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why_me
Guest
Exactly. It is all BS and that shows a lack of respect toward your mormon neighbors’ belief system. But then again, maybe they think your belief system is BS. No progress if we all think that we are all full of BS.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Take an extreme example, like Cargo cults. There are people who believe that cargo airplanes come from the gods and have ceremonies to summon the deliveries from the gods. Obviously, it’s BS. That doesn’t mean I don’t respect the right for people to believe such BS. Go for it. Worship airplanes, or believe Joseph Smith, just don’t expect that I’m going to view either as anything than what it is.
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Religio71
Guest
You don’t get it, and you’re avoiding the main topic, which is how the Quorum of the Twelve are the same as the original Quorum, which you claim your church restored.
And again, no matter what, the sex scandal was not related the theology. McConkie’s comments were. That is what we’re talking about. Catechisms are irrelevant. It’s so convenient, because you can just say “well that wasn’t official belief”, as is said for many beliefs, such as Adam/God. The difference is with Catholicism, while things like limbo, that are discussed and talked about at length, may not be official belief, they are doctrinally correct speculation.
So can you add anything to how the LDS Apostles are called in the same way as the original Apostles, how their office is the same and that they have the same power and authority, etc? Or will you bring up the sex abuse scandal again?
Thank you ParkerD for contributing to this debate.
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why_me
Guest
And likewise, someone can say: Take an extreme example, like Cargo cults. There are people who believe that cargo airplanes come from gods and have ceremonies to summon the deliveries from the gods. Obviously, it is BS. That doesn’t mean I don’t respect the right for people to believe such BS. Go for it. Worship airplanes, or believe the catholic church, just don’t expect that I’m going to view either as anything than what it is.
An atheist or dedicated protestant can take the above position. But it would not be very respectful to what you, yourself believe. See my point? Comparing the catholic church to a cargo cult would be very disrespectful to you and your beliefs.
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twopekinguys
Guest
See what Religio71 had to say. He/she is right on target with this.
Anytime you try and find a mistake with the Catholic Church, and it’s members, it is always the same thing. Sex abuse, and drinking, whether it has anything to do with the topic at hand or not. You are sounding more and more like a broken record, and in my opinion, have lost any type of credibility you may have had to address any statement or issue concerning the Catholic Church, or lds.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Yes whyme, but as someone (you) who claims to be Catholic, such relativism is just more BS. Which, is in fact a problem I had with being an atheist. Relativism is not Truth. At any rate, your agnosticism is showing.
I am not offended by comparisons to Catholicism. I understand people are at different places in their journey towards truth.
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why_me
Guest
Here is my point: let mormon apostles be apostles. So what? No harm done. Let mormons be mormons and let catholics be catholics. And let the world turn. Here is an example of adam/god:
en.fairmormon.org/Adam-God
Now of course the explanation will not fit your world view. But such is the way it is. Mormons have their way and catholics have their way. Such is life and its diversity.
I have no idea how the apostles were called in the good ol’ days. But the mormon way can make sense. Christ instituted 12 apostles who were commissioned with a job. Mormon apostles are also commissioned to do a certain job. The lds church has a seventy as did the early saints in the new testament. Not bad. Whether you agree with them or not, they are attempting to model the new testament.
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why_me
Guest
No, I am just throwing your words back at you. Having experience in both faiths I seek unity and not confrontation. Both faiths have wonderful traits and ways to live life. And in the end, both faiths attempt to bring people closer to god.
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Religio71
Guest
Ok, so your contribution is to let LDS apostles be apostles because it works for them. Thanks. I guess you also think Jesus shouldn’t have said to go out and preach the Gospel and baptize. We should just let everyone be what they are and let the world turn.
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Religio71
Guest
oh and i’ve read the FAIR wiki. You should try reading it. It continues the usual LDS theme of “it was a transcription error”, “someone else wrote it down”, “no proof he said it”.
Stephen168
New member
Because it is a bunch of random thoughts by its many faux apostles. Theologically, Mormonism is an irrational mess.
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twopekinguys
Guest
That does happen alot doesn’t it?
This is going to be off topic, but seeing that you were former LDS, possibly you can answer it.
How come none of the LDS doctrines can be found in the BofM? I’ve noticed from other threads, that some doctrines are in D&C, PoGP, etc. but none of them relate back to the BofM. The Catechism will refer back to the Bible chapter and verse for things, but I haven’t seen that with the LDS.
I would think that a relatively new religion, who their founder supposedly saw Jesus or God, would have something doctrinal to say, and would be contained in something that is supposed to be “another testament”.
Just wondering.
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why_me
Guest
First, most of what BY and Joseph Smith said was recorded down by notetakers. What to do? This is the way it was back then. I have no idea what was accurate and what isn’t accurate. However, what was recorded was put into book forms such as the Journal of Discourses which was published by the lds church.
We have no idea what the original apostles said on their journeys. I am sure that they said much that if recorded would be shocking. And what we have of Paul is very small indeed. I am sure that he said and did more. We just don’t know what he said or did because it was not all recorded.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
whyme, you are throwing nothing but your agnostic relativism.
Unity between Catholics and Mormons is only possible at a social action level.
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why_me
Guest
Mormons would probably claim that god is a living god and is in touch with his church. As such, the book of mormon and other scripture is not the end all. He continues to guide and speak to his church. In the lds church, the canon is writen in stone and for the catholics church the catechism is writen in stone. But for mormons, god will guide his church as it exists in the 21st century and this will include guidence on how to do life.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Yet, you accept the testimony of David Whitmer, which is also found only in second-hand testimony.
What do you think is missing?
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RebeccaJ
Guest
I suggest you study the papal encyclicals.
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why_me
Guest
Perhaps. But both faiths live by a similiar moral code. Many protestant sects do not live up to mormon and catholic standards.
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why_me
Guest
I read the vatican newspaper. But many catholics do not. Mormons have their ways and catholics have their ways. And in the end, both ways make the world a better place.
vatican.va/news_services/or/or_eng/index.html
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RebeccaJ
Guest
Which means, what? I know people who adhere to stricter codes than mormons or Catholics.
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