Are Atheists “good” people?

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Laurent

So , you place yourself (a kind of) above atheists ??

I try not to place myself above anyone. God does all the placing.
 
Jimmy_B said:
Are Atheists “good” people?

Is possible to be an Atheist, reject God and be a “good” person?

In other words, can one who reject’s God, truly be “nice” or be a “good” person”?

Do people who reject God go to Heaven?

Atheists do not believe in Heaven…do they?

“Good” people go to heaven…. right?

Do Atheist go to Heaven?

Your thoughts?
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  1. *]People who act as if they were Catholics, or at least as if they were astute “listeners” of natural law, are “good people”.

    *]Those who culpably reject God do not go to heaven.

    Is it possible for an “atheist” to satisfy the above two conditions?

    Ask an atheist!

    Question to atheists: Can you satisfy the above two conditions?
 
Laurent_LUG said:
Here is “the struggle” , I do not believe (in it) !!
Why should we // I ??

Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), september 18, 2008
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I might not believe in Paris, but it still might be where I end up. (Though I’d rather not be kidnapped by Parisian pirates and taken to their headquarters beneath the Rue de Rivoli!)

You don’t have to believe in a reality for that reality to be real.
 
Laurent

Here is “the struggle” , I do not believe (in it) !!
Why should we // I ??

I’d be more inclined to dialogue with you if you would make a stronger effort to clarify your own thoughts.

What if I just answered your brief question above with an answer just as brief? Such as:
"Why shouldn’t we?"

The ball is back in your court. Please try bouncing it longer and farther toward the hoop that makes you a couple of points.

Thanks,
Charlie
 
CatsAndDogs said:
You don’t have to believe in a reality for that reality to be real.
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I agree !!
Why ?? We do live in the present 🙂

Charlemagne II ,
I think my question/answer was quite loud & clear ??
Obvious not !!
I’m someone using not many words 😉
An answer don’t have to be 5 pages long ,
it’s better to go straight to point , without detours !! 😉
As long as we understand one another 🙂

About my own thoughts , read all my answers
on this forum & the greenspun forum (rip) ,
(Overthere , I was using the same nick)
I’m quite sure you will understand me 🙂

Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), september 18, 2008
 
It’s probably echoed throughout this thread, but, doesn’t it depend on the athiest? This could be turned around, “Are Catholics “bad” people?”
 
Laurent_LUG said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatsAndDogs View Post
You don’t have to believe in a reality for that reality to be real.

I agree !!
Why ?? We do live in the present
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So, what does our living in the present have to do with your not believing in a reality which you choose not to believe in?

I understand your english is “different” from that of a native speaker, but try to at least get your thoughts actually presented, and don’t rely on our mindreading skills, as mine are REALLY bad these days, due to various atmospheric considerations.
 
CatsAndDogs said:
So, what does our living in the present have to do with your not believing in a reality which you choose not to believe in?
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Good interesting question 🙂
The past , present & future !!
Even I do believe in the past & future ,
you’ll never what the future will bring !!

Religion , why should I believe in this subject ??

Anyway , I live now , not tomorrow ,
just as anyone else , if we knew the future ,
The question would be , why do we live ??
I understand your english is “different” from that of a native speaker, but try to at least get your thoughts actually presented, and don’t rely on our mindreading skills, as mine are REALLY bad these days, due to various atmospheric considerations.
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I do appreciate your taking the time 🙂
(Off-Topic)
Yes , English is not my native 🙂
(Back-Topic)

2 Words + ALL variants I never use !! Why ??
I don’t believe in those !!
I don’t believe in their existence !!
Believers will use those words millions & more times !!
Would their existence be proven , fine ,
even then I will never accept & follow them !!
(Not now or in the future !!)
I would call it pure sadists (strong words) !!

Angry & anger ?? No !! Realism , yes !!

Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), september 18, 2008
 
To Charlemagne II:
“Even worse, in my opinion, is the fact that some show extreme ingratitude to the One who created us by never giving Him any thanks or tribute.”

That’s odd. My knowledge of Catholic beliefs are pretty shaky, but I was under the impression that God does not want or need our praise. The picture you’re painting of God looks to be quite the opposite. Are you implying that God needs our thanks and praise? That he desires it so much it becomes more important than doing good things? He’s starting to sound a little bit…dare I say it…vain.

“That is why so many atheists convert in old age or on their deathbed.”

I’d be interested in seeing your source for this information…but I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that you don’t have one.

To adstrinity:
“It’s probably echoed throughout this thread, but, doesn’t it depend on the athiest? This could be turned around, “Are Catholics “bad” people?””

Logically, you’d think so…but apparently there are some who hold the position that belief in God is a requirement of being a good person.

To CatsAndDogs:
“don’t rely on our mindreading skills, as mine are REALLY bad these days, due to various atmospheric considerations.”

…could it be because its happens to be raining…CATS AND DOGS???
 
ABello

That’s odd. My knowledge of Catholic beliefs are pretty shaky, but I was under the impression that God does not want or need our praise. The picture you’re painting of God looks to be quite the opposite. Are you implying that God needs our thanks and praise? That he desires it so much it becomes more important than doing good things? He’s starting to sound a little bit…dare I say it…vain.

I’m not sure if you’re just fighting what I said, or you never heard it right in the first place.

Anyway, what I meant to say, is that God **does not need **our praise and thanks. But God wants us to praise Him because **we need to praise and thank **Him. Is this concept so difficult to grasp? When a man and a woman fall in love, don’t they **need to praise **each other as an expression of their love? Don’t parents need to praise their children? Don’t children **need to praise **their parents? Isn’t praising and thanking and the expression of good will and love between any two people possible without the need to superimpose vanity as a condition of the exchange?
 
ABello

“That is why so many atheists convert in old age or on their deathbed.”

I’d be interested in seeing your source for this information…but I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that you don’t have one.

Do you mean has there been a scientific survey? I don’t think so!

My position is purely anecdotal, as any person’s position would have to be. I’m old enough to have seen some of my atheist/agnostic friends sweating for their salvation on their deathbeds. I’ve never heard the opposite of Christians, begging the priest to stay away as they lay dying.

It’s simply very human to hope at the end, even when you have denied hope all your life.
 
Charlemagne II:

“I’m not sure if you’re just fighting what I said, or you never heard it right in the first place.”

Nope, not fighting…I just don’t think you said it right in the first place. Given your clarification, I’ve understood this to mean that God does not need our praise, but we need to praise him just to feel good about ourselves. In my opinion, this has nothing to do with one’s capacity to be a good person. I can be a good person without praising my parents, God, your cat, or a teapot. So far, I don’t see where the connection is but if you believe that in order to be a good person, one needs to praise God, I’d be interested in hearing your reasoning.

“Do you mean has there been a scientific survey? I don’t think so!”

If there was one, that would be nice. In all honesty I just couldn’t let your comment about atheists converting on their deathbeds sit there without pointing out the obvious problem, which is that this is a baseless claim masquerading as something authoritative.
Just to throw this into perspective, it would be like if I said:
“The reason why so many Catholics convert to atheism is that it is purely natural that as one matures intellectually, logic takes over and God suffers the same fate as Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.”
 
Charlemagne_II said:
Anyway, what I meant to say, is that God **does not need **our praise and thanks. But God wants us to praise Him because **we need to praise and thank **Him. Is this concept so difficult to grasp?
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Give me proof of existence , and I believe you !!
But , it does not mean that I will follow you !!
When a man and a woman fall in love, don’t they **need to praise **each other as an expression of their love? Don’t parents need to praise their children? Don’t children **need to praise **their parents? Isn’t praising and thanking and the expression of good will and love between any two people possible without the need to superimpose vanity as a condition of the exchange?
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Love & thanks are 2 different things !!
Love & praise are 2 different things !!

I don’t believe in praying for something
you can’t prove it existance !!

Realism:
I going to a restaurant , instead to pay for the food ,
I will pray , how would end up this one ??

I agree:
Parents praise their children or kids praise their parents ,
that should be normal !!

I love my wife and I praise her love to me !!

I thank my wife she gives me her love & trust !!

Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), september 19, 2008
 
Jimmy_B said:
Are Atheists “good” people?

Is possible to be an Atheist, reject God and be a “good” person?

In other words, can one who reject’s God, truly be “nice” or be a “good” person”?

Do people who reject God go to Heaven?

Atheists do not believe in Heaven…do they?

“Good” people go to heaven…. right?

Do Atheist go to Heaven?

Your thoughts?
Click to expand...
At some point their atheism will interfere with their morality, and then, no, they can’t be ‘good’ people. As non-believers, they’re ‘empty vessels of humanity’, living meaningless lives which set a bad example and can hurt others who might seek to emulate them. As a teacher, I’m surrounded by atheistic coworkers, all of whom disappoint me in their personal views of life, the world and the human condition. They cause damage to their students indirectly, by teaching veiled nihilism to young adults, many of whom desperately need sound moral formation. I can’t say I endorse America’s public school system, after teaching in it now for four years. It distinctly lacks a moral dimension.
 
ABello

“The reason why so many Catholics convert to atheism is that it is purely natural that as one matures intellectually, logic takes over and God suffers the same fate as Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.”

Then I suppose that when these same people revert back to Catholicism before they die, as many do, you would have to conclude that they had seen the logical mistake of equating God with Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.
 
Laurent

Love & thanks are 2 different things !!
Love & praise are 2 different things !!

No, they are all bound together.
 
wanner47 said:
One of my favorite books is Jane of Lantern Hill by L.M. Montgomery. In that book, the character Andrew Stuart says, “If someone doesn’t like the Bible, there’s either something wrong with him or the way he was introduced to it.”

That’s how I feel about those who claim to be atheists. I think most of them are simply ignorant of the true nature of God, or have been introduced to it in such a way that they are rejecting a strawman and not God.

True, there are some atheists who, I think, know what they are rejecting, and more’s the pity.

But I think the vast majority aren’t malicious, just confused. And many do try to live good lives even if they don’t understand why, or have the wrong idea about why they’re doing so.
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I agree with this, and it reminds me strongly of my boss. He is a self-described atheist, but is very moral and ethical and strives to pass on those values to his own children. The impression I get from him is that he is rather horrified at how religious belief is often manifested in the world, and doesn’t understand how it can correlate with rational behavior. All three of his grad students are Catholic. We confuse him, as we are highly rational.
 
ABello
*
I can be a good person without praising my parents, God, your cat, or a teapot. So far, I don’t see where the connection is but if you believe that in order to be a good person, one needs to praise God, I’d be interested in hearing your reasoning.*

I have already given it. You are still fighting it. Let it sink in.

To ignore your parents as if they did not exist is the ultimate act of hatred toward the ones who gave you life.

To ignore God as if He does not exist is the ultimate act of hatred for the one who gave you life.

If you don’t get it this time, I won’t bother to explain it again. O.K.?
 
Charlemagne_II said:
Laurent LUG;4195136:
Love & thanks are 2 different things !!
Love & praise are 2 different things !!
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Laurent

No, they are all bound together.
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Praise love !!
Praised love !!
Love praised !!

Thank love !!
Thanks , love !!
Love , thanks !!
Charlemagne_II said:
To ignore God as if He does not exist is the ultimate act of hatred for the one who gave you life.
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I would you know that so/for sure ??
Charlemagne_II said:
Laurent LUG;4189031:
Can you give one full proof you/they are right ??
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I don’t think so, and especially if you are an atheist. However, even from the point of view of an atheist, the second commandment should appeal on the basis of common sense alone.
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So , you’re saying when you’re an atheist , you’re blind ??

The 3 first catholic commandments are unuseful
because the first one doesn’t even exist !!
Which makes commandment 8 a big problem !!

Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), september 19, 2008
 
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