thought about sexuality was fact based or reasonable and rational?
No, I noted that it’s amazing that Catholic teaching regarding sexuality, marriage and reproduction reflects BIOLOGY, not some sort of blind faith as you inferred. Even in the days of St Thomas, it was understood that men and women were created for each other and for them to co-create the greatest miracle of all, a new human being.

You can hardly claim that homsosexuality has any basis in advancing either a species or the individual involved. It is a dead, sterile and unhealthy practice and can not be biologically, theologically, or sociologically considered equivalent to Natural Marriage.

Biology supports Catholic Teaching and Catholic Teaching reflects biology.

Homosexuality is disordered behavior but those who have this cross to bear are to be treated compassionately just as all other flawed human beings are to be treated. No one is suggesting that people encountering SSA be attacked, prevented from employment, public access, acceptance in clubs, churches or any other space. Basic human rights yes, special rights…to redefine marriage and make everyone else accommodate your aberrant behavior. No.
 
Great article that lays out how killing unborn human beings became socially acceptable and then the law of the land. It requires systematic lies. We know now how wrong this decision was but these modern day worshippers of Baal still have their advocates and supporters
Thanks. As a child is raised up, that is what he learns.

Peace,
Ed
 
Only if one considers race and sexual behavior to be equivalent-which is nonsense on the face of it.

Are you contending that Same sex “marriage” is not premised on changing the eons old definition of marriage?
And this from those that claim guidance by reason, not God. 😉 Talk about staring into the abyss. It’s the adequate of hell.
 
since Canada already has marriage equality, the sky has not fallen,
Actually, so-called gay marriage has created extra burdens for the Canadian government. Furthermore, if Canadian birth rates weren’t so low, they, like Western Europe, wouldn’t need immigration from places where so-called gay “marriage” is illegal.

A straight relationship and a gay relationship can never be equal regardless of what the state says.
and I support the right of two people to enter into civil marriage just as much
Marriage is not a Constitutional right for anyone in the USA.
as I respect the Church’s right to deny sacramental marriage to anyone not meeting their criteria.
Then I fully expect a solid defense of religious freedom when a gay couples wants a cake baked from a Christian business, or the honesty of the prior statement may be called into question.
I don’t understand how this is
That’s what progressives always say when it comes to conservative or orthodox sides of an issue, yet we are all expected to adulate their
Marriage (civil, in the eyes of the state/law) and marriage (religious thing) seem completely separate,
That avoids the central issue of why the state is even involved in marriage in the first place, which is the rearing of healthy children for the continued survival of culture and state.

The state isn’t getting a return on investing in so-called gay “marriage”.
and it just seems like oppression to try and deny any two people the right to the former
:dts: :nope:

It isn’t because the law of traditional marriage applies equally to everyone.
 
One does not choose one’s race or sex. But one does choose who to marry.
That’s why behavior should never be a protected class.
So comparing interracial marriage and same sex marriage is perfectly valid.
:rotfl:

Why do gay relationships need to ride on the backs of interracial, straight ones? Can’t they stand on their own merit?
 
One does not choose one’s race or sex. But one does choose who to marry.

So comparing interracial marriage and same sex marriage is perfectly valid.
Only if the interracial couple are of the same sex…
 
The public can hardly be bothered about serious domestic and international issues. They certainly are not going to actually think about the results of yet another experiment in social structure.
Yes and Pope Francis has tried to expand the focus to include those other serious domestic and international issues as well.
 
Instead of focusing on the reality that homosexual relations and relationships are disordered, unhealthy and sterile the focus is on that nice gay couple or those sweet Lesbians that have been together for 20 years. The public can hardly be bothered about serious domestic and international issues. They certainly are not going to actually think about the results of yet another experiment in social structure.
The only way that the Catholic Church could have any impact on this issue with non-Catholics or non-practicing Catholics would be if all its arguments about the nature of marriage and the purpose of sex made sense to these people. But most people who are not devout, practicing Catholics do not really believe that all sexual relations should or must be open to procreation or that marriage is primarily about raising children.

Therefore, the fact that sex between two gay men cannot produce children is not important for these people, or no more important than the fact that many heterosexual couples might decide to use birth control and chose not to allow procreation. For many people, it is also perfectly acceptable for heterosexual couples to purposely and deliberately choose not to have children, so for these people, the argument that marriage is tied to raising children will not be convincing. So the argument about homosexual relations being “sterile” is not going to be very convincing. Talking about homosexual relations being “disordered” is also not going to go very far with lots of people since that is part of “Catholic speak” and only makes sense to people who know that lingo. I’ve never heard that kind of language outside of Catholic forums or Catholic documents.
 
You certainly created a Strawman.
Deliberately. Modeled after your own to illustrate the point!
I only used what you typed. If I added to what you typed I would be creating a Strawman.
What you added was the assertion that that was a definition of marriage as opposed to just a comment about marriage.
 
DrTaffy,
You are conflating sex (sexual preference) with gender.
Sex and sexual preference are two different things.

Some people do ‘sex’ and ‘gender’ interchangeably, but those who use them to mean different things are those who imply that one’s ‘gender’ (sexual identity) might differ from one’s ‘sex’ (physical attributes) - not a position that I thought you would agree with.
And you are conflating sexual preference with love/marriage.
One is born with gender.
One is born with skin/hair/eye color.
And one cannot change those. (Ignoring the sticky issue of what is actually ‘changed’ by a ‘sex change’ operation.)

But one does choose both the sex and skin colour of the person one chooses to marry. And various people have tried to dictate what choices you are allowed to make in that arena, often based on their personal religious beliefs. And many other people, including me, feel that very strong justification is required for you to be allowed to force your views on another person as regards who they should be allowed to marry.
The natural definition of marriage does not discriminate against gender or race - it discriminates against unnatural sexual preferences and proclivities of which there are hundreds and thousands of varieties.
Sexual preferences for particular genders or skin colours are perfectly natural. So it seems that you have no problem with same sex marriage. 😃
 
Only if one considers race and sexual behavior to be equivalent-which is nonsense on the face of it.
Neither race nor physical gender is a behaviour.
Sex with a particular race or gender is a sexual behaviour.
Marrying someone of a particular race or gender is a behaviour.
At various times some people would try to dictate to you which races or genders you were allowed to marry, generally based on their religious beliefs.
Court after court has found that they do not have the legal or moral right to do so. 🤷
Are you contending that Same sex “marriage” is not premised on changing the eons old definition of marriage?
No, I am contending that what I wrote there was not a definition. Is that really such a slippery concept?

If you want my definition, ask for it and I’ll give it. But given the current lack of communication I am not sure I see the point.
 
Instead of focusing on the reality that homosexual relations and relationships are disordered, unhealthy and sterile the focus is on that nice gay couple or those sweet Lesbians that have been together for 20 years. The public can hardly be bothered about serious domestic and international issues. They certainly are not going to actually think about the results of yet another experiment in social structure.
The Catholic Church is not going to be able to convince non-Catholics or non-practicing Catholics about this issue if they use arguments about the nature of marriage or the purpose of sex that none of these people find convincing. People who are not convinced that all sex must be open to procreation or that marriage is mainly about raising children will not be bothered by the fact that many heterosexual married couples use birth control or that some couple deliberately choose not to have any children. So why would they be bothered by the fact that two gay men on their own cannot produce any children?

Therefore, making an argument about gay relationships being “sterile” will not be very convincing to a lot of people and talking about gay relationships being “disordered” will also not go very far since this a part of Catholic lingo that only other Catholics will understand.
 
No, I noted that it’s amazing that Catholic teaching regarding sexuality, marriage and reproduction reflects BIOLOGY, not some sort of blind faith as you inferred. Even in the days of St Thomas, it was understood that men and women were created for each other and for them to co-create the greatest miracle of all, a new human being.

You can hardly claim that homsosexuality has any basis in advancing either a species or the individual involved. It is a dead, sterile and unhealthy practice and can not be biologically, theologically, or sociologically considered equivalent to Natural Marriage.

Biology supports Catholic Teaching and Catholic Teaching reflects biology.

Homosexuality is disordered behavior but those who have this cross to bear are to be treated compassionately just as all other flawed human beings are to be treated. No one is suggesting that people encountering SSA be attacked, prevented from employment, public access, acceptance in clubs, churches or any other space. Basic human rights yes, special rights…to redefine marriage and make everyone else accommodate your aberrant behavior. No.
The Catholic Church is not going to be able to convince non-Catholics or non-practicing Catholics about this issue if they use arguments about the nature of marriage or the purpose of sex that none of these people find convincing. People who are not convinced that all sex must be open to procreation or that marriage is mainly about raising children will not be bothered by the fact that many heterosexual married couples use birth control or that some couple deliberately choose not to have any children. So why would they be bothered by the fact that two gay men on their own cannot produce any children?

Therefore, making an argument about gay relationships being “sterile” will not be very convincing to a lot of people and talking about gay relationships being “disordered” will also not go very far since this a part of Catholic lingo that only other Catholics will understand.
 
Speaking of the “War on Marriage”

I am wondering what would happen if a Catholic judge were to refuse to conduct a same sex marriage. :confused:
 
Sorry for what was basically a double post above above. Since the first one disappeared, I tried posting it again :o
 
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