Archdiocese of Cincinnati expands morals clause in teacher contracts

[Tony_Micelli]

Since the priest would not know that they are teaching at a Catholic School - there is zero chance that he will give your hypothetical penance.

I went to the priest in my school when I taught there. I think this contract is implying public sins and not private even though it’s not explicitly distinguished. What if there was a gay music teacher who struggled like all of us? Would this struggle be grounds for dismissal assuming they are private indiscretions?

 

[Just_Lurking]

… and there’s the key provision! They’re not hiring ‘teachers’, they’re hiring ‘teacher-ministers’ who “minister in a faith community.”

It’s an interesting spin, and one that they evidently hope will enable them to take advantage of recent rulings. However, I wonder what unexpected side effects will present themselves from this tack?

I guess they need to create a “food service minister” position to deal with other school employees (see here).

 

[JRKH]

I went to the priest in my school when I taught there.

But you didn’t have to - and that is the point. A person can go to another priest in a different parish and, in many cases, can choose to confess from behind a screen.

I think this contract is implying public sins and not private even though it’s not explicitly distinguished. What if there was a gay music teacher who struggled like all of us? Would this struggle be grounds for dismissal assuming they are private indiscretions?

One would hope that it would be handled delicately.

Peace
James

 

[Coatimundi]

I guess they need to create a “food service minister” position to deal with other school employees (see here).

If the school refused to hire him simply because they discovered he was gay, then they are in violation of Massachusetts law. He has filed suit against them, and the school is likely to settle out-of-court.

A food service manager, or a person in a similar position, does not serve as a role model for students, unlike classroom teachers or school principals. I don’t see why a food service manager would need to be considered such. However, the school could probably restrict the speech of an employee so they did not contradict Catholic doctrine on faith or morals.

 

[Elizium23]

I agree with you that a priest shouldn’t however that contract doesn’t say that confessed private sins are not grounds for dismissal. The contract makes it sound like you are held to a standard few can achieve–sanctity. I sin without number, maybe they should take my children away from me lest they are scandalized.

Again, I give the example of a pregnant single teacher who could be fired for essentially being pregnant while a guy involved probably wouldn’t be disciplined.

I think only public and scandalous sins should be grounds for dismissal, and not confessed private ones. This contract seems to me to be about protecting the church from lawsuits rather than ensuring a good catholic faculty

Let us acquaint you with an area of sacramental theology known as the Seal of the Confessional. It says that all confessed sins are utterly secret and the priest may never reveal them under any circumstance at all.

Therefore it would be nonsensical for a contract to have any express or implied clause about confessed sins. An employee’s workplace can never know whether her sins were confessed or not, they cannot compel her to reveal this, and they certainly can never get the priest to say so. Likewise, because the Seal of the Confessional requires the priest not compel the penitent to reveal any sins, the priest may not impose a penance that will cause this effect. Such as quitting, or these things you have suggested. That would be an invalid and unenforceable penance, and any reasonable person could rightly refuse to fulfil it.

I understand where you are heading with this; that a mortal sin properly confessed is forgiven and forgotten and should not be counted against an employee. But you’re missing the forest for the trees here. The spirit of the contract is about public sins. It really is. It’s about giving scandal for things that are likely to be widely known. Fornication is hardly a private sin, despite it happening late at night between only two people in a darkened room. It is between two people who can rarely keep a secret. It is between two people who likely have friends who might be aware that they didn’t come home that night. If a woman fornicates and doesn’t become pregnant and then confesses that sin validly, then possibly, just possibly there is no scandal as long as nobody but the priest ever finds out she did it. And I sincerely doubt that a mistake of the nature of a one-night stand will be punished by termination of a job.

We don’t know the specifics of the various cases which led us here to this contract reform. Is it not likely that the teachers who were fired for premarital sex were habitual offenders? Is it not possible that their offenses were known to more than just a few people and it was beginning to cause controversy and pain for their employers? It is uncharitable to assume that these schools were being punitive and petty when they fired these teachers. It is calumny to say that they are being somehow sexist or unfair when all they are doing is defending the Catholic faith and defending the integrity of their employment contracts.

I commend the ArchCin on their courage to bring policy into harmony with the current culture and defend the faith even when it is unpopular and controversial to do so.

 

[Trader]

That still doesn’t make sense to me. How can there be both a shortage of teachers and of jobs? Should be one or the other. I still believe if Catholic schools made a serious effort, it could be done. I know of at least some Protestant schools which manage to hire only Protestant teachers-- sometimes even the teachers come from foreign countries, but the schools do not want to be compromised in their mission. I know of Protestant schools which have morality clauses that the parents and students have to sign, too. It varies from country to country, and school to school, of course.

Morals clauses are common in many contracts. I once briefly worked at a retail store with a 18 year old who had a full football scholarship at a Protestant college. That summer he was caught stealing 4 Palm Pilots worth about $1600 from his employer. He plead guilty to one count of felony theft and the college cancelled his scholarship. They had a policy of not giving $100,000 scholarships to convicted felons.

You might also ask Tiger Woods how much money he lost in endorsements when his bad behavior became public. You don’t have to be a religious organization to protect yourself from scandal. Gloria Swanson was one of the first actresses to have a morals clauses in her studio contract. That was so long ago that even Hollywood studios cared about scandal.

And I take it she did not sue?

Unfortunately, she did sue. First she filed a complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, which found that she was discriminated against for the disability of infertility. That was nonsense, but under President Obama, a lot of similar foolish rulings were made by the EEOC. After the 9-0 Supreme Court ruling in the Hosanna Tabor case, the commission decided not to enforce its own ruling. The teacher then filed suit in federal court, but as far as I know the case has not gone to trial. I would be very surprised if she wins. Bishop Rhoades has been very firm on holding fast to Catholic teaching on the family, and a settlement in favor of the plaintiff is not at all likely.

journalgazette.net/article/20120424/LOCAL03/120429757

 

[Mulligan2]

“Be a good Catholic or you’re fired.” So that’s what it’s come to?? I always thought that living your faith was something people did voluntarily. This contract takes the ‘voluntary’ part of the equation away, and replaces it with coercion and intimidation. Not very Christian. And why the emphasis, once again, on all things pertaining to sex? This plays right into the stereotype that Catholics oppose sex. Quite frankly, it is a very bad idea for the archdiocese of Cincinnati to pursue this contract. For every one person that says “yeah, right on!”, another ten or more will be turned off completely, especially the younger generations. Be prepared for emptier pews.

 

[Elizium23]

“Be a good Catholic or you’re fired.” So that’s what it’s come to?? I always thought that living your faith was something people did voluntarily. This contract takes the ‘voluntary’ part of the equation away, and replaces it with coercion and intimidation. Not very Christian. And why the emphasis, once again, on all things pertaining to sex? This plays right into the stereotype that Catholics oppose sex. Quite frankly, it is a very bad idea for the archdiocese of Cincinnati to pursue this contract. For every one person that says “yeah, right on!”, another ten or more will be turned off completely, especially the younger generations. Be prepared for emptier pews.

“Perhaps the time has come to say farewell to the idea of traditionally Catholic cultures. Maybe we are facing a new and different kind of epoch in the Church’s history, where Christianity will again be characterised more by the mustard seed, where it will exist in small, insignificant groups that nonetheless live an intensive struggle against evil and bring the good into the world – that let God in.”

I look forward to a smaller, more faithful Church, one in which there are not so many pretenders who are guilty of taking the Lord’s name in vain. And by this phrase I do not mean that they utter profanity, I mean that they persist in heresy and schism and yet continue to enjoy the benefits of Catholics in good standing. It is not fair to faithful Catholics when pro-abortion politicians and homosexualist activists and a host of others are admitted to participation in Holy Communion by the very shepherds who are entrusted with safeguarding the flock and the Deposit of Faith. I welcome greater strictures on the faith of those who are entrusted with passing on the faith. Teachers have an especially sensitive duty in the context of the Church. While parents must always remain the primary educators of their children and the Domestic Church, parents cannot always be depended on to accurately transmit the faith and their time with children is often taken up by sleep periods and preparing meals and career aspirations, so much of the teaching is left to the teachers. These teachers must be trustworthy, faithful people of unassailable faith and steadfast love for the Church. If these teachers comport themselves in a manner not in keeping with the faith, how can they expect to be examples and role models for young, impressionable children? Even sponsors for Baptism and Confirmation must meet requirements of being Catholics in good standing, so too should teachers in Catholic schools.

If these schools are not willing to enact such regulations upon their education staff then I hope they wither and die. And many are. Catholic schools, from the top universities down to the lowly preschools, are losing their identity and losing their clientele. And who do we have to blame for these losses? Liberalism, secularism, progressivism, homosexualism, a Culture of Death, Population Control. Because the vast majority of Catholic families are steadily contracepting themselves out of existence and have been for decades since Vatican II. It is up to those who do not contracept, those who reproduce as the Lord commanded, and hold true to the Magisterium and the hierarchy of the Church, it is up to these families to carry on the torch as a smaller, more faithful Church. It is up to these families to quietly replace the howling liberals, heretics and apostates who will surely die off as the Biological Solution takes effect.

More schools will close and more will lose their Catholic identity. It will get worse before it gets better. I only pray that bishops are brave enough to stand up for the faith and revoke Catholic identity from those schools who have strayed just too far from their roots, in order that the deception of good Catholics be stopped.

 

[k5rakitan]

What I want to know is how we can encourage our teachers and ministers to seek help for their sinful ways instead of simply diving further into the closet.

 

[oldburkes]

“Be a good Catholic or you’re fired.” So that’s what it’s come to?? I always thought that living your faith was something people did voluntarily. This contract takes the ‘voluntary’ part of the equation away, and replaces it with coercion and intimidation. Not very Christian. And why the emphasis, once again, on all things pertaining to sex? This plays right into the stereotype that Catholics oppose sex. Quite frankly, it is a very bad idea for the archdiocese of Cincinnati to pursue this contract. For every one person that says “yeah, right on!”, another ten or more will be turned off completely, especially the younger generations. Be prepared for emptier pews.

It always amuses me when people try to tell me what is and isn’t Christian about my behavior when they disagree with me BEING Christian. It’s almost like saying that if I went around agreeing with everything that everybody does, I would, then, fit their Christian description.
And that’s no sterotype. Catholics do oppose sex…when it’s closed to the gift of life.

 

[Elizium23]

“Be a good Catholic or you’re fired.” So that’s what it’s come to?? I always thought that living your faith was something people did voluntarily. This contract takes the ‘voluntary’ part of the equation away, and replaces it with coercion and intimidation. Not very Christian. And why the emphasis, once again, on all things pertaining to sex? This plays right into the stereotype that Catholics oppose sex. Quite frankly, it is a very bad idea for the archdiocese of Cincinnati to pursue this contract. For every one person that says “yeah, right on!”, another ten or more will be turned off completely, especially the younger generations. Be prepared for emptier pews.

We all have a choice to make: either we follow Christ or we condemn ourselves to Hell. In that sense, there is free will to choose damnation, and the Christian life is voluntary. But I wouldn’t call it voluntary when we are called to holiness and obligated by our Baptism to glorify God and spread His Gospel.

The voluntary part here is taking a job. A person has free will to choose or not to be a teacher. If she wishes to be a teacher then these are the rules she must follow in the ArchCin. In choosing to be a teacher, she takes on all the aspects of that position, as it is now titled, ministry. If at any time she feels that her life journey is taking her to a place where she cannot comply with the contract, then she is free to tender her resignation and seek another job that is not so demanding. See how voluntary it all is? What is not voluntary for teachers is being an example and role model to young children about Who Christ is, what He teaches, and where He is leading us. Catholic teachers are called to be witnesses to the Faith and obedient to the Church.

 

[DoGodsBidding]

We all have a choice to make: either we follow Christ or we condemn ourselves to Hell. In that sense, there is free will to choose damnation, and the Christian life is voluntary. But I wouldn’t call it voluntary when we are called to holiness and obligated by our Baptism to glorify God and spread His Gospel.

The voluntary part here is taking a job. A person has free will to choose or not to be a teacher. If she wishes to be a teacher then these are the rules she must follow in the ArchCin. In choosing to be a teacher, she takes on all the aspects of that position, as it is now titled, ministry. If at any time she feels that her life journey is taking her to a place where she cannot comply with the contract, then she is free to tender her resignation and seek another job that is not so demanding. See how voluntary it all is? What is not voluntary for teachers is being an example and role model to young children about Who Christ is, what He teaches, and where He is leading us. Catholic teachers are called to be witnesses to the Faith and obedient to the Church.

 

[Mulligan2]

We all have a choice to make: either we follow Christ or we condemn ourselves to Hell. In that sense, there is free will to choose damnation, and the Christian life is voluntary. But I wouldn’t call it voluntary when we are called to holiness and obligated by our Baptism to glorify God and spread His Gospel.

The voluntary part here is taking a job. A person has free will to choose or not to be a teacher. If she wishes to be a teacher then these are the rules she must follow in the ArchCin. In choosing to be a teacher, she takes on all the aspects of that position, as it is now titled, ministry. If at any time she feels that her life journey is taking her to a place where she cannot comply with the contract, then she is free to tender her resignation and seek another job that is not so demanding. See how voluntary it all is? What is not voluntary for teachers is being an example and role model to young children about Who Christ is, what He teaches, and where He is leading us. Catholic teachers are called to be witnesses to the Faith and obedient to the Church.

In reference to your comment that “the voluntary part here is taking a job.” Do you have the same standard for pharmacists, for instance, who refuse to fill prescriptions they don’t approve of? By your criteria, they should be fired if they refuse.

 

[Cider]

“Such conduct or lifestyle that is in contradiction to Catholic doctrine or morals includes, but is not limited to, improper use of social media/communication, public support of or publicly living together outside marriage, public support of or sexual activity out of wedlock, public support of or homosexual lifestyle, public support of or use of abortion, public support of or use of a surrogate mother, public support of or use of in vitro fertilization or artificial insemination, public membership in organizations whose mission and message are incompatible with Catholic doctrine or morals, and/or flagrant deceit or dishonesty.”

Read more: wlwt.com/news/archdiocese-of-cincinnati-expands-moral-clause-in-teacher-contracts/24846662#ixzz2vwcOFeS8

Looks good to me

“We found that a number of our teachers weren’t really clear on what would be outside of Catholic teaching,” Dan Andriacco, spokesman for the Cincinnati Archdiocese said.

Read more: wlwt.com/news/archdiocese-of-cincinnati-expands-moral-clause-in-teacher-contracts/24846662#ixzz2vwceqO3c

Really?

 

[Mulligan2]

I look forward to a smaller, more faithful Church,

I don’t understand this mindset, and I fail to see what good can come of it. These reactionary and rigid contractual guidelines might make those who adhere to them feel a sense of superiority over those who don’t, but what good does that do? Surely the goal of Catholicism isn’t to feel a sense of entitlement over others. I have the opposite wish, and look forward to a larger, more inclusive church.

 

[KevinAK]

The archdiocese that I’m in.

Me too.

 

[ProVobis]

I don’t understand this mindset, and I fail to see what good can come of it. These reactionary and rigid contractual guidelines might make those who adhere to them feel a sense of superiority over those who don’t, but what good does that do? Surely the goal of Catholicism isn’t to feel a sense of entitlement over others. I have the opposite wish, and look forward to a larger, more inclusive church.

Christ did say “Come follow Me,” didn’t He? What is the Church supposed to do when people reject Christ? Or God and the Ten Commandments, for that matter?

 

[Gordon_Sims]

"Be a good Catholic or you’re fired." So that’s what it’s come to??

As a parent whose kids have been told by a Catholic teacher in a Catholic school that abortion is a choice that saves women’s lives, I’m all for this.

As a parent whose kids have been told by a Catholic teacher in a Catholic school that abortion isn’t murder and the Church’s position on it is still up in the air, I’m all for this.

As a parent whose kids have been told by a Catholic teacher in a Catholic school that women in the priesthood isn’t far off, I’m all for this.

As a parent whose pre-teen daughter was given a CD by a Catholic teacher in a Catholic school that contained lyrics that would be bleeped on the radio, I’m all for this.

As a parent whose son was taught by a teacher in his Catholic high school that the Church doesn’t hold a monopoly on truth and has ruined more lives than She’s saved, I’m all for this.

If an employee of a Catholic school is not only not going to enforce the teachings of the Church, but is going to openly speak out against them, the school should not only have a right to get rid of the teacher but should view it as a duty.

 

[Gorgias]

"Tony Micelli:

Hypothetically, your penance could be to quit teaching.

Let us acquaint you with an area of sacramental theology known as the Seal of the Confessional. It says that all confessed sins are utterly secret and the priest may never reveal them under any circumstance at all.

Moreover, he cannot require that a penitent implicate himself as a condition of absolution or as a penance he imposes.

 

[JRKH]

I don’t understand this mindset, and I fail to see what good can come of it.

The good that can come of it is that the schools will have teachers who stand squarely with the Church (at least publicly). The children do not get mixed messages from people who are in authority over them.
The Church views these matters as critical to the formation and protection of the little souls entrusted to them.

These reactionary and rigid contractual guidelines might make those who adhere to them feel a sense of superiority over those who don’t, but what good does that do? Surely the goal of Catholicism isn’t to feel a sense of entitlement over others.

You are right that the goal of Catholicism is not to feel entitlement over others but entitlement and superiority are certainly not the intent of the guidelines. If a person WERE to feel as you describe above they would be guilty of the sin of pride.

I have the opposite wish, and look forward to a larger, more inclusive church.

I look forward to this too…where I suspect we might differ is in what we mean by “more inclusive” - - but that would be a whole new thread.

Peace
James