Are all prophets sinless?

[Jay53]

I asked this question in another thread, but no one answered, so I think I have to give it it’s own thread.

It has been said in previous threads that all prophets are sinless (i.e. Abraham, Moses, Muhammad, etc.). I would like to know:

1. Is this just an Islamic belief? I know Christians don’t believe this, but are there any other religions that believe this?
2. Where did this belief come from - who first put forth the idea that all prophets are sinless?
3. For those that believe this: How do you reconcile in your minds this belief vs. the reality of the sins that prophets have committed that have been documented.
   (For example, Abraham’s adultery with Hagar, Muhammad’s lying and murder etc.)
4. In Islam, is this belief necessary in order to excuse/justify the sins of Muhammad and as a result all the other prophets just get lumped into this belief?

Please note that I don’t wish to discuss or judge the actual sins of prophets. I’m just interested in the belief that prophets are sinless and how this belief remains in the face of contrary evidence.

Thank you.

 

[Bill_Pick]

I asked this question in another thread, but no one answered, so I think I have to give it it’s own thread.

It has been said in previous threads that all prophets are sinless (i.e. Abraham, Moses, Muhammad, etc.). I would like to know:

1. Is this just an Islamic belief? I know Christians don’t believe this, but are there any other religions that believe this?
2. Where did this belief come from - who first put forth the idea that all prophets are sinless?
3. For those that believe this: How do you reconcile in your minds this belief vs. the reality of the sins that prophets have committed that have been documented.
   (For example, Abraham’s adultery with Hagar, Muhammad’s lying and murder etc.)
4. In Islam, is this belief necessary in order to excuse/justify the sins of Muhammad and as a result all the other prophets just get lumped into this belief?

Please note that I don’t wish to discuss or judge the actual sins of prophets. I’m just interested in the belief that prophets are sinless and how this belief remains in the face of contrary evidence.

Thank you.

Christ and John the baptists,all the rest was with sin.

 

[Jay53]

Christ and John the baptists,all the rest was with sin.

I agree, although I didn’t know John the Baptist was considered sinless. ??? However, there are some posters here who have asserted that ALL prophets are sinless - I’m trying to figure out who believes this and why.

Thank you for your response.

 

[inJESUS]

It is my understanding that it is an islamic thing and yes you guessed it, all the prophets’ sins mentionned in the Bible were a “corruption of Jews” so in Islam Adam disobeying Allah becomes a “mistake” and not a sin (after all who says disobeying God is a sin) and whatever Muhammad did was not a sin, even desiring a married woman so maybe one of the 10 commandments was actually a “Jewish invention” because whatever Muhammad did is purity itself and whatever contradicts it is false/corrupt/israiliyyat/false hadith/world conspiracy against Muhammad.

 

[Eucharisted]

Not all Muslims believe in the sinlessness of Mohammed, some believe he did sin.

Sin, in Islam, dose not just cover evil actions but also transmitting revelations wrongly; it is considered an offense against God to transmit revelation wrongly.

Muslims believe Mohammed was free from sin in regards to not only recieving revelation but also transmitting it. Most Muslims also believe he was protected from committing actual sins, i.e., he was all-holy. But some believe that he did commit actual sins, based on a surah.

 

[inJESUS]

Sin, in Islam, dose not just cover evil actions but also transmitting revelations wrongly; it is considered an offense against God to transmit revelation wrongly.

.

i think this is a non-issue; what prophet will knowingly transmit revelation wrongly? in Islam it is believed that satan casts his words to all prophets ( since it happened to Muhammad so he claimed the same about all prophets) but that Allah cancels them and the jinn that used to command Muhammad turned from a devilish to a good Muslim jinn.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Jesus said there would be ‘false prophets after him’
Surmising then that prophets after him are false and therefore definitely not sinless.

Matthew 7 15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in the clothing of sheep, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Matthew 24 11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall seduce many.

Matthew 24
24 For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect.

 

[inJESUS]

Jesus said there would be ‘false prophets after him’
Surmising then that prophets after him are false and therefore definitely not sinless.

naaah, easy, these fall under the “corrupt” Bible and Muslims cannot take them seriously since they believe what Muhammad says, not what Jesus warns against 600 years before the birth of Muhammad bin Abdallah.

 

[dianaiad]

I asked this question in another thread, but no one answered, so I think I have to give it it’s own thread.

It has been said in previous threads that all prophets are sinless (i.e. Abraham, Moses, Muhammad, etc.). I would like to know:

1. Is this just an Islamic belief? I know Christians don’t believe this, but are there any other religions that believe this?
2. Where did this belief come from - who first put forth the idea that all prophets are sinless?
3. For those that believe this: How do you reconcile in your minds this belief vs. the reality of the sins that prophets have committed that have been documented.
   (For example, Abraham’s adultery with Hagar, Muhammad’s lying and murder etc.)
4. In Islam, is this belief necessary in order to excuse/justify the sins of Muhammad and as a result all the other prophets just get lumped into this belief?

Please note that I don’t wish to discuss or judge the actual sins of prophets. I’m just interested in the belief that prophets are sinless and how this belief remains in the face of contrary evidence.

Thank you.

Does anybody believe this…even Muslims? I honestly do not know.

 

[dianaiad]

Christ and John the baptists,all the rest was with sin.

Wait.

John the Baptist was sinless?

'splain, please?

 

[dianaiad]

Jesus said there would be ‘false prophets after him’
Surmising then that prophets after him are false and therefore definitely not sinless.

Matthew 7 15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in the clothing of sheep, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Matthew 24 11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall seduce many.

Matthew 24
24 For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect.

I would rather have supposed that this warning was more about the fact that there would be false prophets among the true ones and that all should be careful, not that all prophets would be sinful;

After all, as far as I have figured, from reading the bible, every single prophet mentioned in there sinned, and at least one of their sins was commented upon. Abraham lied. David was an adulterer. With the possible exceptions of Enoch and Melchezedek (the mention of whom was very brief…and to my surprise, I found out that many Christian scholars think that Mechezedek may have been a ‘pre-incarnation’ of Christ Himself, anyway), all of 'em sinned to some extent.

Therefore the fact that prophets were human, and could sin, was well understood; so that doesn’t seem to be it.

In fact, I have always figured that all those warnings about false prophets meant that there would be ‘true’ ones for the false ones to pretend to; after all, if there were to be no ‘true’ prophets, why warn against only false ones? Why not just say 'there won’t be any?"

Of course, that last would be a problem, since the writer would then be condemning himself…

hmmmnnnn…

 

[inJESUS]

Jesus did not say there won;t be true prophets but said He will send teachers and prophets and when He did the disciples and believers welcomed them . Muslims do not believe Jesus sent Muhammad. Biblically speaking, Muhammad could not be a prophet since Jesus is the seal and fulfillment of the law and prophets and since he was not sent by Jesus later.

 

[Reader_John]

I asked this question in another thread, but no one answered, so I think I have to give it it’s own thread.

It has been said in previous threads that all prophets are sinless (i.e. Abraham, Moses, Muhammad, etc.). I would like to know:

1. Is this just an Islamic belief? I know Christians don’t believe this, but are there any other religions that believe this?
2. Where did this belief come from - who first put forth the idea that all prophets are sinless?
3. For those that believe this: How do you reconcile in your minds this belief vs. the reality of the sins that prophets have committed that have been documented.
   (For example, Abraham’s adultery with Hagar, Muhammad’s lying and murder etc.)
4. In Islam, is this belief necessary in order to excuse/justify the sins of Muhammad and as a result all the other prophets just get lumped into this belief?

Please note that I don’t wish to discuss or judge the actual sins of prophets. I’m just interested in the belief that prophets are sinless and how this belief remains in the face of contrary evidence.

Thank you.

I don’t know enough about Islam to answer your questions to that effect, but of the Old Testament prophets, none of them were sinless. The only person who was perfectly sinless was Christ. He was perfectly sinless, yet yielded Himself to the consequences of sin, which is death, in order to free us from our sins. (Hebrews Chapters 8 and 9)

Moses was certainly not sinless as one example in Numbers 20 says, when Moses does not believe in God, that Moses will not lead the people into the promised land.

Sins need not be things such as fornication or murder. They can also include not trusting in God. While Christ was (in some Gospels) in agony before His Crucifixion, He ultimately trusted in God. Even crying “My God, My God, why have You forsaken me?” we must also take the time to read the rest of the Psalm and we’ll quickly see that even in the affliction, Christ completely trusted in God; an action Moses was unable to do.

 

[Reuben_J]

I don’t know enough about Islam to answer your questions to that effect, but of the Old Testament prophets, none of them were sinless. The only person who was perfectly sinless was Christ. He was perfectly sinless, yet yielded Himself to the consequences of sin, which is death, in order to free us from our sins. (Hebrews Chapters 8 and 9)

Moses was certainly not sinless as one example in Numbers 20 says, when Moses does not believe in God, that Moses will not lead the people into the promised land.

Sins need not be things such as fornication or murder. They can also include not trusting in God. While Christ was (in some Gospels) in agony before His Crucifixion, He ultimately trusted in God. Even crying “My God, My God, why have You forsaken me?” we must also take the time to read the rest of the Psalm and we’ll quickly see that even in the affliction, Christ completely trusted in God; an action Moses was unable to do.

Good post. BTW welcome to the forum.

I think what have been said ( including all preceding posts) are right because they are facts. Biblical prophets sinned and made mistakes one time or the other in their lives. God chose them to be his prophets not because they were sinless but because it’s God’s prerogative. Only God really knows the full reason for His decision but what we know are what been revealed.

This thread in a greater sense addresses Islam’s doctrine that prophets were sinless, they only made ‘mistakes’.

What could be a perpetual exasperation for Christians in bringing this matter with them is their insistence that the sins prophets committed in the Bible are ‘invented’ by the Jews. Their reasons for saying that range from Jews self-serving interest, racial jealousy to ‘so that they could do these sins with impunity since prophets did them’.

Muslims thus believe that whatever prophets did was sanctioned by God. Prophets actions were therefore to be emulated and followed by believers today.

Muslims stand by this doctrine so that all Mohammad did and preached would be justified especially those that are against Jesus’ teaching.

Some of Mohammad’s teachings and deeds that need to be justified include:

• Divorce
• Polygamy
• Lying (it’s allowed in Islam)
• Killing (if it’s in the cause of Islam)

This list is not exhaustive but these are what I can think with certainty at the moment. Poster like R_not is more knowledgeable on this.

God bless.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

Salaam/ Peace

Christ and John the baptists,all the rest was with sin.

Good to know that at least one Christian thinks another Prophet was also sinless.

So , altogehtyer 3 persons Mother Mary , Jesus , John ( pbut) were sinless . Among these 3 , Jesus (p) is God to you , so 2 were sinless ?

 

[Muslim_Woman]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

Salaam/ Peace

…
(For example, Abraham’s adultery with Hagar,

Muslims reject all the dirty allegations Bible has against Prophets (pbut). Hagar (ra ) was his wife ; No Prophet including David (p) committed any adultery.

Do u really think , God sent sinners to teach us about God ?

Muhammad’s lying and murder etc.)

Muhammed (p) was called as Al Amin ( who speaks truth ) since childhood.

He forgave the killers of his daughter , uncle .He forgave others when he had 10 thousands armed soldiers with him . This has been explained several times .

Prophets sometimes made mistakes like Adam (p) forgot the command of God , Moses (p) accidently killed a man etc . They offered their sincere repentace & God forgave them . Sinners are those who willingly commit sin & don’t ask for forgiveness because of arroagance , pride like Satan , Pharaon etc.

 

[paarsurrey]

Originally Posted by BILL PICK :
Christ and John the baptists,all the rest was with sin.

I agree, although I didn’t know John the Baptist was considered sinless. ??? However, there are some posters here who have asserted that ALL prophets are sinless - I’m trying to figure out who believes this and why.

Thank you for your response.

Hi

I think, the only reason you agree that John the Baptist was also sinless is, as he Baptised Jesus and Jesus agreed to be baptised by him.

I love Jesus and John the Baptist and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

 

[Thorwald]

Wait.

John the Baptist was sinless?

'splain, please?

To Add Humour:

He will take the least, and make them the greatest.

 

[paarsurrey]

I would rather have supposed that this warning was more about the fact that there would be false prophets among the true ones and that all should be careful, not that all prophets would be sinful;

After all, as far as I have figured, from reading the bible, every single prophet mentioned in there sinned, and at least one of their sins was commented upon. Abraham lied. David was an adulterer. With the possible exceptions of Enoch and Melchezedek (the mention of whom was very brief…and to my surprise, I found out that many Christian scholars think that Mechezedek may have been a ‘pre-incarnation’ of Christ Himself, anyway), all of 'em sinned to some extent.

Therefore the fact that prophets were human, and could sin, was well understood; so that doesn’t seem to be it.

In fact, I have always figured that all those warnings about false prophets meant that there would be ‘true’ ones for the false ones to pretend to; after all, if there were to be no ‘true’ prophets, why warn against only false ones? Why not just say 'there won’t be any?"

Of course, that last would be a problem, since the writer would then be condemning himself…

hmmmnnnn…

I agree with you.

I wonder if Jesus would have agreed with the Catholics in this belief. If he had thought that Adam was a sinful person, then why he opted him for being a father. Jesus said he was a Son of Man as per the Catholic Bible or Son of Adam as per the Protestant Bible.

Jesus father Adam could not be sinful.

So either Adam, Eve, Jesus and Mary were all sinless or… I leave it for the Catholics.

I love Adam, Eve, Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

 

[Sabbath_Keeper]

Why even argue this from a Biblical stand point when Muslims reject all the was written and interpret the Torah the way they want to? If you are going to argue from a biblical stand point than only one verse need be applied “ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.” The only manifistation of humanity that is without sin is Jesus the Christ, so, unless the prophets, past present and future, are precursors or reappearances of Jesus then they would have sin in their lives. End of story.